Introduction/mechanical refurb question

mkeith · Mar 25, 2009

First, the obligatory introduction. I am an Alfa Romeo mechanic in TX. Mostly, I work for one particular Alfa/Fiat collector, & he is looking to expand into other cars. One on the shopping list is a Dino; so I've been lurking here in order to do some research on the cars. There is a Dino for sale locally that has been in indoor storage for about 20 years. As such it's fair to say that the car will require complete mechanical refurbishing.

I realize that this is a bit of a loaded question, but I need a rough ballpark figure of what it would take to mechanically refurbish such a car. I've done plenty such work on Alfas; so I have a good grasp on what's involved. However, I've never so much as looked at a Ferrari with a wrench in my hand.

I also realize that it would probably be better to buy a fully sorted car. What is holding our interest in this car is the fact that it is local, & it is a good color (dark blue), which, according to the Dino Register, is correct for the car.

The car is a '72 GT, LHD European model with A/C. Here are the assumptions that I am currently operating under:

Cosmetic needs will be minimal.
The engine & transaxle will only require new gaskets & seals.
All ancillary mechanical systems (ignition, fuel, brakes, cooling, suspension, etc) will need to be completely refurbished.

There are no illusions of being in the car for less than, or even right at market value when it's done. I just want to make a fair recommendation as to what should be offered for such a car considering its needs. Thanks in advance for any input.

Mike in TX

synchro · Mar 25, 2009

mkeith said: ↑

First, the obligatory introduction. I am an Alfa Romeo mechanic in TX. Mostly, I work for one particular Alfa/Fiat collector, & he is looking to expand into other cars. One on the shopping list is a Dino; so I've been lurking here in order to do some research on the cars. There is a Dino for sale locally that has been in indoor storage for about 20 years. As such it's fair to say that the car will require complete mechanical refurbishing.

I realize that this is a bit of a loaded question, but I need a rough ballpark figure of what it would take to mechanically refurbish such a car. I've done plenty such work on Alfas; so I have a good grasp on what's involved. However, I've never so much as looked at a Ferrari with a wrench in my hand.

I also realize that it would probably be better to buy a fully sorted car. What is holding our interest in this car is the fact that it is local, & it is a good color (dark blue), which, according to the Dino Register, is correct for the car.

The car is a '72 GT, LHD European model with A/C. Here are the assumptions that I am currently operating under:

Cosmetic needs will be minimal.
The engine & transaxle will only require new gaskets & seals.
All ancillary mechanical systems (ignition, fuel, brakes, cooling, suspension, etc) will need to be completely refurbished.

There are no illusions of being in the car for less than, or even right at market value when it's done. I just want to make a fair recommendation as to what should be offered for such a car considering its needs. Thanks in advance for any input.

Mike in TX
Click to expand...

Welcome to the Dino forum.

This will be a great project for you as the Dino is quite simple, but some access points are a little tight, so I hope you have small hands or are left handed (it seems to help).

I'm going to skirt the issue of "what should we pay for such a car?" and jump into the projects that you may envision.
Doing a "quick and dirty, not having seen the car" I'm imagining a total cost for parts around $6000.00 plus your labor.
There will always be unforseen expenses that you didn't allude to (wheel bearings, radiator thermo-switch, thermostat, etc) and I'm not addressing those here; only the areas which you have mentioned:

Ignition - This area and 2nd gear synchros are weakness of Dinos. Change the ignition system out for a modern box (MSD, Perma-tune, etc), coil, wires, plugs; parts should be under $500 if you with MSD

Fuel - change the pump, the 3 fuel lines, and the filter; parts under $200 Carburettor rebuuild kit under $200

Brakes - rebuilding is easy as they are from ATE / Porsche 911, bUT if you decide to go concours and replate everything then about $1000 as the rears are a bit of work as you'll need to drill out some freeze plugs to remove the interior mechanisms prior to replating. Here is a guy, Bernd Buschen, who can do it correctly and has ALL the parts:
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=203092

Cooling - change the 6 hoses near the engine, thermostat, the two long hoses to the radiator and flush/pressure check the radiator; parts under $400

Note #1: I also recommend removing/replacing the 3 coolant pipes near the engine for Stainless steel ones
$200 from England (Non-A/C car)
http://www.superformance.co.uk/a-246/cooling.htm
or
$420 from Germany (correct tubes for a car with A/C)
http://www.dinoparts.de/content.php?sID=8105605d70d7201470096bb75bbfe82a&tpl=shop&mode=details&mID=-342&fID=2&kID=348&pID=128&cur=EUR&lng=en&page=1

Note #2: If you need the overflow tank the correct ones are over $400
http://www.superformance.co.uk/a-246/cooling.htm

Suspension - change the suspension bushings, front upper/lower ball joints, tie rod ends, rear hub bushes; parts under $1200;
Suspension bushes, ball joints and tie rod ends from Jacques at the Maserati Source
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=310129809548

Rear Hub bushes from Superformance or Dino parts.de
$350 from England
http://www.superformance.co.uk/a-246/suspension.htm
$650 from Germany
http://www.dinoparts.de/content.php?sID=8105605d70d7201470096bb75bbfe82a&tpl=shop&mode=details&mID=-3&fID=2&kID=93&pID=1094&cur=EUR&lng=en&page=1

If you need shocks then Rutlands has NOS for $1200
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350049735406

Steering rack would be under $700
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=192248

Hope this helps,

Scott

celestialcoop · Mar 26, 2009

Scott.Mac said: ↑

Welcome to the Dino forum.

Brakes - rebuilding is easy as they are from ATE / Porsche 911, bUT if you decide to go concours and replate everything then about $1000 as the rears are a bit of work as you'll need to drill out some freeze plugs to remove the interior mechanisms prior to replating. Here is a guy, Bernd Buschen, who can do it correctly and has ALL the parts:
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=203092

Hope this helps,

Scott
Click to expand...

To expand on & amend Scott's comment: For ATE-equipped cars, the front calipers are 911SC ("A" caliper); the rears are 914-6. At least, that's my understanding.

'a whole slew of good info here, Mike. As soon as you can, start reading everything in the 206/246 Forum. When you open the forum, go to the "Display Options" at the bottom of the page and toggle to "From The Beginning," then hit the "Show Threads" button. It'll take several days of dedicated reading to absorb it all, but will definitely bring you up to speed on the bella macchina that is Dino! Also, find great advice in "Corbani's Corner" for maintaining the true 'Daily-Driver Dino.'

Welcome,
Coop

mkeith · Mar 26, 2009

Thanks for all the input. I'm sure there will be some surprises, but that gives me a decent handle on what I'm dealing with. I've been looking over the Superformance web site. A lot of parts prices actually aren't that bad, but there are some that remind me that this is no Alfa.

Are there any readily accessible labor guides for Ferraris? I can fly by the seat of my pants on a lot of stuff, but it would be nice to have some sort of baseline so that I know I am billing him fairly. In other words, some things are going to take me a lot longer than an experienced Ferrari tech, & I don't want to create a situation where my customer is financing my learning curve.

champtc · Mar 26, 2009

Well- I can tell u this about Superformance...you will get competitive prices, attention to detail & huge technical help as well. They will also fish around for hard stuff to get and find it for you. Ron really knows the Dinos & he has helped me a ton. You will see OMGJON's emails here too...take a look at his www.dinorestoration .com it goes through the whole thing step by step. He has a separate part for the engine & mechanicals. Jim Selevan knows these cars like the back of his hand and is always helpful too. There are a lot of people here that can give solid advice. I think actually when you are done you can help all of US!! Good luck!!

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