Looks like this car is still for sale, what do you guys think is a fair value for it? Just curious, I was thinking about checking it out. Thanks
Many have grown over the years to like the diablo series. But my favorite is the se30(um... I have my reasons). I view the diablo se30 as the ultimate and raciest diablo of the series. The departure for the se30 apart from any diablo is the fact of its purpose. Consider it the GT2 of the Lamborghini diablo lineup. Built with the intent to be put for racing purposes, almost every aspect of the diablo was purposefully reworked to be race ready. As with any race car, the enemy is weight. And with the se30, it was no different. On the exterior, lightweight windows were installed and converted the se30 to have the same philosophy of the countach.... which poses the question of "What windows?" The motor from the standard diablo windows were eliminated, reducing further weight. Wheels are made of magnesium by O.Z to lower the weight over the standard 3 piece wheels. In fact, the se30 wheels are even lighter than the 6.0 magnesium wheel due to their higher magnesium content. The brake hubs are purposefully drilled to reduce unsprung weight further. As with the transmission section. Various auxiliary parts have been redesign to shed less weight. The engine covers and intake manifolds are recasted in lighter weight alloys to reduce further weight. The front bumper has been revised to have a longer nose with eye lash features similar to the miura along with an emblem that reputed as been sourced from miura emblem. The rear engine lid has been redesigned to have better aero shape and also tie in with the miura's rear design. Interior wise, the se30 was dressed to impress, specifically to a gentleman racer. Majority of the interior has been redone in dry carbon. Dry carbon is a material used in F1 and achieves lighter weight than a standard wet carbon. The cost for dry carbon is twice as expensive as regular wet carbon... Even the one piece seats normally used on the diablo are now done in dry carbon. Virtually all the interior pieces are done in this material apart from dash.. Inside, the car is suprisingly accomodating and larger than expected( I am 5'7 ..smile.gif) There are virtually no crazy electronics per say on this vehicle. Handling wise, the se30 provide a level of adjustments that fit very well with the overall character of the vehicle. One feature that impresses is the in cockpit antiroll bar adjustment feature. This allowed the se30 to be "tuned" in terms of handling by a flick of a lever. Another feature was the availability of a traction control system which cuts the power to the wheels under wet conditions. The brakes on the car do leave more to be desired. However, given the weight of the vehicle and the feel of the brakes, spirited driving is sufficient. However, it would be best to upgrade the brembo brakes used by Mclaren F1 if there is a need for more braking performance. Performance wise, the engine of the se30 is rated at 525 hp, benefiting from the reworked cams different valves. While the engine is only slightly more powerful than a standard diablo, the slashing of overall weight guarantees a great power/weight combo that keeps acceleration brisk. Driving impressions: The vehicle starts up with no drama and keeps at around 1200-1500 rpm to warm up. Once that cycle is completed, the engine cycles downward on rpms. To enter the vehicle, open the doors, which are fairly lighweight compared to a standard diablo, put your butt on the sills, and swing in, lifting your arse in the process. Once you are in, you are in, you will notice the complete absence of big bulky airbag steering wheel. It is adorned by a nice racing wheel with a cover that holds a emblem in place. Once you fire it up, you will notice how quiet it is. This is probably due to the big loaf of metallic muffler sitting in the back. Once this exhaust has been replaced however, you are greeting with a wonderful roar. Rear vision to any mid engine lambo has been poor, and this diablo stays true to that tradition. The miura inspired engine lid does a wonderful job of letting you see rear traffic through the eyes of max headroom with those blind type shades. At night , you have to be very careful as the combination of car height and engine lid design creates a wonderful blinding brightness when there is a car in back of you. Good thing the rear view mirror flips up to lessen this effect. The gear shift is stiff, especially when pushing down for reverse. Backing up is an utter nighmare and a chore that prompts the driver to rather circle around the block than to back up. But hey, no one rarely backs up on a race car.... Once you have gotten over the reverse hurdle, you've now got another hurdle. Getting the car out of the driveway or exit ramp. On the Niagra fall type ramps, be prepared to drive into oncoming entering traffic and hogging the space until you can almost parallel slide out of the ramp. In some cases, you need to reverse the car in order to provide the adequate "angle of attack" You almost have to go back to school for geometry to perform exit procedures on this car... In many cases, you can not drive the car fast on streets due to the fact you will be playing dip lotto. If you hit the street dip jackpot, prepare to replace the bumper. If you get a 5 out of 6 numbers, the rubber lip needs to go... YES its that low. But once you are on a level road or