1997 355 GTB ---- VIN ZFFXR41AXV0109061 Just purchased (2) days ago on Ebay for $36,100..... http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/FERRARI-355GTB-6SPD-NR-ALL-SERVICES-UP-TO-DATE-EXTRAS_W0QQitemZ200404955806QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUS_Cars_Trucks?hash=item2ea910f29e Now trying to be flipped by the Sports Car Company.....for $49,500 (2) days later.... http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220512905368&category=157044&_trksid=p2773.m263&_trkparms=algo%3DSI%26itu%3DUCI%26otn%3D18%26po%3DLVI%26ps%3D54 And, yes I do realize this is how car dealers make their living..... But, this one seems a bit egregious to me... Plus, they make no mention of the "accident" this car was involved in --- at least the original seller was honest enough to disclose this, and discount the car's prior purchase price (via a no reserve, no minimum auction) accordingly.
What is the market value? Isn't that all that really matters? If it is worth 49.5 all that means is that everyone who did not bid screwed up.
I'm not trying to make a condemnation, or even a statement.... I just wanted to bring it to folk's attention in case someone wants to buy this car ---- it may be useful information to them. Plus it gives a data point for the perennial question of "How much Dealer margin is on a used Ferrari?". And, yeah I do think not disclosing the prior accident damage / repair is a bit un-cool....
Yeah, but at least anyone here on F-chat now has been given the "caveat" --- consider the point of my posting it as "a public service message" --- LOL
I agree it's uncool not to disclose the info and it's awesome you posted this. Sorry, I came from a different forum where a few people were knocking on Wayne Carini and other car "dealers" on how they make a living......put me in the wrong frame of mind
The accident is reported on the Auto Check listed in the ebay auction BIG red number "73" and accident or damage in red as well.
"Auto Check" is more unreliable and potentially meaningless than a CarFax report --- both often contain serious errors and misleading info. And, what about the buyer who walks into the showroom to see this car without having seen it on Ebay? Is the salesman going to pull him aside and say, "Oh by the way....let me show you the repair receipts from the accident this car had...." ?.......Maybe....... Maybe not.
i went down to look at a car once and was turn off by the high pressure "used car men" sales pitch. i dont mine them asking for more than what they paid because thats what a dealer is suppose to do but he didnt come clean on were he picked up the car which was local. i dont want to name names but he's on F-Chat.
Yes thank you for posting this warning to the community. This was the way i read your original post, it had sod all to do with the dealer reselling it at a profit. And sod all to do with market values. I read it as a warning of a car being sold without mention of an accident. Thanks for posting this
The dont always win A local dealer bought this 355 on ebay in the spring for $63k. I noticed it b/c its one of the few local cars and sounded well sorted/up to date but I didnt like color they immediately listed it locally for $75k. They are now trying to dump if for $59.9k and will likely take a $5k + loss http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Other-Makes-F1-Spyder-1999-Other-Ferrari-355-F1-Spyder_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem19b77621c1QQitemZ110452154817QQptZUSQ5fCarsQ5fTrucks#ht_4320wt_1165
I actually bid on this car. Karim the owner is a fruitcake. They disqualified me because of my one positive feedback. Karim sent me a message to tell me so. Once I qualified myself to him I resumed bidding. I continued to check my status and with 19hrs left I found that I had once again been removed. The excuse this time was that the other "bidders" thought it was a schill.So after a bit of back and forth on the ebay e-mail he said he would call me before the end of the auction. I told him that I would have no trouble wiring the money through the system to Mike at Ferrari service where the car was being stored. I was having lunch with some associates while the auction was closing and excused myself to shore this up as I was not recieving the call. I called Mike at Ferrari Service and the car had sold for 32,100.00. Anyway Jim Lyons is a pretty reputable guy and has a very hot wife. Aparently the "accident" was a very small scape. You could buy this car still for $37k from jim if you asked nicley, but at that price for me it would have to be black.
