New KERS question | FerrariChat

New KERS question

Discussion in 'F1' started by Gilles27, Apr 7, 2009.

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  1. Gilles27

    Gilles27 F1 World Champ

    Mar 16, 2002
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    Jack
    I haven't had this explained about KERS--how does it re-convert the stored energy into horsepower? The way I understand, heat energy generated under braking is captured, converted to electricity and stored in a battery. That energy is called upon at the press of a button to provide a boost of 80hp. How is the electricity converted into combustion horsepower? And please remember to use your best "dumb guy" language:)
     
  2. mousecatcher

    mousecatcher Formula 3

    Dec 18, 2007
    2,116
    san mateo, ca
    It's not converted into combustion horsepower, it's applied from a motor through a separate/ancillary drive mechanism to the wheels.

    first page of google results for 'kers' has all the info, easily understandable (conceptually).

    http://www.motorauthority.com/brake-energy-regeneration-in-f1-by-2009.html is a funny result though, i like when they say

    hahaha ... electrical KERS systems actually increase the environmental impact! the company the article is about develops mechanical KERS systems though, so kudos to them.
     
  3. mousecatcher

    mousecatcher Formula 3

    Dec 18, 2007
    2,116
    san mateo, ca
    oh, that part of your understanding is incorrect as well. heat energy is not captured, kinetic energy is captured. there are systems that can capture heat energy but they are very inefficient and not really suitable for automotive use.
     
  4. Gilles27

    Gilles27 F1 World Champ

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    Jack
    I misunderstood when an article mentioned the heat from the brakes. But the hard thing for a non-engineer like myself to understand is how a smaller set of motors/gears/flywheels (however it's configured) can insert power into the cars drivetrain. Is it because the additional "torsional" input temporarily lessens the strain on the engine?
     
  5. Far Out

    Far Out F1 Veteran

    Feb 18, 2007
    9,768
    Stuttgart, Germany
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    Florian
    The electric motor/generator (basically any electric motor can act as a generator and vice versa) is directly on the drive shaft. If it is switched on, its torque is added to the engine torque. It's really not that difficult to understand. Imagine you try to move a huge hand wheel. You know, the kind you somehow see in chemical factories or at the valves of oil pipelines. If someone else joins you and you both try to turn it, the torque the second guy applies to the shaft of the wheel is added to yours. Same goes for the electric motor that adds its torque to the torque of the engine.
     
  6. tuttebenne

    tuttebenne F1 Rookie

    Mar 26, 2003
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    Bay Shore, NY
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    Andy
    +1

    Bob Varsha's explanation was confusing because he focused on braking energy which doesn't appear to be true. Steve Matchett's RPM segment was informative. The focus is energy wasted under braking or deceleration that they are capturing. So the revs the motor is making during a braking event are harnessed as they engage the motor/generator at braking time (with a clutch or some sort?). The motor/generator takes these revs and makes electrical energy out of it - and its stored in batteries or something like batteries just like the alternator/battery of a road car. Then the motor/generator must be disengaged from the crankshaft so there is no drag during unassisted (by KERS) acceleration or braking. When the pilot wants to use the stored electrical energy he pushes a button on the steering wheel. The motor/generator is converted elecrically into an electric motor and the stored energy is used to spin/assist the crankshaft as it rotates under acceleration. I wonder how much KERS is actually also helping the cars slow down more quickly?
     
  7. bigodino

    bigodino F1 World Champ
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    Apr 29, 2004
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    Peter den Biggelaar
    Does this all explain the sudden changes in RPM that were audible during onboard videos of for example Massa and Alonso? Does it mean they are allowed more revs temporarily? (I thought the maximum revs were restricted to 18.000 rpm)
     
  8. tuttebenne

    tuttebenne F1 Rookie

    Mar 26, 2003
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    Andy
    Those rev changes might be the result of the coupling mechanism either coming on or going off? I noticed that too. I hadn't heard that KERS entitles the car to more RPM I would suspect the original upper limit still stands but maybe someone more knowledgable has the "inside skinny" on that.
     
  9. Gilles27

    Gilles27 F1 World Champ

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    Jack
    That explains it better--thanks!
     

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