highway, driving karma awaits you. The power steering feels light but nicely weighted. The steering feel of this car is comparable to a good condom. Not too desensitizing and not too thin with too much feel... Just right and comfortable that makes you want more. The gear shift on the other hand demands a firm hand. But at the same time, somehow shifted properly promotes confidence. This is very similar in feel to the countach. Going through some nice twisties elevate your senses as you can feel the road and nimbleness of the car all come into play. The se30 really creates the man/machine bond that so many sports car manufacturers strive for. This lightness of the vehicle certain has done much to elevate this sensation. This sensation is of course carried over to the acceleration. The car seems to love revs. It almost feels like it wants to eg you on to go more and more until you realize you need to move to the next gear. When accelerating, the car doesnt feel refined. It feels brutish, uncivilized and so visceral that it feels faster than even the later generation diablos. But when looking at the speedo, you would be slightly disappointed your not going as fast it seems.... It feels almost as though it is like a roller coaster ride, all the thrills but still working within safety parameters. The powerband almost feel camish as by 4000 rpm, it changes into a banshee like scream with a crescendo only to be matched again in another gear. The driving experience is truly grin inducing and a great satisfying experience. It is perhaps not the fastest diablo of the series, but it wins hands down in terms of delivering an experience not easily forgotten. So if you are good in geometry and you can live with the quirks of the vehicle, the low ride height, and seeking to have a great thrilling experience this side of getting a racing diablo, the se30 is it. *********************************************************************************************** It would be interesting to know who wrote this. A factual correction: valves were indeed different from standard Diablo (and indeed slightly different from Europe to USA) in terms of sizing and material, but oddly the cams were no different at all from standard Diablo spec (we measured them when we had our engine apart). There has been much lore as to what was different, what was not different, and Lamborghini contributed to the mystery by claiming (blatantly lying) to the import authorities that the USA cars had the normal USA Diablo engine (this to escape the expense of emissions-certifying an entire new engine). This is quickly dispelled by taking it apart and examining it, but that's another story. I would disagree on the impression of speed vs. reality - in fact my experience is the exact opposite. The car is so stable and smooth getting to speed, and the seatbacks are raked back so sharply, that you don't realize how fast you are going until you look at the speedo or notice how easily other cars get punted backwards when you drop a gear or two. Anyone wishing to see that for themselves should come by sometime.... I don't have tested data on hand, but my personal experience and impression is that a properly set up SE30 will match or better any other Diablo model (expect the braking - about which the author is dead on) - so that's another point I would differ on with the author. With regard to the braking, my experience and that of other I have spoken with puts the SE30 brakes at noticeably better than pre-Brembo Diablos, but not as good as later Brambo cars. That said, there is so much less weight to stop that it's not as big a difference in actual performance as you might expect. Another item of minor note - though the doors are indeed lighter, the weight one "feels" while opening it is more a function of the charge pressure in the door strut - ask any Countach owner who has gone through the strut losing it's charge then replacing it. Everything else I think I would completely agree with. The author eloquently captures the spirit of the car. You really notice the lack of soundproofing and general "cush" to the cockpit. Also the lighter weight components in the driveline result in a normal SE30 vibration and roughness when you're below the cams that unfamiliar drivers assume is a running problem (no extra weight in the flywheel, crank, and pistons to dampen that out) - it's perfectly normal, and a sign of the nature of the car. This coupled with no extra insluation or soundproofing produces some annoying "personality" as the carbon bits of the different interior pieces rub and make noise sometimes at cruise. We should get Victorghini's thoughts....... $.02 SL -----Original Message----- From: Fellippe Galletta <[email protected]> To: Steve Lefferts <[email protected]>; Nick Thompson <[email protected]>; Heriberto Guzman <[email protected]>; LS <[email protected]>; Charles Perry <[email protected]>; Vu Hoang <[email protected]> Sent: Tue, Jul 7, 2009 1:26 am Subject: Diablo SE30 ownership impressions.... An owner's review of a US spec SE30.... Lefferts, anything you'd like to add? FG
I did not get that impression. A friend braked hard with his 99VT, and my eyeballs almost flew out. I never got that same feeling with the SE 30. Have you noticed how the engine rpm's go up and down and back up (the cycle repeats itself), while it is at idle ? The power-steering is horrible - it is overboosted. True dat, the car is fast on the top end !
