Camera Experts (Need help) - Canon

I like mine, though I often wish it had IS.

 

+1 upgraded from a D70 to the D90 and love it!

 

i'll have to disagree. don't know about the noise on a 50d. i guess the 1d mklll with 21mp is just not good enough for you.

 

I've had one for years. it's my main walk around. no brainer for the price. i'd also recommend the 50mm 1.8 as a relatively inexpensive lens that performs.

 

Just got it last week, but it has to go back as soon as my 17-40 gets here, it has a huge piece of dust in the front element. Its always nice to have more megapixels but its not NEEDED, agree to disagree I guess, let me know if you decide to sell your 5D sometime next year.

 

21 MP on a full frame sensor is very different then 15 MP on a cropped sensor. Megapixels don't matter until you start blowing things up poster size.

 

I agree 100% Pro photographers have stated they do not need more then 12-15 MP for the average photograph. Unless you want to make a huge picture you don't need that many MP. Nikon just announced the D3X which is 24.5 or so MP and it only goes upto ISO 1600 as opposed to the 12 MP D3 which can go upto ISO 6400.

 

While I certainly agree that small increases like from say 8-10 make little difference, I have to wonder what people mean when they say "megapixels don't matter."

How many is enough? If megapixelS don't matter, are you saying that one megapixel is sufficient?

 

I think the general consensus is that 6-8 MPs are plenty for 90% of what people want to do. Especially with P&S and lower-end DSLRs (ie D40x/D60) the companies use it as purely a marketing tool.

 

Almost like saying horsepower doesn't matter. And you can't wreck a camera.

 

Yes.
Of course a camera with 1 MP will be horrible, but the only reason for upgrading cameras shouldn't be megapixels, unless you have like a Nikon D1.

 

I'll be happy if you say "the only reason for upgrading cameras shouldn't be megapixels"

 

MP don't matter as much as Nikon and Canon want us to believe. Look at the XSi... its got 12.2 MP just like the Nikon D3. The Nikon D3 is a professional camera and the XSi is an entry level camera. So my point is, you dont need 12 MP when your just starting out. If you are upgrading a camera just because you want more MP you aren't upgrading for the right reason. Unless of course you have 5MP and you want to upgrade to 10MP because you are blowing images up. MP do matter, but they only matter in certain situations, right now Canon and Nikon have entered a MP war which is ridiculous, and as I stated earlier professional photographers have stated that they do not need more then 12MP. If a photographer is looking to blow up an image larger then 20"X 30" then yes the number of MP matter and in that case you might as well get a medium format camera.

So in a nutshell, don't upgrade for the MP reason only, unless you have a ridiculously low amount. And second, Canon and Nikon have entered this endless war with MP which will eventually get out of hand. The freaking Canon G10 has 15 MP! Its a point and shoot camera, with 15MP. Are you kidding me? And people are amazed at how you can cram so many MP into the camera on such a small sensor. I have people come into the camera store I work at all the time and buy the camera for the 15MP's. People don't really understand what that means when you cram 15MP onto a tiny little sensor. Its like buying a car with 800HP and going the speed limit all the time. Why buy all that HP when your not going to use it?

 

I don't think Nikon or Canon care what we believe, outside of their ability to give it to us. They make high res cameras because consumers want them, not the other way around.

So does Sony.

And PhaseOne. And Hassleblad.

To me, it seems that the idea of a 'ridiculously low amount' discounts the notion that pixel count doesn't matter.

If you are upgrading simply to get a higher-res camera, you're probably not buying yourself much. But it's rare that you'll go to a higher res camera ONLY get a higher pixel count out of the deal.

In and of itself the statement "megapixels don't matter" is bunk, though the idea behind it has merit.

 

Nikon and Canon don't care what we believe? We are the consumer, if they don't care what we believe then who will buy their products? I bet if we say we don't want anything over 15MP and we (the consumer) don't buy any camera over 15MP... Canon and Nikon will not produce a camera over 15MP. Consumers want high res camera's and a lot of MP because we have come to believe that the more MP the better. Just like we go for the latest and greatest with everything, but in essence, we aren't using the extra MP. For example the Canon G9 and G10, I have so many customers who have tried to re sell their Canon
G9 to get the extra 3 or so MP. Thats ridiculous to me.

 

That was poorly stated on my part. Yes, they care what we believe since they need to know what to deliver. What I meant is I don't think they are directing our wishes, rather they are producing what we want.

