Any thoughts on 550 vs. TR prices ?

A 550 makes a Boxer and TR seem like Chevys as far as maintenance is concerned.

 

Sean, Franklin- You both obviously have no idea what you are talking about on Maranellos and their maintenance. You probably should ask a pro like Brian and see what his opinion is. No valve clearances to check, no engine-out service, etc, etc. Everything relatively easy to reach. Where are you getting all this bogus information? The 550s had some minor problems (motor mounts, plenum hoses) that were all fixed on the 575M and retrofitted to most 550s. We do not have major portions of the rear-end that come unwelded, etc, like you do on the flat twelves through late model 512 TRs. Ricambi tells me they do not stock many Maranello parts because they rarely ever get a call for them.

The 456 was the last Ferrari with valve clearances to be set and had an older head design which tended to eat valve guides. The engine was the Type 116. The 550/575 engines, Type 133, are a new design and have had very few problems except the two mentioned above. The 575M engine was carried over directly to the 612 and all major parts (block, pistons, heads, cams, valves) are identical except for ECU and manifolding changes.

I do not mind these kinds of comparisons because they are part of the fun of owning a Ferrari, but it should be done realistically and the facts should be kept straight. Maranellos are very easy to maintain, mostly just fluid and filter changes with a belt change (engine in) every 3-5 years.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

A friend of mine bought a 550 that came with over $25k in receipts for the less than 10k miles it had on the odometer, and nothing had ever broke...just maintenance ...

 

Franklin- Maintenance on what? I would love to see those receipts. Maintenance on a 550 is exactly the same as on my 575M, except the recommended cam belt change interval is 3 years instead of 5. Annual oil, brake and clutch fluid and cabin filter. Every two years power steering and transmission fluid. Every three years accessory belts and cam belts. The belt change on mine in 2008 was $1200 for labor and ~$250 for belts from Bobileff.
15,000 mile and 30,000 mile service not that expensive. No engine removal, no valves to adjust. Brakes last a long time. Clutches on 550s last a long time. There is no major on a 550, because engine removal is not required.

Way cheaper than TR maintenance.

Brian- How about an opinion from a professional? My techs love working on Maranellos.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

Maybe he (Franklin and others) are referring to articles like the one below. I own the 'trouble children' Fcars, so could be biased, BUT would also like a 550 one day and sorrily lament not making a move on the Tim Allen 575. That said, this still registers in my mind...

http://www.sportscarmarket.com/articles/archives/939

 

I am only going by a 550 I have seen, touched and ridden in that belongs to a friend who has shown me a thick stack of receipts for money spent at FoA by the previous owner for maintenance only work...maybe it was a lemon? And my BB512i has been the most reliable and least expensive Ferrari to maintain out of the six have owned

 

If you buy two new front shocks and actuators from Ferrari, the price is ~$4500 plus installation. The Bilsteins and actuators were a weak point for the 550 (and the 456 and other contemporaries). The shocks and actuators can be rebuilt for a fraction of that cost, however, and the rebuild will also completely eliminate the failure points. Just like you flat 12 owners, weak areas soon generate cost-effective solutions and a support base.

The 575M replaced the Bilsteins with bullet-proof Mannesmann-Sachs shocks, which have caused no problems and will probably outlive the car. 575M prices have dropped like a rock, and their prices are overlapping the 512 TR and high end 550s now.

Looking at that list, I would have to say that was very unusual for a Maranello, and does not match what most owners in the V12 forum are seeing, especially not me.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

There is a big difference between the TRs and 550/575...
First, the boxer is a must at Ferrari world... but also expensive to maintain when the time comes... Not better not worst just different in the conception and mood.

The 550 and 575 are way more user friendly much more of a true GT... A car really easy to own. As long as you buy the right one. The belts are almost a straight job (I do it in 3 days at my shop - Italia Exotics) easy.
The TRs at least 10 days work with time stoped, obviously...

The differences between the 550 to the 575 are important the shocks are indeed far better and the gasoline lines and wheels are much better. Regarding the valve guides, I have never experienced such a problem, yet.

The market is also ruled by the numbers available and status of the car... and there the TRs specaily the 512 Tr and F512M still get a nice value...
Attention, that from my experience the last F512M is far from the others TRs.

Regarding the Boxer engine if well kept and driven, it lasts for ever... I've seen some, here in Europe, with 220,000 Kms and more still running with full performance.

Regards,

Miguel

 

I forgot to mention that ownership of a 550 would be IN ADDITION TO having a TR, preferably a 512TR,........................ eventually.

Trading off between the two would be like night and day.

 

Spasso- Affirmative. I would love to have a 512 TR, too. Completely different cars, but both great in their own way.

The article on costs frankly amazed me. Sounded like a rich guy telling the factory mechanics "fix whatever you think needs fixing". I would only do that with my guys, who I really trust and who ask me before they do anything.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

He was getting screwed. I love TRs and BB's both but to claim either costs less to operate than a 550 is just plain incorrect.

 

All true.

BTW I have seen TR motors still running very well, very little oil usage with over 230,000 miles (370,000 km)

 

That was by Mike Sheehan who does his best to assassinate any Ferrari he doesn't like.

He's in fantasy land.

 

Brian- Thanks. That pretty much settles the argument.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

Dear Ferraristi,

....If I was driving a 550 or any other front engined Italian corvette....I'd expect to be wearing nail polish and feeling very pretty.

...newer Ferrari's just keep getting bigger and bigger and uglier.....

I would have figured that a 550 would be cheaper to maintain than any "engine out" Fcar.

....it's still boring to look at....no pizazz !

....but just wait till computer modules start failing and new ones out of production. That's the reality in the Lamborghini Diablo world now.

18 is not underage.....just can't buy them drinks.

Just for you Taz.....my friend Sandy (21)


Shamile

Freeze....Miami Vice !
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Shamile- She qualifies, on any scale.

Nobody who owns a TR, however, can grump about big cars. Weights on TRs and Maranellos are about the same. One has a bit more horsepower, however, and relative beauty is strictly opinion.

The Lusso was criticized as being too bland when it first came out. Do not hear that so much today.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

Dear Ferraristi,

A TR is wide (78"w 44.1" tall) not big. Have you ever seen how big of a cow the 360 is sitting next to a TR? ....I too was shocked !

....oh yeah, my VT Roadster is 80" wide and 43" tall

.....low and wide and midengined....the only way to go !


Shamile

Freeze....Miami Vice !

 

Dear Ferraristi,

Nooo.....that would be "Tall ! Thin ! Blonde! "

....and 18 - 23 years old.


Opps.... 9:40pm....gotta go chase some skirts.....Ladies nite tonight at club 210 !


Shamile

Freeze...Miami Vice !

 

Mid engined is the key. I have never owned, and never will own, a front engine sportscar.

 

Greg- Oh well. No 250 GTOs or SWBs or 250MMs or 500 TRCs or 250 TRs for you. Or Aston Martins, Maseratis, except the MC12 and few odd ones. Kind of silly, actually.

How old are you, anyway?

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

I'm 44. The front engine cars just don't make the hair on the back of my neck stand up. I've driven them but not my thing, kinda like comparing Nascar and Formula 1.

 

Funny thing, my nickname growing up was TAZ, it's my screen name on offshoreonly.com

 

Greg- I am a bit older than you and have learned putting things in little boxes and limiting yourself to a few choices is self-defeating. The F1 and Indycar drivers in NASCAR seem to have a pretty good time. Besides, after flying fighters for the AF for 20 years and getting shot at for my efforts, I guess the hairs on the back of my neck do not need any more exercise. My callsign was Taz, never mind why.

Taz
Terry Phillips