The Massa Sucks Thread *OF COURSE THERE ARE SPOILERS*

But look at what you just said, Massa was with Ferrari and had Shumi as a teammate. Sure, Heikki was with Renault - a very good team that produced 2 WCs - but he was teamed up with Alonso who likely didn't share his setup info. And even if he did, it didn't help Fisi when he was there. And even if Schumi didn't share his setup info with him, at least Massa could have learned how to stop others from being faster by running into them.


Sorry - Ha Ha Ha - that was a cheap shot.

 

Heikki was never with Alonso in Renault.

 

The other thing we have to keep in mind - and I really think this belief transcends anti or Pro Massa feelings - is that Massa is good when he's on pole and out in front, but has shown to be much less impressive when he's not up front.

If a situation arises where Ferrari are qualifying further back in the field, Massa is probably not the guy they want to put their WDC hopes on - but that's just my thought on the matter. Let us not forget that IIRC this is the first time that Massa has led Kimi in the WDC this year, is it not? And Kimi has had 3 retirements this year, one of which would have likely netted him a win and the other likely a P3 or P4 and the other some points. Massa had one not-my-fault issue and 2 retirements from his mistakes.

I'm only saying that it would be IMO premature to call this Massas chance at a WDC. Massa is either hot or cold. If you look at his races this year, he either seems to get P1 or P2, or he's waaaay back out of the points or crashes out. If Ferrari expects to be able to qualify in P1, then Massa has a serious shot. If they have to fight for it, Kimis more consistent points finishes will probably make a better bid for the championship.

 

IMO neither Kimi nor Massa would be a clear #1 pick right now.

The thing is, it's not like these two are consistently finishing in P1/P2 next to each other. Kimi is more consistently finishing in the points, whereas Massa is either red hot or ice cold. If, for arguments sake, SF picked Massa as their #1 driver... it's not likely there would be many situations where Kimi would be ahead of Massa and could benefit Felipe by letting him pass. More likely, either Massa is way down the field and Kimi can't help him, or Kimi is a few positions back and can't do anything to help Massa.

#1/#2 driver only works when you can let one pass the other. It doesn't really work if the drivers are seperated by even one car - and that has been the case for the vast majority of this season.

I think SF would be more wise to let them keep racing for now. The best thing a #2 driver can do is to make sure he takes 2nd place to ensure the guy(s) they are trying to beat will always have a minimum 4 point delta from the #1 driver.

Frankly, neither Kimi nor Massa are consistent enough to be able to consistently grab P2 and keep guys like Lewis in P3 or worse.

 

A Mclaren Fan! Yikes!!! There goes the neighborhood!

 

You are absolutely correct. In my zeal to be humorous I made a critical error. My apologies.

Ha Ha. I do like McLaren. But I don't hate Ferrari. In fact, I have a tremendous amount of respect for the Scuderia. Anyone with any sense of racing heritage must give Ferrari its due.

 

You mean Hungary. Agree with you 100% tho. Everyone seems to twist facts their own way. When Massa was MS teammate, people said he sucked, because it is all about competing against your teammate in equal machinery. When LH finished the season tied with his WDC-teammate (thanks to very obvious preferential treatment) he was proclaimed the second coming of Christ. This year McLarens (arguably) are the class of the field. Yet Massa spanks on a regular basis both the "son of God "(at least the british Gods that is) and his WDC teammate. And everyone knows that Ferrari is the team where the two cars are as equal as it gets. So someone please explain to me how does MASSA suck.

 

Massa does not suck. Anyone who sincerely says or thinks that doesn't really understand racing. But your obvious and unreasonable rancor towards Lewis Hamilton is no more well-founded or palatable. Sorry, but it just sounds like sour grapes to me. The guy did things that rookies just aren't supposed to do. Then he followed it up with 4 wins and the current WDC lead with only 6 races left. And to be honest, it is Massa's own team that has treated him like a second-class citizen by failing to deny all of the Alonso/Vettel to Ferrari rumors.

Lewis can't walk on water, but at least he can drive in the rain.
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massa has only "spanked" lewis for two races. get real if hamilton sucked that much why is he leading the wdc? i also doubt mclaren would give a rookie preferential treatment, especially over a wdc driver of alonso's caliber, but they also are human and their bias is what i believe made alonso feel so alone last year. quite frankly if i had my own team and needed to pick a lead driver i'd take hamilton over any other guy on the grid right now.