Exactly. That's what I meant. I was merely responding to "MP don't matter as much as Nikon and Canon want us to believe". On the contrary, I think that they'd rather we believe that lower pixel counts are superior, because that would decrease their production and development cost.

If that's their only reason, I agree: ridiculous. But maybe they want better AF, a faster shutter, a better flash, a higher-resolution LCD, etc..


In any case, I agree in principle that the pixel count is hardly the most important feature of a digital camera. However, I can't agree to discount it as irrelevant.

 

That last statement sums it up... Well said. Now having said all this, hopefully the 24.5 D3X will help push down the prices of the D3 a little bit so I can finally dream about owning one.

 

Yah, that D3 is amazing, but I wouldn't count on a price drop in the new camera market You may be able to pick up a used copy at dgrin.

I'm hoping for a 5d2 myself.

 

X2

I just have a hard just have a hard time as a hobbyist justifying that much of a camera. I'd rather spend the extra money and add a few more lenses to my collection. (I should add, "at this point of my life," since I am still a student)

If I was making money with the camera, it would be a different story.

 

How much do you guys think the 5D Mk1 will drop by summer time? I am thinking $1k for a good condition used with around 10k actuations, think I am far off?

 

please cite references for this. also, i don't know any pro photags that are happy with only being able to take "the average photograph". and of course you and marranelloboy have not addressed cropping. Maybe you never crop. My best selling pic is a crop and i can only go up to about 11x17 with it. Man i wish i had that 1d then. all megapixels. before you guys try to shift the argument, my statements apply to this post "MEGAPIXELS DONT MATTER, NEVER EVER will they ever matter. Unless you are planning to print a billboard 6MP is plenty" This is ridiculous and i don't want any newbs going away from this discussion with that impression. These statements are also a little too strident:

"I think the general consensus is that 6-8 MPs are plenty for 90% of what people want to do"

"Pro photographers have stated they do not need more then 12-15 MP for the average photograph"

"professional photographers have stated that they do not need more then 12MP"

"Megapixels don't matter until you start blowing things up poster size"

"Also, megapixels don't matter. Unless you are printing pictures that are as big as your wall."

"Unless you are planning to print a billboard 6MP is plenty"

"you just can't compare the 2 because Nikon will be sharper 95% of the time"

"Also never buy from a chain camera store they give horrible prices its always 20% higher with them"

"but the only reason for upgrading cameras shouldn't be megapixels, unless you have like a Nikon D1". WTF?

then there is the guy that says never buy off ebay and two others that say they got great deals on ebay. whatever. I'm glad i'm not looking for advice on here.

Listen, i know some of you guys are kids and you are excited about your hobby. Please be a little less sure of yourself. Making blanket statements like megapixels don't ever matter or that nikon is sharper 95% of the time are stupid. It lowers your credibility. Just tone it back a little. I can easily refute every quote above.

so is it poster size or as big as your wall or billboard size? i'm thinking of getting a new camera.

 

I was trying to give some insight to the OP about a first DSLR, I got ahead of myself with my statement but I will stand behind my 6-8MP is enough statement. As a first time DSLR user you should be concerned with a lot before the amount of MP, I just don't see how it matters to a beginner. Everything I have seen from Nikon and Canon is that the Nikons have an edge with IQ, obviously a personal opinion, most of which this thread is based on. I will hold by my statement with buying from a Ritz-like store everything is more expensive. You have me on cropping, I have never come across a picture where I need to crop so that is why I never thought about that side of MPs.

 

I would never say, never buy off ebay (i've done my fair share of bidding/selling)... but normally extend the typical "buyer beware" with the site.

I would however not buy into those super inclusive packages that throw in bags, tripods, filters etc. In my own experience, they ARE usually junk. The tripod is wobbly, the mini tripod wont hold a camera with a decent sized lens on it and the bags are usually not very protective.

Instead save a small amount of money and put it towards a better flash (i.e. 430ex or 580ex II), a sturdier tripod with a better head (i.e. manfrotto) and a more protective bag (i.e. Crumpler 7 Million Dollar Home - one of favorite purchases )

Ebay tactics are very deceptive to the unknowing bidder and it seems like that is the standard target audience. It's like all of the Nintendo Wii listings that advertise "5-games," when it merely includes the demo "wii sports" disk that is included with any new Wii.

Caveat Emptor.

 

I'm surprised Ken Rockwell hasn't yet been quoted concerning the MP Myth.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/mpmyth.htm