Left foot braking with automatics?

Left foot braking is a great racing tool. Just remember on a street car don't rest your foot on the pedal. And in road racing it has become an effective tool hauling ass around sweeping corners. I have been left foot braking since I started driving and then into racing on ovals and now road racing. I just have to remember to tell he brain to switch pedals for a down shift. So in short if you can practice in a street car. Just wait till you take that trick to the track.....mz

 

For example: TWS short course, there is a 5-turn set of esses. The fastest way through is to modulate the gas between 25% and 40% while modulating the brakes from 10%-30% This gives an uninterupted series of accelerate (40 feet) decelerate (40 feet) accelerate (40 feet) decelerate (40 feet) accelerate into the next real turn (approximate speed through esses 65-70 MPH on street tires). There is no way to do this sequence without LFB and you will gan 10-15 feet on the car in front if he is not doing LFB with gas.

Here you are using LFB to put weight on the front tires so the car can turn, and then using gas to transfer the weight back to the back so corner speeds remain high. Yet there is not time to {apply remove (repeat)} with normal speed brain-to-foot actions. Using one foot do both functions is a quick way to find yourself going backwards in the pack.

{Also note: this can overload (cook wiht heat) your brake rotors and pads if you have not upgraded to semi-race pads and have fresh fluid.}

 

LFB is a great skill to have - even on the streets.

I learned LFB through my karting years.

I have applied it in on both tracking cars and driving in the street.

Just a couple of months ago I was able to avoid a major accident while approaching a street corner. The fraction of a second of being able to apply the brake sooner saved me from hitting a kid on his bicycle.

As I approached the corner to make a left, a kid was riding his bicycle on the pedestrian walk against traffic, going from the right side of my car to the left. He doesn't stop as he crosses the street and my vision was blocked by a fence. I didn't see him coming as he crossed. While I plan to make a left, I was looking over my left shoulder to see if there is any traffic coming. I was looking left, he was coming from the right. As I plan to cross and accelerate, I was very fortunate that I was able to brake immediately the minute I saw him. I barely missed him - less than 2 inches. It freaked both of us.

Thank god I was Left Foot Braking.

 

I'll occaisionally left foot brake on the street. I read an article on Schumacher driving a journalist at fiorano in the 430 or 599, and he was surprised to see him right foot brake.

 

I have been LFB in my automatic cars since I got my drivers licence back in 97!

Its the only way to drive an auto IMO.

 

As a born in the '40s retired towtruck operator ,I've left foot braked in autos since Adam wore short pants. Reason: Left foot can't slip off brake on to accelerator and cause said vehicle at full throttle to head butt tree or car etc, and trust me it does happen even with exotics drivers.

 

I think the "missing link", here, is that paddle shift cars and slush boxes are two different breed of cat.

Cars that come with slush boxes tend to also come with overly boosted power brakes:
Almost impossible to modulate properly; they all come with ABS built-in.
Breathe on the brake pedal, and you're in the ABS zone.

I've spent most of a half century modulating the brakes while doing heel/toe. The last time I drove a slush box, Nixon was President. (Other than the odd rental car --- when I couldn't get a stick shift rental.)
I'm in the "Rubens" category: too old a dog to switch, now.

Besides: if you can't be bothered to shift your own gearbox, then you're "riding", not "driving" -- so take the bus.

 

Unless you a top race driver (F1 or so ) LFB is not something that is taught. Ferraris with F1 are not made for LFB, brake pedal is postitioned fo rthe right foot.

This issue is always covered in Ferrari´s Pilota courses, no matter what level, and is not recommended by Ferrari´s top instructors.

 

Let me clarify my question.

Which professional drivers do you know who don't left food brake?

 

see post 37

 

Thanks for the input, everyone.

I put it up on a thread because somebody made the statement that this was an entirely bad practice for conventional automatic transmissions on the road. I disagreed and said I had always done this since I was a teenager.

I think that what I am seeing here is that LFB is much more common on both the track and street than I had realized.

 

I have the same amount of control over both legs, therefore I LFB.

 

The commentators were speculating that one reason Will Powers was faster than his teammates was that he LFB'd, while Helio still RFBs.

 

Sorry, Sameer, my question is intended for Jompen.