The 99 had the last version of the Brembo brakes which Steve agreed were better. If the rpms are are going up and down, then there is something wrong with the car.......That is not normal on any Diablo. Steering feel is completely subjective. I have driven more than one SE30 and a 91 without any power steering, and, respectfully, the SE30 steering is to my liking.
This is at idle. It is only a few rpms. However, the movement up and down is noticeable. afaik, Vahe had the same issue with his SE 30. It was later modified to correct this issue. Perhaps someone else with a stock SE 30, is aware of this issue ? Agreed Some people do not like manual steering.
I as well love the steering on my SE30 Also I find the small surge up and down...or hunting as I call it is quite normal at idle and I do have that on several cars that have been correctly tuned by Steve at www.drivenexotics.com
The guy who wrote that is qvpower over on Lambo-P O W E R in the owners impressions forums. There is an open thread from his reviews of this. I think he may also be a member here.....
I took delivery of the last new SE to be sold by Lamborghini USA (or so they said, it really doesn't matter). I drove it about 3,000 miles. Here are my own personal thoughts: Pluses. - Limited numbered series lightweight version of the Diablo that made it a factory Speciale. - Styling specially for this variant with dedicated components making this car the most aggressive and sporty looking Diablo to date. Very cool, loved the styling, still do. - Faster than a normal Diablo in acceleration (at that time circa 1996) in a rolling start as I found out. Minuses. - The interior fit & finish looked like it was put together by me and 2 guys drinking beers on a Sunday afternoon. Besides that, when you drove the car (as Lefferts has noted) the so-called "dry" carbon fibre provided a symphony of godawful creaking & squeaking. Great. - I'm all for the boy-racer "look", but man, those 'mail-slot' tiny windows were annoying! Between an almost impossible-to-twist opening knob and the size of that window, it wasnt exactly an endearing attribute. Fortunately the AC was quite good. I know that the owner of 010 couldn't stand those windows and sent the doors back to Sant Agata and had them replaced with normal ones. Good for him. - The 'hunting' of the revs was a problem. I spoke to the dealer, I spoke to Valentino at the factory. Long story short it was an engine management issue that couldn't be cured without extensive modification which I didn't care to do. I don't care how anyone rationalizes this, but for me, waiting at a traffic light with the revs sounding like an out-of-tune hypercar in need of a tune-up was just lame, and it really detracted from the overall experience. I'm sure some might not care, but I did, and that's what mattered. - The design of the front bumper-spoiler seems as if the design department never conferred with the road test department and vice versa. The 'overhang' is the deepest of any car Ive owned including several F40s (which I replaced the SE30 with, by the way). In fact, the overhang made the car impossible to place in certain situations in spite of aggressive angling, without permanent damage to the front lip. I have not seen an SE30 without that unit damaged. It was enough of a problem to make me think twice about driving the car, and thats not a good thing. I lived with the minuses for a couple years. I kept the car immaculate and when someone made me an offer I could not refuse, I said goodbye without regrets. I still admire SE30s though, but I prefer to do so from afar.
You have not seen my 1994 SE30 #15 in red...have put almost 1200 miles on it...and the front end is just fine..but then again I will concede the roads in South Cali are worse than here and not designed for these types of cars.. Mine...its priced high as I dont want to part with it, but the figure I have it at...will take it away from me.
