Track/Scuderia/430 Question

Are there any tracks in the US where it would be possible to hit 160mph+ on the straights?

 

Miller with full track configuration.

 

"Are there any tracks in the US where it would be possible to hit 160mph+ on the straights?"


The number becomes much larger if we can disregard the inevitable turn at the end ....

 

Interesting question...My 2008 Porsche Cup Car hit 174 at Daytona as per the Bosch data logger and its rated at 420hp and has to run a restrictor. I would assume a 500hp Ferrari would exceed that speed since horsepower is a major factor in MPH.

 

road america

 

I was at Road America this summer in my 430 and 160 is not in the cards in any 430.

Dave

 

California Speedway long course (ROVAL). My only track day with the Scuderia on shot tires and bad alignment, so needed to slow down a lot at Turn 1. Traqmate GPS verified at 159.48 mph, with a better alignment and fresh tires I could push another 3-5 mph.

At this same racetrack, my old 996 GT3 would hit 150.26 mph. My GT3 was 300 lbs lighter than stock, had a GT3 Cup short R&P and LSD, on 275/335 tires (Moton+monoballs). This same GT3 would reach 153mph at Watkins Glen going up the esses, so the Scuderia should exceed 160mph at the Glen as well.

VIR should also be a place to exceed 160mph with the Scuderia.

At Road America, the Scuderia should not be able to reach or pass 160mph, but it will run beyond 155mph.

Pocono Full Course (NC infield + Bowl) allows over 165mph, based on the 158mph I was getting with a 996 GT3.

 

Curious - what cold tire pressures do you use on the track for the Scud?

 

Make sure you have your Pirellis recalled if you haven't already. 160mph is the magic number.

 

in my scud, my speedometer read 160 on road america at the national FCA event this summer on the front straight. Road america is a great track. i was no where close to that on the esses at Watkins Glen, 150 max.

 

167 was the number



Road Atlanta
Miller Motorsports
California Speedway

 

The speedometer in the Scuderia (and I suspect all the F430) is way off. I thought my Porsche GT3 RS was off (4.5%). The Scuderia is off by 7%.

This means at 100mph the car indicates 107mph. An indicated 160mph is actually 149.5mph.

With a Garmin GPS, you get the correct speed, run to 50 mph in the GPS and check the speedometer, run 75mph in the GPS and check the speedometer, then run to 100mph in the GPS and check the speedometer. Easy way to verify that your speedometer is lying.

I don't run the Pirelli Corsa at the track anymore, I run Toyo R888 and Hoosier A6.

Tire pressures depend largely on the tires used. I don't set the car for cold tire pressures, because depending on the track temperature, air temperature and driving style/limits, you can see increases in between 2 psi to 12 psi difference, and you want to run the tires for their ideal hot pressure according to the camber settings in your car (my car runs a lot more camber than stock).

Generally, the Pirelli Corsa fades on grip beyond 38 psi hot, with the sweet spot being 32 psi hot in the front and 36 psi rear, the Corsa likes around 2 degrees of negative camber (+/- 0.5). I ran them a -3.5 and the front ones did not get good temperatures on the outside edge.

The R888 (about 1/2 the price of Corsas and quicker on lap times) like more camber, and way higher pressures, I'm running them hot at 38psi front and 40psi rear.

 

Scott Tucker has won many races in the F430 Challenge, he just won the 2009 SCCA National Championship in Touring 1 with his F430 Challenge. On Hoosier tires with plenty of driving skills, his Challenge car (faster than a Scuderia on Pirelli Corsa street tires) barely reached 159mph (actual speed) at Road America. This was on racing conditions with him leading the group (no traffic).

Your 160 mph indicated is actually under 150 mph. At the Glen, 150mph on the speedo is actually 140mph, which is quite fast, but below the car's potential.

My 996 GT3 bone stock before upgrades on Michelin Sport Cups hit 153mph on actual speed at the Glen, and my Scuderia is consistently faster on straights compared to my former 996 GT3. At California Speedway my old GT3 and the Scuderia have speed differences of up to 10mph (end of inner straight).

