308 V12 conversion begins | Page 123 | FerrariChat

308 V12 conversion begins

Discussion in '308/328' started by mk e, Oct 9, 2007.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. NeuroBeaker

    NeuroBeaker Advising Moderator
    Moderator

    Oct 1, 2008
    40,043
    Huntsville, AL., USA
    Full Name:
    Andrew
    Power aside... it'd sound simply incredible at 9,500rpm. :D

    All the best,
    Andrew.
     
  2. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,753
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    I know...but 35hp is the difference between a 700hp car and an 800 hp car ;)

    We'll see. I'm planning for 9500 but I'm also trying to get the peak as low as I can hoping there will be no need to go near 9500....but think of the sound it would make!!!!!
     
  3. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,753
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    #3053 mk e, Dec 2, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  4. GrigioGuy

    GrigioGuy Splenda Daddy
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 26, 2001
    33,194
    E ' ' '/ F
    Full Name:
    Jerry Mandarin
    Will you be able to get those header -off- without having to pull the full motor?

    Just curious.

    Looks great!
     
  5. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,753
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    I'm pretty sure they will come off. The rear ones come off for sure and I've been slipping the front ones in and out for the pic and fitting with no problem.
     
  6. Maranelloborn

    Maranelloborn Karting

    Nov 16, 2009
    227
    New York
    Full Name:
    Remund
    Wow is there anything you can't do...
     
  7. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,753
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    #3057 mk e, Dec 3, 2009
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2009
    I think I was modeling the collectors wrong in the simulator. I couldn’t understand why everything I did kept trying to up the hp peak at 9500 when I told burns 8500. I played with the way I was doing the collectors and now have the hp peaking at 814 at 8800…803 at 8500, 804 at 9500. I would guess that when I put mufflers on like I told Burns I was going to do the peak will drop to about 760-780 at 8500.

    The software doesn’t have multiple collectors so I was just using the first one, but I get a very different answer when I combine the collectors and treat them as 1 long collector. I think this is the most accurate way to do it and I also thing the multiple collectors work better then 1 long one would so the software is probably under reporting hp a touch and over reporting RPM because high hp means I run out of air sooner.

    We’ll see when it gets to the dyno, but I think this is more correct now and 8500 is looking like the right place to stop spinning it. I also ended up going to 12.2” on the stacks and the cams moved to 170/114 lob centers and .001 more lash on the intake (good for 1.5hp :) )as the intake cam has pretty long accel/decel ramps.
     
  8. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,753
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    I suck at sheet metal work and my people skills are far less than stellar :)
     
  9. Maranelloborn

    Maranelloborn Karting

    Nov 16, 2009
    227
    New York
    Full Name:
    Remund
  10. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,753
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
  11. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,753
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
  12. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jan 11, 2008
    41,692
    Sarasota
    Full Name:
    David
    If they work half as well as they look you'll be doing great.
    Thanks for the updates.
     
  13. Pizzaman Chris

    Pizzaman Chris F1 Rookie

    Mar 13, 2005
    3,919
    New Hampshire
    Full Name:
    Pizzaman Chris
    Thanks alot man, you make my thread look real boring. :(










    But they DO look great Mark! Very nice. :)
     
  14. f308jack

    f308jack F1 Rookie

    Jun 7, 2007
    4,300
    Cape Town, South Afr
    Full Name:
    Jack Verschuur
    Looking great Mark!

    In the fifth pic, 2 of the pipes show rather dark inside: are you burning oil in 2 cylinders? :)

    This is going to be one sweeeeet car.
     
  15. ramosel

    ramosel Formula 3

    Sep 11, 2004
    1,237
    Meadow Vista, CA
    Full Name:
    R Moseley
    Midnight oil!!!
     
  16. NeuroBeaker

    NeuroBeaker Advising Moderator
    Moderator

    Oct 1, 2008
    40,043
    Huntsville, AL., USA
    Full Name:
    Andrew
    Ooooh... :D
     
  17. hotrod406

    hotrod406 Formula Junior

    Sep 18, 2007
    540
    Grand rapids area,MI
    Full Name:
    Tim
    Nice fuel pump. Is that an A1000 or the bigger one? I'm not sure an A1000 will support 800hp fuel injected.
     
  18. technom3

    technom3 F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Mar 29, 2007
    18,693
    Phoenix AZ
    Full Name:
    Justin

    I have ZERO experience with these cylinder heads... but I just want to give you one word of warning... Be careful that the cam lobes will physically fit. I ran into a problem once, on a completely different car where the cam lobes were slightly bigger than the factory lobes and I had to "massage" the spark plug tubes. If I would have built a more radical cam... i would have been done for. Just one of those stories I want to pass on to someone who is in uncharted territory before you spend 2-4k on cams
     
  19. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,753
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    Yes, an A1000. It’s rated at 600lb/hr at 45 psi. I think I need .45-.5 lb/hp so 360-400 lb/hr and I'm planning on 45 psi, so the pump should be good….but I can always add another one I guess as this one is a left-over from the blower motor.
     
  20. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,753
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    :)
     
  21. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,753
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    #3071 mk e, Dec 4, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Good point, but no worries. The blanks fit just fine and the finish ground lobes will obviously be smaller so I can't see how there will be a problem…..but if something come up I have a grinder and I’m not afraid to use it.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  22. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,614
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    You don't say.


    LOL!
     
  23. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,753
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    #3073 mk e, Dec 4, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I found a couple errors in my simulation today

    First I realized that I still had the 86.5mm bore in it but I changed to 86mm because that is what the head gasket people could deal with. That lead to the hp peak shifting up about 300 rpm and was slightly lower….which lead to me messing with everything just to be sure …..and I must admit that I am now more than just a tad confused. The simulator says everything is still right, cam lobes, cam timing, intake tack length, headers……but I need a lot more exhaust flow than I had been using. Thinking back I hadn’t really played with exhaust flow numbers I just took the intake numbers time 75% and plugged it into the exhaust because 75% is pretty standard. The problem appears to be the way I plugged it in at what lifts and shifting the flow to a lower lift (smaller valves come to full flow sooner than big valves) I need to get some real exhaust flow number but the numbers I have in now are pretty close to a head pre-loaded in the software that has the same size valves I’m using…….and the new exhaust flow number brings the engine to 875hp at 9000 rpm.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  24. RVIDRCI

    RVIDRCI Formula 3

    Dec 1, 2005
    1,576
    Long Beach / Phoenix
    Full Name:
    Luigi
    #3074 RVIDRCI, Dec 4, 2009
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2009
    Are you at all concerned about the trans/diff/axles standing up to this beast ? I know there is history of 308 transaxles handling up to 700hp, but jeeze dude, those torque #s !!
    Even with the drop gear changes you have made, I'm thinking a standing clutch drop @ 5000+rpm would just spray broken parts sideways out of the rear wheel wells, no?

    And yes, Ive been following your awesome progress quietly, BTW.
     
  25. NeuroBeaker

    NeuroBeaker Advising Moderator
    Moderator

    Oct 1, 2008
    40,043
    Huntsville, AL., USA
    Full Name:
    Andrew
    :eek: Good Heavens... :D

    I think we all are now. :eek:

    All the best,
    Andrew.
     

Share This Page