308 V12 conversion begins | Page 137 | FerrariChat

308 V12 conversion begins

Discussion in '308/328' started by mk e, Oct 9, 2007.

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  1. jratcliff

    jratcliff Formula 3

    Sep 7, 2004
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    Mark,
    Any thoughts on leak testing the welds? BTW I really have enjoyed reading this thread. Great vision.

    John
     
  2. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    #3402 mk e, Feb 26, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  3. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    I have thought about it but haven't come up with any easy way. I'm thinking I may go with the ignorance is bliss method.

    I remember soem years ago I was builting something...an intake manifod maybe and a buddy asked about leak testing and my answer was "I welded it, why would I leak test it?" :)
     
  4. ramosel

    ramosel Formula 3

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    Uhhhh.... We are all going to run with the concept that your welding is better than your spelling...
    <ducking, running for cover> ;)

    Rick
     
  5. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    I made the mistake of showing my wife my finger tips under a microscope once and she could see all the very tiny metal chips embedded in my skin. Our relationship hasn't been quite the same since.
     
  6. gcmerak

    gcmerak Formula 3

    Mar 17, 2008
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    Who would have ever guessed?

    Ciao,
    George
     
  7. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Leak testing heads is a good idea. If you don't have the set-up for it, a local engine machine shop should be able to do it for you fairly cheaply.
     
  8. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    I would hope so. I had a teacher once asked me if I was getting zeros on her spelling tests on purpose......sadly a zero was simply the best I could do.
     
  9. ramosel

    ramosel Formula 3

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    Ha... I had one ask me the same thing about multiplication tables!!! <memories>

    I'm willing to bet your teacher couldn't make the things you do!!!

    If you don't own your tank - when your current bottle of Argon goes flat, you really should try the Argon/Helium mix. I was amazed at the difference it made too!

    Rick
     
  10. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    I do own the tank and I do weld steel so Argon is required. I'll ask about a second tank when I get a chance to run over to the welding shop.

    Now you guys could have suggested this 2 years ago when I had a lot of Aluminum to weld ;)
     
  11. cwwhk

    cwwhk Formula 3

    Nov 13, 2003
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    Mark:

    I just came across this thread. Late to the party, but better late than never. It is amazing what you are doing! By far the most impressive thread on FChat IMHO. For sure I'll be following this every time I log on from now on.

    I have some questions on the aluminum head welding. What sort of TIG welder is necessary for this job (AC or DC). What sort of voltage and amperage setting on the welder? What type of welder tip? And what aluminum rod to use? How do you prepare the head to clean off the oxides? And what temperature do you preheat the head to? Sorry if my questions seem rudimentary, but the only time I touched a TIG welder was 25 years ago in college.

    I have a couple of 360 heads that have serious corrosion around the combustion chamber gasket sealing area too deep to be simply milled out. I'm now inspired by your thread to attempt a repair on them with welds to build up the corroded area.

    Regards,

    Wayne
     
  12. cwwhk

    cwwhk Formula 3

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    Rick:

    Can you elaborate on the benefits of argon/helium mix in this application? I am a curious welder wannabe.

    Thanks
     
  13. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    Wayne,
    You need AC, at least a 300A machine with a water cooled touch. Preheat to about 250-300 and use 4043 fill rod. wire brush for clean up/ prep. No matter how hard you try you will get .005" or so of burn in line around the weld so plan on needing to deck the heads at least the .005". good luck!
     
  14. ramosel

    ramosel Formula 3

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    I don't want to high-jack Mark's thread, but Helium (can be used up to 80% mix - I like 50/50) adds energy to the weld. I was told by the guys at Barnes that with Helium in the shield the arc carries more voltage to weld site without any increase in current. When using straight Argon - after you strike, it takes a bit before you see the puddle. With a good Helium mix it seems to puddle almost immediately and the welds look cleaner. I'm a hack welder compared to Mark, but with Helium in the mix I do pretty good... especially on thick stuff.

    Rick
     
  15. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Helium ain't cheap though and straight argon does get the job done.
     
  16. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    #3416 mk e, Feb 28, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  17. cwwhk

    cwwhk Formula 3

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    Mark:

    Thanks for the info. I'll give it a try.

    Regards,

    Wayne
     
  18. cwwhk

    cwwhk Formula 3

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    Rick:

    Thanks for the explanation. I need all the help I can get. :D
     
  19. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    Ok, no more holes in the heads but it came at a price.....the mini-torch Wil lent me burned up tonight so the port work will stop while I wait for a new torch (well 2 new torches, one for me and one for Wil) to get here. It turns out there is a limit to how long you can run a 125A torch at 200A. This is where a little helium in the mix might help are it allows better energy transfer and lower amps settings.

    Edit….that is an expensive torch I burned up that uses really expensive collets and gas cups. I see they also have a 180A torch that is about ½ between the mini and what I currently have that should still fit in the ports for at least most of the work…..I’m thinking I’ll order the semi-mini torch for me and a replacement head for Wil’s torch and that will keep the bill under $800……..
     
  20. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Just so you know Mark, I had a real emotional attachment to that particular mini torch.
     
  21. tknobby

    tknobby Rookie

    Mar 12, 2009
    49
    Ouch Mark! I haven't bought one of those mini torches. The WP-18 and WP-20 were enough for me, thanks. Although I will need one at some time. I can't believe you are welding a cylinder head at that low an amperage. I crank my machine up to 320 to weld my heads. And yes, the helium mix does help. In fact I have a bottle of straight helium I will try. I have heard that straight helium is great for aluminum. I'll let you know.

    Tom...
     
  22. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    #3422 mk e, Mar 1, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2010
    You need to grind the ports until they are paper thin, they weld a lot easier that way ;)

    a 20 is what I usually use, but I do have an 18. I'm going to order a 24 and see how it works out for stuff like this....it's 1/2 the price of the WP-125 Wil lent me and the collets and cup are a LOT cheaper, like 1/10th the price.
     
  23. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    I looked it over, it just needs a new front rubber sleeve and inner body so it will be the same torch coming back good as new. I hadn't looked it up before and was just a little shock at how many $ of damage I'd done....really handy torch though.
     
  24. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Well if my torch HAD died it would have been for a good cause.
     
  25. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    I got the torch stuff ordered up today and while I was at it ordered the Suzuki springs to have a look at.

    I'll start fitting the port bottoms now I guess and weld what I can with the big torch.
     

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