Completely disagree. Actually I think that the interior of the SE is one of the Lambos with the best finish. Besides, I think it is both the exterior and interior what makes the SE unique, especially with the alcantara. Completely different design from the standard Diablo. You won't see this on the current Lambos, all the special edition versions nowadays have an almost identical looking interior to the standard car. And the small windows. How can anyone really find this annoying. I mean, it's a Lamborghini, a sportscar that does over 300km/h, what do you expect? It to be comfortable? If comfort is important for you than the SE is definitely not the right car for you in the first place. Like I told in the other thread, imo the only way the SE could have been improved is by getting rid of the radio and a/c as well.
The Diablo, is a very big car on both the inside and outside. I do understand, most people will enjoy the large interior and power-steering. The 67-89 L supercars, feel much more compact and flickable. At the same time, I also missed the handbuilt feel, passion, and flaws, of the previous two L supercars. I agree with you, that it would have been a good idea, for the factory to trash both the radio and a.c. In the U.S., you are forced to accept factory overboosted power-steering, which felt like you were behind a PSP - especially when compared to the Miura and Countach non-p.s. cars. That is why you bring 3x large beach towels for the two seats and transmission tunnel. It also helps, if you bring a Camelback canteen filled with ice-water. With that, you are good to go.
i personally like the alcantara euro interior very much it is one of the more interesting diablo interior to me about the small window....well ,as a countach owner i cannot say the small window is always a plus...but it looks cool and "racer" so not so important to me as long as the air con worcks fine about the radio: i completely agree with you on this: no radio on SE30, may be the roll bar instead but the A-C ....the A-C Jonas i'd really need it is one thing is very important to have on a car with a V12 engine cms behind your derriere with a 5x3 inches window only, at least in Italy, California, etc... imagine to drive the car in 32°C summer with an hot engine behind for an hour when you would come out you would really not smell good neither look good covered in sweat.....
I can offer a response in 2 areas: None of the USA cars had the Alcantara finish, and perhaps it is this finish in the Eu cars that make it appealing. As for the quality of the interior of my USA car, Im speaking from the standpoint of an owner, not an admirer - it was the worst interior of any contemporary sports car I have ever owned. As I said, that was my observation. There were other things I liked about the car, but, not everything. Also regarding the doors, you ask how can anyone find this annoying. Well, the owner of 010 found it annoying enough to remove the doors and ship them back to the factory at HUGE expense to have them retrofitted. At the time I owned my SE30, I knew another gentleman who owned one. He hated the doors also. So that makes 3 so far. It is one thing if it a real racing car with Plexiglas sliding windows for the racetrack. This is a road car! It is what it is, and those are my thoughts as I said, from the viewpoint of an owner, not an admirer. If you love those doors, good for you! I didn't...
Joe you're so right about the road test department not getting a phone call from the design staff !!! It does look cool, though. Also - with respect to the engine management and comments by Valentino: I am now becoming much more aware of just how much money in time and engineering resources have to go into engine management to really wring all those little bugs out, and how far short some limited production cars fall because they don't have the resources of bigger manufacturers. I haven't had the hunting problem others have mentioned (except for an uncontrollable dive toward fishing nets for some reason) but there are lots of little idiosyncrasies that I now know are just programming shortfalls in the original ECU's. Want an extremely well developed and race bred car? Buy a Porsche. I still love the SE30 to death, flaws and all. Joe - the F40 is an absolute monster....can you give us the quick-and-dirty of how the SE30 stacks up to it all the way around?
I agree with this as well.. On mine at least, I am very comy...has way more "wiggle" room than the standard Diablos..mine does not creek or crack at all..the A/C is a must for me and it works fine..I do have the radio, but cant recall the last time Ihad it on as I live the sound of this motor, somuch different than the other cars I have...I dont have alcantera, as the US Cars had leather..but love it the same...it is truly one of my all time favorite cars.
