A Thread dedicated on how Bernie Ecclestone and Max Mosley destroyed F1!!

Can't add much to what you said, but you'd think that since they've extracted their hundreds of millions and grabbed about as much power as possible, that they might turn their attentions to actually doing something good for the sport. But, no.....If ever there were two people who have no clue about when it's time to leave, it would have to be BeMax.

 

I agree that they have done serious damage if not even killed the sport for a while. It seems as if though Bernie has aquired the Napolean syndrome. He's always had it but it is really showing now. Maybe he is decended from a troll? LOL

 

To me, both of them come from a very different era of business. In the 60's, 70's and 80's, their methods were pretty common. But times have changed drastically and their brand of hardball business tactic is absolutely unacceptable in the multi-party marketing-driven environment in which they operate today.

As an outsider and a fan (and a considerably younger businessman), I find it shocking how incompetent their mis-management appears to be. But there's a generational element to it. They didn't work to find consensus back then and they definitely didn't listen to their customers in any methodical way. That's why the fans are screaming bloody murder while they turn a deaf ear. They honestly don't hear it.

Just seems clear these two are from by-gone era.

 

because Max is smarter

 

It is not necessarily generational it is personality driven. While the profit motive is a good thing, it can and often does get short circuited by greed. What lots of business owners don't get (and this applies to any genertion) is that if you try to maximize short term profits, you can end up running the business into the ground. This applies to any business from GE on down to a neighborhood dry cleaners. You need to build and keep happy a customer base with a good product and the money will continue to flow. As GM painfully learned, it's the product stupid!!!

Bernie has been concentrating on the "deals" and not the product. As we often see at this level, the ego's of the people making the deals gets in the way and they feel it's a "mano on mano" kind of thing and if they don't get what they think is a super deal and beat somebody it doesn't happen. In the meantime the business goes into the tank because the product is crap.

I am surprised that the people who he sold most of the rights to aren't involved more in the running of the series and getting rid of Bernie. I don't know much about what they got out of the deal, but if the cash cow dies, they are the ones holding the bag.

 

I think I've been pretty fair in bashing F1 people when I feel they deserve it... I've bashed Luca, Todt, Dennis, Williams, Max and Bernie all on occasion, so I don't *think* I am biased too much....

In this case, you are absolutely right - BUT - Bernie is in a tough spot. The deal he worked out with CVC was to sell most of his stake, but still retain the "chairman" position. He is pretty much up against a wall.. he HAD to increase F1 revenues, and to do that, he acted like a businessman and went for the money. Selling out tracks like Indy and Montreal in favor of Dubai. It most certainly is short-sighted but I am not sure what else he can do. He very slickly sold out to CVC but kept the decision-maker role.

I have said before, and it is largely true, that Bernie is the one who best represents the fans - *overall*. Sure, his decisions are bad for some fans (like US fans) but largely good for the sport in general, if you consider more fans to be good for the sport. He has made some mis-steps but they are coming home to roost now.

I think Bernie is definitely contain-able. Max is not. Max is purely in it for himself. Andreas posted a great article before from BusinessF1 where it detailed a $300mm payment from Bernie to Max... bribe money, basically... that was paid in return for picking up F1 TV rights for a song... $3mm a year. Those rights are "worth" $500mm a year, so it was an amazingly fortuitous deal for Bernie.

Max treats F1 like his own personal playground... changing rules on a whim. Dictating terms to multi-billion dollar corporations.

F1 can survive with Bernie... because it's all about the money. With Max, it's all about the power... F1 cannot survive with him in his current role.

No worries... Max is going to get the short end of the stick this time, IMO. All will be well in time

 

Makes sense. Not that counts for much in the world of F1

 

Mr. E is not all that bad. Before he took control, the racetracks set practise times etc. After, the sessions became set for Friday and Saturday (excepting Monaco), the teams were able to work on better schedules, less all-nighters etc. we travelled in better comfort (we had our own Japan Air 747 for example one year) using chartered planes. We finished the race, headed for the airport and were home often to watch it on the Beeb that night. Mr. E has on several occasions taken care of some personal matters for many people working for teams and the organisers. Without Mr. E owners like frank Williams would not be multi millionaires. Sure he's a control freak and done some deals to upset people but overall not to destroy Grand prix racing.

Mosely, was supposed to be the great defender for teams after Balestre did his Napoleonic stint, but has gone the same route IMO.

I've spent a lot of years in the game, just a grunt but having seen the FIA/FOCA battle first hand in 81, don't expect Ferrari to roll everybody this time either.

 

I've followed F-1 for over 40 years. Been to almost all the traditional races etc... Know - known a lot of F-1 people. Universally everybody had - has respect for Mr.E. I think with out him F-1 would have been the poorer for it. but there was a fork in the F-1 road back in the early to mid 90's that I think Mr. E led everybody down the wrong way... Money is good, but you dont have to have all of it all the time... he and the teams forgot about the fans, the real fans, the drivers got super rich and god like, and so did Bernie... Williams et all do owe their fortunes to Ecclestone, to a degree, but Ecclestone owes respect for the sport back and that is what has been lacking! you could see it all along how fans really never counted in the sport after say 1990... TV and ad revenue was - is King. Now a revolt is taking place due to the economy, and heads will roll... in the aftermath the fans will contnue to be short changed, the teams will remain aristocratic and F-1 will go on in some guise... just hope its worth watching!

Vive Balestre!!!! or as the T shirts said .... Balestre is good for you!

 

Has anyone seen the new web site F1-Dead?