The key to a fast speed at the Glen is full gas from turn 2 (on high horsepower cars), and full gas from turn 1 (on low horsepower cars). I have no doubt that the Scuderia can easily reach 160mph (actual speed) at Watkins Glen.

 

Rad,
Thanks for the info, especially the tires. I know my 430 speedo is a little generous from checking. An indicated 100 is really about 97, etc. I got to about 145 indicated at ROA that I know of (I was normally focused on the braking zone markers) so I figure close to 140 actual. The car had PS2's and this was my first time on the track and even though I have quite a bit of experience I know I still had a little speed to gain on the last corner onto the straight plus I could have braked a little deeper into to turn one. I also have a stick which might cost me 1-2 mph top speed there but, like I said, I cannot see how any 430 could reach 160. There were no scuds in my run group but I was catching other stock 430's so I know I wasn't a slouch.

Dave

 

WGI on the back straight. Same with Monticello.

 

I hit 148 on the front straight at PIR (Portland Int'l Raceway) without the chicane open in my 996TT. With a good driver in a 430 scud you might get to 160+.

 

Rad, what width rims are you using now? Have you, or do you plan on installing a roll bar? Any planned future modifications?
Thank you in advance,
david

 

The stock wheels have 235/295 R888.

The 295/345 are on 9.5/11.5 wheels. I can run up to 10.5 front and 13 rear with no changes to the body for wheels, and the car can use a 315 in the front. This is only valid with a very stiff suspension. My current suspension is over 100% stiffer than stock, consider that the stock Scuderia is just 35%F/32%R stiffer than a normal F430.

I think a stock Scuderia with 9"/11" wheels on the stock offsets, and 265/305 tires is the perfect setup with the stock suspension. The stock tires are too skinny, and that limits the car capabilities.

 

The SCCA T-1 runoff race rada indicated a "trap speed" for a race prepped (stock motor) 430 around 140 (see SCCA Forum T-1 "trap speeds") and a Corvette LS3 about the same. Safe bets are Daytona, Homestead, and Pocono without the chicanes, and maybe Watkins Glenn withoutthe "bus stop".

 

thank you. have you, or do yo plan to install a roll bar?

 

I know of somebody who hit 180 on the back straight at VIR in a Carrera GT.

 

I was hitting 149 (GPS) on the back straight at WGI, while going just half throttle through the esses and breaking very early for the bus stop. Going all out, there is no doubt in my mind, one can easily get way north of 160.

 

The Runoffs trap speeds were done at start/finish. Add 15-20 mph for top speeds.


I think a Scud would see 160 at:

Road America
Watkins Glen
Road Atlanta - maybe
Daytona - 180?
Pocono - Long configuration

I saw 160 indicated in my 360 F1 at WGI. No lift in T2 with a short shift to 5th before the "esses".

 

The SCCA measured at the Start/Finish line in Road America.

Here is a video showing the speed before turn 1. Keep in mind that the Vette in front has to start his braking earlier, and the F430 cannot brake as deep as in a leading lap.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oP1iQUocWUk

 

Daytona for sure - we saw 176 to 181 on data aq on our GT3 we raced in the 24. Haven't run my 430 there but I'm sure that 170 plus is easily on the cards into turn 1. We saw high 160s into the bus stop, so you can hit >160 twice on the lap there.

Running a challenge car with data aq at WGI and Road Atlanta, 160 is *just about* on the cards at both. At RA its all about your shot out of the 2nd gear corner leading on to the straightaway, the last of the late brakers will just about notch 160.

At WGI its about being flat all the way from turn 1, it is possible but you need to be inch perfect otherwise you are hitting the armco. You can brake much later than you think at WGI for the bus stop and still be doing 100+ at the first rumble on drivers right with the right wheels all the way up and on top of the flat part of the curbing.