how many show thier ferrari's and belong to a club

Mike, did you send a case of scotch to the judges yet?

I have shown my cars in the past, but only to gain entry to an event where I really wanted to be a spectator and wanted to take advantage of the VIP parking.

 

Can somebody please correct the 1 spelling and 2 grammatical errors in this thread title?

Sorry, but it makes us look bad.

Greg

 

i have been invited, and have attended a few show events, but i found the " oh, you only have a 308 " comments to be in bad taste.

i love cars in general, but working on and around Gulfstream jets has me a bit jaded, when some idiot thinks they are " all that, because they have a $100k car and i dont. try buying an owning just about any aircraft, and a $100k car is not that big a deal anymore.

i can appreciate the need for originality and judging to protect the Ferrari car species, but there were the two events i went to. the judges picked a car with, wrong wheels and tires, new paint, new carpet, new interior, aftermarket ignition, and so on. i know so much about the other car, as i helped put most of the stuff on it. my car was dead nuts original, down to its old 14 inch wheels and old, original leather, carpet and paint. yet the " pretty red one " won, and my Marrone car was " passed over " .

my point is, there are many things to know, about many of the different models and sub models of Ferraris, so i dont see many places having the people available that really know how to judge a car. just the differences that make a correct early 308 GT4 different, and a 76 steel carb 308 different from a euro 308 QV GTB will make your head spin. and i know little to nothing of the old stuff, and the newer ful injected stuff!

so in summation, i now avoid concours, and wine /cheese type car shows. i do go to charity events or public events when i can. i was invited just last night to one just down the street from me here, but i will most likely be working on an aircraft.

 

Wonder if it changed since the leased 430 crowd have all had their margins called in the last 18 months.

 

That happens in LA too but everyone is trying hard to put a stop to it.

 

I belong to the FCA and go to one Concours a year with no intention of competing, I just go for the fun of it. My car is not all original but the way I like it. (Capristo, moderate tint on the glass, Euro turn signal lenses and front plate, cooling bypass switches}.

I did receive a 12 cylinder award at our run to Cannon Beach a couple of years ago (with black duct tape on the airdam) and 3rd place in the 70/80's category at the Historics on 4th of July, neither of which were concours events. I was surprised at both events. Must have been that extra coat of wax.................................

I prefer to attend driving events, tours or charity events.

 

That would only be because it wasn't noticed. Judges aren't perfect, things get missed. We also get lots of people comming up and engaging us in conversation while we are trying to do the job. Also you would be surprised at the lengths some car owners will go to obscure deficiencies or just flat out try and distract us. At a recent show a 328 owner peeled the decals off while we watched so he wouldn't lose the points. Stickers are stickers, if Ferrari didn't put them on, points come off. There is a 99 point Mondial t making the rounds that would win many shows if he took 2 stickers off from under the hood. At the last show I asked him why he didn't take them off and was told he was worried about damaging something. I spent some time giving him instructions how to do it. One other thing you need to be aware of, most of the V8 class judges are not the most experienced. I have been given that class many times in the last 2 years so I could do some coaching because of the research I have been doing for a book project. I started that research because several of them asked for books with the information they needed. I did some reading and found there were no good sources available for them.


The IAC/PFA is trying very hard to make it as consistant and fair as possible and has gone to great lengths to come up with guide lines to eleminate the stupidity that has prevailed in many areas but not all shows are using those guidelines and not all judges adhear to them. That is changing but the change is slow.

The bottom line is judges are human, have different opinions and make mistakes. It is not now and never will be perfect even at Pebble Beach.

 

Nope and Nope.

Would entertain the idea of joining a club if I could find one (just move too darn often).

As to showing my car it would never even win the booby-prize (it would come in 24 out of 20) so why bother.


BUT, I "show it" where ever I DRIVE IT.

 

Like Dave, I now go to a couple shows a year and enter so that I can have a spot on the show field for parking, and to support the FCA events. I don't think there's much point to competing in a concours with a 9 year old car. At that point it's only a matter of who has the nicest paint and hasn't screwed with the exhaust or wheels. Not really a competition, more of a shine and show.

