Operation: Red Flag - Have you participated?

I saw this IMAX film/documentary a while back and thought it was pretty interesting from civilian perspective about what goes into training and collaboration across different nations. Of course, this film is just for the masses so what I'm really curious about is if anyone here ever participated in this event at any capacity? Would love to read some stories if you've got the time and wouldn't mind sharing them.

In case anyone hasn't seen the film, you can watch it here. It's about ~48 minutes.
http://www.hulu.com/watch/24197/fighter-pilot-operation-red-flag

 

The movie is great I have seen it at the IMAX at the USAF Museum in Dayton, OH

As for participating at Red Flag my father participated in a couple of them in the mid 70's. I have been to a few Red flag's as invited media to take photos unfortunately we never got the opportunity to travel out to the range to see some of the ground attack exercises.

 

You saw it in the right way. IMAX are usually amazing as it is and this was done very well. Was your father a pilot or part of the crew/officers? Did he have any interesting stories?

Shame about not seeing the range exercises.

 

He was involved with the Maint. Squadrons. About the most interesting story he told was about an F-15 coming back as a convertible when the canopy blew off in flight. The end result was shaken pilot and a lot of finger pointing by the ground crews.

 

Yikes...

 

A couple opportunities but have passed on it so far, getting briefed to death by WICcans isn't my idea of a good time.

 

Flew in several during the early days. Let me so some thinking. Still owe a few war stories before those.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

Flew as a Flight Surgeon in the back of a Red Air F-15B out of Indian Springs in 1987. We had deployed to the aux field in the middle of nowhere from Tyndall;
4v4 F-15 v F18 DACT. My goodness! My first sortie was learning about bandit "nose authority". The Hornet may not have legs but that damn thing could point.

I remember the mass brief.
"Ok guys, don't fly into the box"

 

Ok Mark, you kinda lost me on this one and I'll take the bait. I know you're not actually referring to the broom-riders so I'm guessing it's an acronym from the following list:
WIC Women, Infants and Children (public health program) Don't think so but would be comical
WIC Warfighting Integration Center (US Air Force) Most likely?
WIC Warning Information Correlation Hmm, nope
WIC Wartime Identification Code Possible
WIC Weapons Instructor Course Possible
WIC Web Information Center Nope
WIC Welfare and Institutions Code (California) Nope, not it.

Ready when you are!

That of course leaves a very interesting visual of the big 15 trying to outmaneuver an 18. Kind of like a Corvette and Smart car jockying for that lone parking spot. One can get there faster but the other is so much more cartoonish.

Any near misses with 8 planes chasing tail? Anyone know when the last time the US actually got into a dogfight like this?

 

That's the one, they will talk tactics at you until you slit your wrists.

 

restricted airspace ?


I guess this was just before the F-117 information, was released by USAF ?



I remember walking into the 4450th CCTS (A-7 unit) parachute shop at Nellis, and asking for stealth patches (before the A.F. released details on the airplane). They looked at me kind of strange.

The rafsob A-7 pilots were trained by the Tucson ANG. We knew something was up, when a pilot who had completed A-7 RTU training a few months before with Tucson, crashed a strange aircraft in the desert. At the time, I was a member of the Tucson ANG.

 

Got it. Makes more sense now. Thanks

 

Was the 117 crashed near Nellis or Tucson/Sonoran desert? I'm guessing you were based at DMAFB?

 

While in the Guard, we were tasked with air-refueling Red Flag for a couple of weeks. As a co-pilot, I was delegated the glamourous duties of listening to all the radio frequencies and off-loading the gas. The PIC's job was to "monitor" LOL. Except for the one mission when our auto-pilot was on the blink. Then he managed a..."You can fly this mission" . 4 hrs of refueling w/ no auto-pilot.

Real nice guy! LOL

(no, they really were, great group of guys to fly with and to learn from...)

 

Never a time when fighters weren't lined up for gas. They began hollerin' for it as soon as we took off. Great training for anyone involved on that operation, in any capacity. Definately a "wild west" type of atmosphere.

 

Funny stuff David. I imagine the non-US forces have their own refueling planes or are you guys tasked with supplying them too?

 

I don't know. I'm assuming there's no "good guy, bad guy" refuelers, but whether it's "structured" that way, I never thought to even ask.

From my vantage point, I couldn't tell the good guys from the bad. They all look alike to a green 2nd Lt. who'd sling gas to anyone who asked!

(Guess I missed that part of the briefing..maybe I should have asked? )

 

Tucson ANG

The crash was somewhere in the S.W. If I were to guess, it would be somewhere in Nevada.

 

I guess if it's a multi-national exercise then it makes sense to cross train for the pilots and maybe not so much for the fuelers? I suppose it depends on the guy in charge to delegate orders. Either way, that had to be a busy session! Too bad you didn't get the "ding-ding" sound from the planes as they pulled up.

Cool - our local crew. I'll look into it since now I'm curious. Wonder if that was declassified and public now.

 

Same here, tho based at Wendover for 2 weeks during the middle of the summer (from Langley, 71st TFS). Normally our Red Flag TDY would have us at Nellis AFB with lodging downtown at one of the casinos. This time, to our surprise, it was a Rapid Deployment Force desert training exercise as the "Aggressors".

During the 80's I went to Red Flag more times than I can remember and each trip had its share of war stories/memories. My times were during the Cold War so I missed the out on the MIG participation of the East Germans a few years later.

January 17, 1991, Desert Storm.

I was with the 58th FS in Tabuk, S.A. and the first night of the air war included several dogfights.

http://shop.history.com/detail.php?p=70192&v=history_subject_war-and-warfare

 

Wade- I was with the 48 TFW at Taif. Did you or any of your buddies see the Iraquis running around with their lights on at night during the first few days? We had one fly over our F-111F on Day 2 at 5-10K' with full position lights and beacon illuminated. 400' TFR for us, so no problem, just surprised us anybody could be that dumb.

Night dogfights are quite a bit different from day knife-fights.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

I was in flight line maintenance supervision and most of the shooters launched and recovered in my AOR*. It was non-stop ICTs*, so we were a little busy

I've been on a DART (not DACT) mission over the Med but I could never imagine what it's like for a night-time dogfight.

BTW, they say that the training at Red Flag was a major contributor to the success of the air war over the Gulf.


*Area of Responsibility
*Integrated Combat Turn (the pit stop of the Jet Fighter world)

 

I think that I have posted this before but I was friends with an ex-RAF Mosquito night fighter pilot with 13 night victories. He lacked radar and relied on his eye sight and skill to do his job. He told me about one fight that he had with a Ju-88 when both ran out of ammo after a lengthy fight without damage to either adversary and wagged wings as they departed. He was an American flying with the RCAF. I posted this to point out the differences between the WW2 operations and the new stuff. No DART, DACT, AOF. JUst visual capture and a mix-up...AT NIGHT. The Mosquito and Ju-88 were two great airplanes. My friend , Clip Collard was a great pilot. I think that I have known some people who transcend some of us mortals.
Switches

 

I was really disappointed with this movie. They didn't get nearly enough in-flight footage (even though the stuff they did get was awesome), and the narration was SO CHEESY, I wish the guy would have just kept his mouth shut and the camera rolling.

 

Good stuff guys, really appreciate the stories and info.

-Wade, thanks for the info. I'll look into that episode.

-Terry, I take it he was small fish or was that the last mistake he made?

-Bob, impressive stuff. On one hand, you've got the sheer talent you mentioned with eyesight and combat skill. On the other, you have guys who have information overload and processing that chaos is a talent in itself. Times have certainly changed. The story about the wing wagging was great. Mutual respect & the chance to live another day...