 

Preferential treatment? Are you forgetting this??
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It was just an example. I have never discredited LH for the exceptional skills he demonstrates on track. However the biased judgments of many, both on here and in the press, are just repulsive and IMO don't help his popularity at all.
Saying that he is the next Senna and the next Schumi half way through last season outdoes in ridiculousness only the statements of Massa being nothing more than a mediocre midfielder. People compare the times when Massa came to Ferrari (MS was the reigning WDC) with the times when LH came to McLaren (FA was the reigningWDC). But let not forget the fact that when Massa came to Ferrari, they were definitely NOT the best car on the grid and we are talking about the most decorated driver ever being his teammate. MS does not just hold some records. He has SHATTERED all of them. Then people are giving LH as example when in fact he came at McLaren at a moment when they were in their best form in a decade after he has been groomed for that specific team his whole life. And I am not saying that this makes him any less skilled or that it was a bad thing to happen to him (or the sport) but the press and all the hurting British fans should have let him be for a season or two and after he proved himself beyond the doubt of lucky timing, then and only then everyone could say how great he MAY be when he wins his 5 titles

 

Apparently you are forgetting what caused it. Remind me who started the whole mess. I know it was a Hamilton, just not shure Sr. or Jr.

 

Touche. I agree with this. There was more than a tad bit of "irrational exhuberance" on the part of the British press.

 

Forza Massa!

 

I don't know why people here keep twisting what others say.
So when I say that LH can NOT YET be called the next great one that equals Lewis sucks?
And when I say that it is ridiculous to call Massa a mediocre midfielder that equals Massa is the best in F1 now?
Please stop kidding yourself about last year. The Hungary fiasco was caused by LH disobeying the team strategy. Than he was put back on track hanging from a crane. Then Kubica was penalized for simply racing him, yet there was no penalty when he caused a crash behind a safety car. What preferential treatment?!
This year he HAS shown LH the way. Lewis passed him when he had brake problems and could not fight and it was done in a nasty manner where LH pushed Massa out of the track, like a rich little brat that rubs his new fancy bike in the poor kids face. Not exactly the way Massa blew him (together with his teammate!) on the outside of the first corner in Hungary. In Spain it was obvious what LH's intentions were at the start of the race just by the way he positioned his car, but he came short when it counted. That my friends is a spanking.
If you like you can look at it from the purely statistical way. They both have 4 wins under their belt, even after the Hungary engine blow out. This still means Massa spanked Lewis so far this season. Of course there are 6 more races and as far as I am concerned Kubica has just as much chance to win it all as the other 3 contenders. So let's wait and see what did Bernie put in the script.

 

Maybe it was Jeff Archuleta!
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Ha Ha, you have got to be kidding right, please tell me your not serious, do you Ever stop to think, and forget to start again.

 

When do you think it is appropriate to call someone the next great one? Are you suggesting he can be called that only if and when he becomes the next great one? If so you have a problem with the language. "The next great one" is effectively a prediction of the future and so can only be used before the event. And everyone is entitled to have a guess at (or even suggest that they know) what will happen in the future, whether you like their prediction or not.

I think you also have a problem with statistics. They have the same number of wins under their belts, LH is ahead in points and that means FM "spanked" him? There are no explanations on a statistical record, 'what ifs' and 'maybes' don't count. You're effectively crediting Massa with a win that he didn't get and that's not allowed in statistics.

 

Ah it appears not..

 

It seems to me that you discredit LH at every possible opportunity. Here's something from another of your posts:

I'm pretty certain no one, either here or in the British press, used the words "second coming of Christ" or "son of God". Those are YOUR words designed to belittle LH and/or those who support him. And you have the nerve to suggest others (but not of course yourself) are biased!

 

+10000000.

 

+1
Also a great post post from the big D ..

 

So, in conclusion, we can now all say that Massa doesn't suck. Moderators, please close this negative thread. Thanks.

 

Just put Hamilton and Button in the Ferraris and I am happy... Massa is inconsistent...just like me...thats why I dont drive F1.

 

Me too!

Well, my being slow, old, and too big to fit in the car might have a little to do with it too.