A few corrections here...I think maybe you owned the WORST of the 25 USA cars made...I can tell you that the two I currently own #8 Purple and #15 Red..there fit and finish is outstanding IMO. I find them with no creeks at all..as a matter of fact I find the fit/finish on my Red one superior to the fit and finish on my 2001 #19 SE that has nothing but creeks and the dash leather already shirnks..and it is 7 YEARS NEWER!! I know that there was a Purple SE that had its interior CF "painted" to a shinny finish...in the thought of keeping the CF in good condition..HOG WASH...it ruined the look and the intent of the car..the CF would have outlasted the life of the previous owner with out the "aftermarket" paint work. There is another Purple SE currently in the USA for sale that has had it's interior changed to the Euro style Alcantera, done with non OEM product and by a non-authorized Lamborghini facility. IMO, this as well has reduced the value and collectability of a TRUE USA SE30 car as well. As far as the Yellow SE30 with Glass windows...it was his choice..BUT he did not pay for it..it was contigent upon the sale of the car to him at the time he bought it from the Dealer..so they bore the cost in an attempt to complete a sale, that at that time was "under priced" and IMO under valued car..again IMO has ruined the value and collectability of what the car was intended..but it is not my car and so it is not of my concern..all that matters is the current owner is happy with it. I think JOE, you as well would agree that it dimisses the value and the collectability...just as if any of these cosmetic changes were made to a "God forbid" Miura..???
Steve: You know me - I tell it like it is. All cars have their flaws the SE included, and it is most productive to the uninitiated to tell it like it is. Look, the SE30 is one of the most Supercool-looking Lamborghinis ever made, with plenty of good attributes. But it also has plenty of flaws as I stated. Of course some people are dispassionate and balanced in their views about these things, but also I fully expect some enthusiasts or some that own them to not see anything negative at all - a hallmark of the enthusiast! I love the SE among Diablos, but Im realistic about what it offers. I can tell you this: I really enjoyed looking at it! Steve the F40 really is at another performance level. You get the sense they designed a racing car for occasional street use. Im not easily impressed, and this car impresses me. But I will refrain from saying it is better in any department, just different. The flaws are that the bucket seats are not easy to climb in and out of, and the ground clearance is not much better than the SE. The interior is very spartan, but it is so intended, provision being made for only the things you need to go extremely fast. On full boost I dont think there is another automotive experience like it, then again you'll have to pay a lot more than the price of an SE for one.
Not really. Any Miura that has been modified by the factory is noted as unique and accepted as special.
LOL Just the answer I expected... Hey lets go get a Miura SV and tear out the Leather from the factory and re-install NON OEM Alcantera look a like material and call it good!! Then lets take a Muria SVJ, take out the OEM side windows, increase its weight and make it like any other Miura SV...that should be good as well... AND NOPE not one of these changes will effect the value of the car..HELL we can call it ONE OFF and increase its value!!
Well, let's remember that in the early nineties, Lambos were mostly still hand-made cars.....unlike today. That means that no two are the same. We should not generalize about all SE30s based on one bad one. Maybe the guys putting Joe's together really were wasted that day! The fact is that just like Miuras and Countachs, every one is a little different, and the quality of its build depended on the attention and care that the workers who put it together applied to the job that day. Most SE30s are very well build, but some could be dogs, just like some SV are dogs and some are excellent, right from the factory. This was especially true in the engines, where the cam timing often was wrong right from the factory!, as Steve and others can tell you. So, it is too bad Joe had a bad one, but many of us have had really good ones, and that is why so many of us are so loyal and amazed by them.
I drove an SE 30 last week and can say that compared to the 91 Diablo I am more familiar with it was a much nicer experience. To me a very well sorted car. One of the best driving experiences I have had! I have also seen and sat in the Alcantara car in the U.S and I do not believe for one second that it is a second rate job. The seats are terrific, the headliner and dash outstanding and the wheel wells were done to a very high specification. How does anyone know that car was not OEM? And if not, boy they did a good job.
Roy, you're not being serious. These aren't even valid comparisons. I am speaking of a modification performed during or shortly after the production period upon a new or relatively new car by the FACTORY. 010's doors were modified by the factory, according to what the owner tells me. I was just being honest by sharing my plus & minus experience with the car in an objective manner.