 

If you read my post, it says to be 'truly' fast on a race track (and I grossly lead an assumption of competition there, which I probably should not...)

I know some very fast drivers who are not LFB'ers as well - BUT - they are consistently beaten by their compatriots who are proficient in LFB technique. The reason is simple physics. LFB allows us to very finely manage weight transfer and also keep revs up. The weight transfer issue is bigger than the revs (believe it or not) as it allows us to gently attack a turn and keep the car at the 100% of traction boundary. Using the right foot to brake indicates coming all but full off, if not full off throttle to initiate braking, so the car is now decelerating AND the weight transfer is earlier and more dramatic. Overlapping inputs of braking and throttle allows much smoother weight transfer and higher overall momentum throughout the traversal of a turn that requires brakes. (I won't explore H-T braking technique to apply both pedals with the right foot, simply because there's still a BIG throttle lift involved and the point here seems to be comparing LFB to RFB-only methods.)

I'm not saying you can't be fast, just that by proficiently using LFB you can be faster. It's also not a panacea - there are turns that are just as well fit (or sometimes arguably better fit) for RFB. So, the real answer is - IT DEPENDS...

I sometimes RFB in the same turn that I LFB in during an earlier lap - likely because I did something different (made a mistake) that requires me to come off throttle more and RFB is easier or in line with what the car needs to make the corner.

As for the reference to Rubens, unless they fabricated him a special footwell, it's going to be very difficult for him to RFB in his F1 car. I can't speak to his operation in any other car. As for the reference to most (or even some) F1 drivers not LFBing, I have to disagree on that one. The space between the two pedals in most paddle shifted formula cars is taken by the steering linkage. This combined with the fact that there is just not a lot of room down there to start with makes pressing a pedal opposite the intended foot so challenging that too much time would be taken physically making the maneuver happen resulting in extreme lap time and position penalties.

I can tell you that when I coach an 'old dog' racer who think they can't learn new tricks on how to get better results through LFB, they are amazed at both the differnce they feel on the track as well as the corresponding data results (read grossly - lap times) once they become comfortable and proficient in the technique.

The attached image of a RedBull F1 car is not atypical for most F1 footwells.

lmpdesigner here on the forum (Brian) could probably shed much more light on the physical constraints in most of these cars from a design and construction standpoint. Brian?...

Cheers & C U @ d'Track!!
C

Chuck Hawks,
Pro-Driver, Coach, Instructor & Facilitator
DreamsFulfilled, LLC & rEvolution Performance Driving System ©
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Chuck - All good points

RFBers are primarily the relics from the 1980s before the advent of the paddle shift.

Rubens is/was one as was David Coulthard and Olivier Panis.

When David moved to Red Bull, he was forced to switch to LFB due to the narrowed out pedal box.

There is an awesome video that shows the difference between Michael and Rubens while they were teammates at Ferrari. Michael used to get a 0.1- 0.3 second advantage over Rubens through just corner entry (Michael used to brake earlier and stay later but used to use less braking quantity overall compared to Rubens - he used to also use a whiff of throttle to balance the car while his left foot was on the brakes).

Olivier Panis mentioned in an interview that he used to RFB for the big stops and LFB when he wanted to slightly trim the speed.

 

Linky to another comparison here: http://teamslow.aitchison.org/viewtopic.php?t=4807&sid=50729b208a4fa4a5f489aaf258c5f9f2

I guess I'm a relic, but I see the advantages. And no, you're doing no harm to the 'box.

 

The only left foot brakers I know are the blue hairs with the flickering tail lights. My wife was really irritated that a car she was following would have the brakes lights come on as they accelerated. So it's only the bad, insecure drivers that we ever notice. I don't do it at all, but I'm against any sort of hovering. And that is what causes the flickering tail lights, folks who hover over that brake pedal, on the flip side, I'd take the flickering tail light over another old person wiping out a store front and 5 pedestrians. The hijack is the tough balance between people too old to be driving and their individual freedoms vs public safety.

 

After speaking to a few professionel drivers about this, I agree 100 % with your post above, it depends. I´ll ask some of the faster Ferrari challenge/GT2 drivers there is about this as well. I´ll get back with the answers.

About a F1 car, the one I have driven had 3 pedals (-89), that makes LFB only possible for balancing.