When I had the Dino, I took it a hell of a lot more seriously, did maybe 4-5 shows a year. My kids would go too, they ended up more anxious at the shows than I did. But it was a 98-99 point car at the FCA regional level, when judged by guys who did know their stuff. It's porbably slipped a little now that UroTrash owns it.

Last couple of shows, now that I no longer own a Dino, I've helped with the judging, mostly on Dinos. I get lots of questions about what to do with a car to score better next time. Often as not, there are any number of little things that can add up to enough points to push you from platinum and into the gold or silver competition.

There can be disagreements among judges as to what is right or wrong. If you're sure something on your car is original, and a judge says no, best thing to have is a reference that shows it belongs there. Certainly there are books that show factory original cars in detail, and I've used them to point out to guys what was wrong with a car, so why not show a judge what's right. I got squeezed into judging 550s last year, about which I know very little, so I stuck to what I did know and looks for obvious flaws and differences between the cars, and then asked the other judge if this or that was stock or not.

And like Brian said, judges are human, they can miss stuff too. I know I did.

DM

 

I like shows and belong to several clubs. I don't prepare my cars in any special way for concours. I would never remove the stickers I got from FIVA/The Goodwood Festival of Speed/and the Histroic Targa Florio. I've got a few awards and no one ever commented about the stickers.

 

I dont do now and probably never will when I get my Ferrari... It'll be covered in stone chips and brake dust from all the track events

 

I seem to recall spending time with you on more than one occasion doing just that.

 

I do belong to the FCA. I do NOT enter my car in any concourse show. It is far from original, and Yet Another Stock Ferrari is boring when there's a bunch of them on a fairway.

Amusingly, it's won a few People's Choice type awards over the years at non-Concourse type shows, rock chips and all.

 

I'm glad I hang with the D.C. area guys... they appreciate "cars" - all cars. I belong to the FCA and BMWCCA and I show my 308. It has won many awards and trophies. I get points deducted for a few things I won't change on the car, but that's my choice, and they are mostly overlooked at the car shows where other marques are judged against it. Besides all of that, the 308 is the car I always wanted so I bought one.

I remember the 246 getting knocked, but now it's value is high. I don't hear or read much about the 308's being put down now that the value is increasing. What I'm now reading on F-Chat are comments knocking the 348, so I think the cycle for the 308 bashing is moving on to the next model. Of course there are always some older guys who don't see the change around them. Waddayagonnado?

 

Ditto.

 

I would like to see the original judging sheet. It is hard to imagine you lost a whole point for a sticker. It should be half at most. Often several minor items in one catagory get added up to one point. We have 15 minutes to judge. It makes it impossible to discuss every aspect. The time I referenced when the guy peeled his off as we watched was a situation where he knew going in it was going to cost him so he asked and offered to take it off. We told him he was correct it was going to cost him. I suspect he figured the mere offer to take it off was good enough. I tend to be a little easy, maybe too easy on wear and tear items but not nonoriginality. The others concurred and we took him up on his offer.

 

Likewise, the Concours in my area contributes to Make-A-Wish Foundation among others IIRC.

 

Brian -

I know you're an active judge. Can you help me understand the role of IAC/PFA in the judging you do? Is that the governing body for all 'formal' FCA concours? Are international rules the same as here in the USA? Just curious... as I watched Cavallino judging it seems both clinical, and in a way, quite subjective. My car has never been (nor planned to be) concours material, but I find it interested from the perspective of some things my customers order for their vehicles just ahead of a big concours.

For example, if a customer installs a brand new, but perfectly Genuine and correct black plastic shift knob into a 50,000 mile car, what does that mean to the judging process?

 

I park my car at events I go to in order to see other cars; I think you have to have a masochistic streak to compete in concours! But I do go along to as many Club events as I can, provided they involve driving, don't bother too much with the purely social events.