my brother inlaws 1912 Silver ghost rebodied in 1960s by Eric Rainsford.Does that make it a replicar? Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
In the FIA case they are essentialy manufacturing brand new cars, in many instances by the same constructors. The point here is that many find any replica or recreation offensive. Yet many others providing it does not use something precious and irreplacaeble in the process have no issue. Further in the case of the FIA these recreations, new builds or whatever you want to call them are accepted on the track along with period builds, this means that recreations are no marque orphans. The snobbery against recreations seems to be strongest in the USA and parts of Europe and most heavily seen amongst ferrari circles. Most jag clubs seem to love a good D or Ctype recreation after all it is still a Jag. Bugatti seem even more openmineded accepting period builds with different motors and the Pursang and other recreations, as well as with no chassis plate but a few original bits.
I think the 428 blocks are still pretty plentiful, and nearly all the orig build cars were 428's. For a 427 block there are at least two companies making them now in either aluminum or iron. So realisticaly one can make a brand new 60's car. The small blocks are all pretty similar to the 5.0 block which is still produced.
It seems where we might be going with this topic is the following. 1. Cutting up good or restorable period cars to make recreations is offensive to the art of cars and something a true enthusiast finds unacceptable,(definitions of restorable etc are still being debated) what if the motor and tranny still existed but the car was long gone? 2. Replicas/recreations provided they meet certain build standards and did not destroy something percious are perfectly acceptable and even desirable. 3. So then we have acceptable standards for recreations, and acceptance within marque circles, the differentiator being that period builds have history and provenance which give then far greater financial and historic value. Accepting such standards or rules within marque circles would lead to the following. Stopping of torching older cars, because they would still not be accepted, proper well built recreations to satisfy a clear market, and the financial incentive, due to market size, to reproduce the critical comnponants such as blocks heads transmission cases brakes etc. Kinda what happens with Cobras anyway, and arguably thses recreations make the old build more desirable not less. Plus if you think about it recreations get rid of the fakers because everyone will assume if they see one it is a recreation.
Wrong again. Building a replica of a more desirable car is stealing money from the owners of original cars. There are no free lunches.
I'm not sure I see how that works. Building a replica of a more desirable car is certainly co-opting the cultural equity of the car. If a replica builder, even a reputable high-quality builder like the one featured here, was building cars of an original and unique design, they would never be worth what a knock-off GTO would be. The GTO has a forty five year head start in cultural cache, and that's what he's co-opting. But I can't see how that affects the current owners. Does the existence of a replica depress the value of real cars? (I don't think so) Does the existence of a replica create an opportunity for someone who would have bought a real one to buy a replica? (perhaps, but given the preposterous price differential, I don't think so) It's certainly stealing snobbery from the owners of original cars. If that sort of thing bothers you. I can't count the number of times I was asked "Is it real?" when I was driving my Speedster. A simple "Yep." was all it took. Didn't bother me.
nicely put. what have you been smoking ??? i take it that you do recall that several of the replicas (some of the better ones in fact) have been built for owners of the real thing look i along with lots of people on here would love a GTO or 250 TR it aint gonna happen - £15M+ is not a sum of money that many people have floating around as ready cash - even people you would consider to be very wealthy arent generally as well off as that. so most of us cant have a original one i dont want a kit - they normally look wrong, they dont sound right, they dont feel or drive right etc etc so what would i like - well ideally id like the GTO or TR but without the stupid price tag id like it to look right, feel right, sound right, drive right etc, oh and ideally id like it to be titled as a ferrari so a recreation built to as close to original specs as possible is ideal in my eyes. if that involves taking an old knackered way lesser model and using its engine etc then so be it bottom line - id be ecstatic, and well if you didnt like my new toy then i wouldnt be heartbroken - in fact i wouldnt be bothered at all. one other thing. several people have used a ridiculous arguement that if you cant afford one then you dont deserve one - sorry but money doesnt instantly make someone worthy, often in fact far from it.
down here when I raced Mustangs, the mexican blocks were drying up.True the they do reproduce blocks and heads for the smaller engines..
This is based upon the disturbing premise that anyone is entitled to get what they want. If you wonder where that leads, open the business/economy pages of any newspaper for the last few months. What's wrong with admiring something but not having it for your very own self ? The culture of anything is debased by those who resort to ersatz methods. Shoddy McMansions have diminished the prevalence of good, modest architecture and turned large parts of the US into an aesthetic wasteland. Fake GTOs, SWBs and TRs have adulterated the essence of the marque. Not looking down on anyone who does this; we're all human and have short lives and tall aspirations. Just saddened by the effect on things I hold important.
I accept these rules. I'm just trying to save the old original cars. If somebody wants to be a poseur wanker in a completely new (in everyway) GTO replica good on him ... Pete
As a owner / builder of a "Bitsa" Mercedes Benz 300SL Gullwing using entirely NOS and restored Gullwing parts I would like to see FIA specify some sort of definition of these so called recreations and replicas; maybe a graded level of accuracy and or percentage of correct parts and accuracy of assembly. This could be useful in separating the "wheat from the chaff" so to speak. I also disagree with the thought that I am stealing from the owners of "Real Cars" as my car includes many pieces of "real cars" that were destroyed and abandoned preveously.
What have you been smoking ??? Stop dreaming and wake up. The fake GTOs are just kit cars; most of them are wrong in almost every aspect and you would only be cheating yourself and wasting a real car in the process. I know you would not be bothered; those who do stupid things rarely are! I always feel sorry for people who cannot find real beauty and real things in life to make them happy and opt for lousy fakes. If you can't afford a real Ferrari, stay away. There are millions of wonderful real cars out there for every wallet! If yours isn't going to be a GTO, get over it!
I don't think that's accurate or fair. Admittedly, I've seen a couple lousy fakes. But I've also seen a couple brilliant re-creations that would fool the best experts here. Functionally, they are every bit a continuation and anything but a "kit car." (Given the cost of a real GTO, at least one owner of an original has had another one built to actually use and enjoy.) If you step back from the issue, you'll see it is beautifully crafted steel, aluminum and rubber, after all. Any notion of "real" vs. "fake" in such a case is a human projection of meaning rather than a reflection of how it looks, feels and drives. For those who put function or experiential quality above "real", this is a viable choice. Hell, even if I could afford an original one, I wouldn't put $10+ million on a public road! But I get the downside too. Is it unfortunate than an unloved Ferrari was sacrificed for the parts? Yeah, certainly. But that's the collateral cost of obscenely priced cars that share parts with much less expensive versions: Supply and demand stings sometimes.
Heh, fooling the best experts here does not take much (I am not counting the lurkers). Most replicas - excluding maybe 2 or 3 GTOs and 1 or 2 cars of other models - can be identified as fakes in five seconds. A quick look at a foggy cell phone pic is what it usually takes. That's how "exact" they are... As said earlier: these days GTOs come in many shapes and sizes!
what should one do if you only have the running geat of a 250 model car? And you do not want to sell it to another owner who has a shell.
If shell and chassis fit together as of being of the same type, put it together, sell it and buy the style you want. Otherwise, you're a stubborn fool. Why would you be so attached to a certain drivetrain, if there is no shell? If it were off of a car your father bought new, you'd want to restore it to as close to original you could get it. If the running gear is from any significant 250, you'd have a shell made according to the original one and still get Classiche to certify it as the real car, putting you in the money. If not, the drivetrain does not have any significant value over another, and can be replaced, so there wouldn't be a reason to not sell it and get the car you want. Now, if the drivetrain is out of an otherwise totalled 'donor model', go right ahead and build something you like. I know I would.
