Hamilton and Nigel Mansell.

I don't really think drivers can be compared to each other in anything other than success. Comparing multi-WDCs to Hamilton (who might have 1 WDC at the end of this year) is dumb.

 

I think Hamilton is unique in and of himself, which is why I think he has a bright future.

 

I would never compare Hamilton to Mansell, I think Hamilton is more like a Rene Arnoux, or even (don't laugh) his attitude is more like Lauda's was when he came back in 1983, or Piquet's mid-career.

As I said in another thread, I can see Mansell trying to push his car across the finish line, I don't see Hamilton doing that... or even getting his hands dirty.

 

Can you see ANY of today's drivers trying to push the car over the line?

 

Hand up who thinks the stewards would let Lewis get away with doing that....

 

But Lewis will get the championship next week In terms of "later in his career" Its will be only later in his career that Lewis Hamilton will have won his 8th World Championship

 

Comparing drivers on the basis of the number of WDCs they have is objective but tells us little about them other than the number of WDCs they have won! There certainly isn't a direct relationship between the number of WDCs won and driving skill/ability - some drivers of modest ability (relatively speaking) have been WDC while others of outstanding ability have never won it.

Comparing drivers on the basis of other criteria is more subjective but possible - things like car control, driving in the wet, overtaking, team work, temperament, etc, etc, can all be assessed (and argued about!).

It is certainly dumb to compare Hamilton with a multi-WDC and conclude Hamilton is an inferior driver because he has fewer WDCs. Consider all the other factors and if he doesn't measure up THEN deem him to be inferior.

 

Next week we'll see whether Hamilton is just like Mansell.

 

even if Hamilton becomes a champion next week, i don't think he can be compared to the league of Senna/MS. both did wonders in small teams, and terrible cars. Hamilton, for one, is lucky to start his career in a top team.

 

So by that reckoning no one can be classed as any good unless they prove themselves in lesser teams. So putting aside that as a rookie he matched 2 x WC Alonso in the same car last year, and that he easily exceeded HK in the same car this year. And all the universal acclaim that he has received this year by ex-world champs including the attention of MS. Even though he may (who the hell knows) in the future exceed MS WC record wins (god knows he has the talent and will mature every season).
What you are saying is that LH will never be as good as Senna or MS because he has never raced for a back of the grid team. Dont make sense to me im afraid.

 

Not logical Brian. Yes, LH was lucky to get a drive with one of the best teams. No, he hasn't done wonders in a small team with terrible cars. But all you can conclude from that is that MS and AS achieved much in those circumstances and Hamilton hasn't had any opportunity to do so, it doesn't make LH an inferior driver to either of the others.

 

well, lets put it this way :

i really respect what Hamilton has achieved at this point of time, given his age and experience. but what i'm trying to say, there's no point comparing him to the likes of MS/Senna/etc. different eras aside, my point was, Hammi is in a very competitive team/car. for example, i would be really excited to see what he can do in a Renault, for example, or Toyota. would he pull an MS to drive like how MS won a few races back in 1996? or how Senna drove in a Lotus?

thats my whole point actually. sorry for the misunderstanding

 

I get ya

 

I must disagree with you. I agree with Brian´s original concept. Hamilton was extrodinarily lucky to start his F1 career as the adopted son of Ron Dennis and driving one of the two best cars on the grid in the last two years. Neither Senna nor Schumacher had that good fortune. Yet both of them started winning in secondary cars.

Not to say that Hamilton would not do the same if in a secondary chassis, but since that has not happened, there is no way at this time to logically compare Hamilton to Senna or Schumacher. No, that does not make him inferior, just not yet at a place to compare him to any other multiple WDC´s.

If you want to compare, do so with a Kubica. What if Kubica was in a similar winning chassis as the McLaren, suited to his driving style, would he out perform Hamilton? We just do not know, so how does anyone compare Hamilton to proven multiple WDC´s? It is a bit silly.

Frankly, I don´t think you do Hamilton justice to compare him to anyone from the past as of yet. And even with the forgone conclusion that he wins the WDC next week, that still does not put him in the ranks of Senna or Schumacher. Or even a Prost or Lauda. When he wins multiple WDC´s, then Lewis Hamilton earns his own place in F1 history. Maybe then you can compare.

I still reserve my personal opinion of Hamilton, and Massa, Kovalainen, Kubica, and Vettel for that matter, until next year when aero is basically gone, slicks return, and hopefully there will be real racing. Then we will see who really shines as a future F1 star. And I also hope we will see if Alonso and Raikkonen deserve their status.

 

Not a fair comparison. Hami couldn't wear Nigel's jock strap at this junture in Hami's career. Nigel is still Britain's best F1 driver of all time with over 30 wins. His duals with Senna were legendary. And who could ever forget the outside pass of Senna at Hungry in I think 90 or 91. He was Enzo's last hand picked driver before he passed away. And won his first race with Ferrari, which only a few can claim. He also set the record for winning the first 5 races of a season, which has since been matched by Schumi. He would have won two other WDCs, but mechanical failures indidated him. And who could forget when he gave his rival Senna a ride to the pits on the cool off lap after Senna's car had let him down. He was a true sportsman, and ignored his team mate Piquet's negative comments about him while they drove together by refusing to engage in such childish banter. Even after his 1992 WDC season, when Frank Williams was an ass to him and attempted to sign other drivers behind his back, he refused to accept a last minute offer by Williams as a matter of principle after his 1992 WDC season. I always thought that Nige had a lot of class. Hami has a long way to go to fill those shoes!

 

You compare teams mates!! ....work it out , Im sick of posting it!!.

 

Don't be suprised if one day they are comparing the likes of Senna, Schu, Nigel, Alonso and others to none other than Lewis Hamilton

G

 

If you want to say that LH is the best driver currently, that would be no problem. I don't think that you can make good comparisons to Mansell, Senna, Schumacher or Fangio. Too many things are different. I think Fangio's five WDCs were fantastic because most drivers of that era wouldn't live long enough to try for that many. Was Schmacher better than Senna? It would have been nice to see, but the world changed in May of 1994. Today we would never see anyone give his car to a team mate mid race like happened with Fangio to help secure a WDC. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but there is no way to compare numbers and say someone from a different era is better or worse that today.

 

You really can't compare Hamilton to anyone just yet. He's in a postion no one else has ever been in before. He and Mansell don't really compare. Hamilton isn't as gritty as Mansell was. Mansell was probably the last guy you wanted to see behind you with a couple of laps to go for position. LH is a brilliant overtaker as well but it seems to be only when he is in position to win. Mansell was like that regardless of what position it was for.

 

+1
Yep

 

+1 and you need almost 2 sec a lap to cleanly overtake. The front ends are so loose in the draft at low speeds. Its an art in itself to over take or wait for a mistake on braking etc. LH is an aggressive driver no matter and does make the effort, yet we have seen him and other good/top drivers languish in the back on occasion, with problems, or they are just so far back it doesnt matter what you do, and even if you close on someone you just cant make the pass stick, ie Kimi on Kubica at Fuji.

Passing is difficult even on tracks where the drivers say passing is possible.

 

All of what you have said is true. But this bit is so wrong. LH has shown that he can fight and overtake from the back in both GP2 and F1. So i dont see how you came to that conclusion.