Anyways, I figured I would chime in since I was the winning bidder on the car but decided to pass on it. Winning bid was $36.1k. Sort of an odd deal with this car because the owner did not want me to perform a leakdown/compression test on the car until I left a non-refundable 20% deposit. And that was at his shop not one of my choosing. Potentially a hidden issue but who knows - did not want to take a chance. I don't believe the car would be acceptable to the majority of people on this board. Entire car has been painted and not a great job. Color does not match, lots of overspray. I have a professional paint meter so that does not lie. Perhaps painted more than once in some areas. Interior has dash pulling issues and some sticky parts. These are major issues to most people and should of been disclosed. That really bothered me but you get what you pay for at $36k. Now at $49k, it would be really unacceptable and the current seller should disclose all this upfront. Just another used car salesman whether they are selling Ferraris or Chevy's. My $0.02, just wanted to give everyone here a honest evaluation of the car. You make your own decision. I would rather pay top $$ for an unmolested, unpainted car with full records. Just that there are not too many in Argento or Titanium with 6 speed. That is the only reason why I even considered this car.
Thankyou for that. It certainly explains why he was excluding me from this auction I guess insisting on a ppi was the determining factor. I'm glad he did.
Yes certainly. Though I as I understand, the aussie population has the highest percentage per capita fruitcake population on the planet.
Just looked at both ads. This car has more millage than 41k for sure. If you look at the first ad, the odometer pic shows the numbers not lining up properly. This is a common sign of rollback. The next guy selling it is not that dumb and will not show a pic of the odometer. He shows everything else though. You will also notice in the pics that the passenger seat has more wear than most drivers seats do in 30k. This car is well used and is only worth 30 odd period.
Are you blind? Can you not see the large "Accident or damage reported" and the big red score of "73" in the auto check? According to the previous owner. The car was backed into by someone trying to parallel park. I spoke to Mike at Ferrari service and he said the car is mechanically sound. I have known Mike for years and he has worked on my cars. His word is gold to me.
The Autocheck supports what I was told... 11/19/1999 FL Accident Source LEFT FRONT IMPACT WITH ANOTHER VEHICLE(Case #:551453290) As for the ODO. I'll look at it myself tomorrow.
No, am I not blind (it would be difficult for me to make a post if I were....) Can you comprehend what you read? I stated, "they make no mention of the accident", which is accurate. The fact that it appears in the history report (or even a CarFax) has nothing to do with anything. The point is that the seller (especially a Dealer) should still disclose such information explicitly when advertising, IMO. And, you (from your signature, it appears you are with the Sports Car Company?) have not done so. I wasn't attacking the integrity of the Sports Car Company or any of its staff before --- but, I will now, because your reaction to my comments is so inappropriate for any one in sales or the customer service industry that it merits a retort. What are you telling your customers that walk in to your showroom and don't know you have the car listed on Ebay? --- "Go look at the Ebay listing if you want to know about the history of this car." I have no idea what the disclosure laws are in the state of California, but most states require that any licensed car dealer has to fully disclose (this means, repair records, insurance claim documents, even photos --- if available) the details of any accident involving a car they are selling or representing. Florida and Texas (and I believe they are the only states) have no "salvage title" status for passenger cars. So, there is no way of knowing the extent of damage a vehicle from either of those states has incurred simply by looking at the "autocheck" or CarFax report ---- this car could have been totaled (then salvaged), and the reports would never show it. I AM NOT saying this is the case with this car ---- I have no idea as to the extent of its accident damage --- that is the point. I AM saying that if you are concerned with your reputation and that of the company you represent, you may want to consider giving your potential customers a more comprehensive explanation than a story that's akin to "the previous owner says his dog ate his homework".......... If there is nothing to hide with this car, why wouldn't you be comfortable with fully disclosing the complete details of the accident up front --- rather than leaving your customers to try to guess and research it for themselves ??? I would expect that rap from a private seller (albeit, an unethical one), but never from a Dealer / Professional.
