Comments on F40 prices anyone?

Some time ago, more than one voice was raised predicting the economic crisis would affect the F40-prices substantially. Levels of 180-200 000 USD were mentioned as very likely levels when the owners would be forced to sell their toys. Some of us disputed this but many were certain about the doomsday levels.

I doubt any single car was sold even near these levels, and if anything, prices are higher than ever for the F40 in Europe. The same goes for other collectible Ferraris, and other similar cars as well, like the Miura SV or Porsche Carrera RS. Or the Stratos, and many others.

I never beleived the doomsday theories, but my private opinion is of no interest here. I just found it sad for the owners of these wonderful cars to hear all this negative guesswork about eroding prices for these fine cars, beeing confused with sub-prime stockmarket portfolios. The latter was corrected because they never had any inner value near their listings, but real and classic items will always be long-lasting and recover. And they deserve respect instead of loud voices of warning based on parallells to totally different assets.

New crisis will come again, maybe even soon, since the modern financial markets are very volatile. But let us protect the values of the fine collectible Ferraris next time instead of treating them like stock options. I think that they deserve that, and I can only hope that no owner of F40s or similar cars was scared to sell at low prices based on the doomsday predictions. If anything, the enthusiasts of this fine site should stick together and protect our values instead of spreading predictions of rapidly eroding prices, without proof or confirmation. This was sad reading, and maybe with hopes to buy built into part of the predictions. Let us hope we will be wiser next time and not see this debate again.

As always, anyone is free to dispute my opinion, but please let it be built on facts this time.

Regards to you all!
Caley

 

Interesting that the mater is still active like nothing has happened since the last debate.

But here we go:

Prices for european F40s have increased over the last 2 years, and anyone who follows the market can verify that. You can not buy a decent F40 in europe today below EUR 280-300 K. Two years ago you could do that, and I follow this market with great interest on an almost daily basis. Prices are at least EUR 50 K higher.

And to clarify, I am talking about prices and not currencyadjusted exchange rates. Adding exchange rates and inflation into the equation is beside the topic because the issue is not comparing F40s to other investment options, but discussing if they are heading towards USD 180-200 K or not. And the facts does not support such a trend. The economic downfall that supported the doomsday predictions is halted, and has turned, with increases in financial markets from the low point of more than 50% in many markets. So why should the F40s continue down the doomsday road alone?

I am happy with my kidneys, and have no fear of loosing them over this. But if I wanted an extra pair, the bet against yours for F40s not dropping to less than USD 200 K probably has the best odds in the market. But I do not want them - I prefer discussing the market for F40s, and anyone claiming that the F40s are falling in price in Europe is clearly not following the market. A friend just bought one at EUR 300 K, and he is a car dealer planning to make a profit on the car.

Let us stay with our own kidneys and discuss facts that are easily available in the market, and let us not move away from the topic with exchange rates and inflation, or adjusted prices due to index baskets of capital goods over time. Let us just stay with the question of F40s falling towards USD 180-200 K. It would be very interesting to take part in the support for that theory on a sensible basis. That is enough for this debate.

Regards to you all!
Caley

 

Could very well be the fact, but please note the issue at hand - will they drop to USD 200 K?
Not likely, and even if Europe has more F40s than the US, there is a strong demand for good F40s in Europe as well, especially in Italy, so do not expect a flood of additional cars.

Caley

 

How nice that you found the Stich car, but before you question if people understand or not, take a little more time to look. This car is priced at EUR 270 K. The price you quote is GBP, and as I understand you have a currency interest.

And yes I am willing to buy at USD 200 K, still and always, but none is on offer at this level.
On the site where you probably found the Stich car and missed the currency, you will notice that the other cars on offer are priced from EUR 310 to 400 K. I suggest that you investigate the different cars on this site more carefully, and you will understand the difference in price.

But why make this a debate about currency, Greece and financial predictions? The question raised is very simple. Most of the world is through the deepest levels of the financial crisis, including the US even if the structural problems there are far worse than many european countries. So the trend is no longer negative and facts can be gathered. Did any decent F40 sell at USD 200 K? Ever?

Regarding demand and supply, I am familiar with this theory, but the number of existing cars is not equal to the number offered for sale. And with lower prices predicted by yourself, this should reduce the supply from the owners who are unwilling to sell at low prices, so the balance is really about actual supply and demand. Isn´t economy interesting *L* ?

I raised this thread in order to look back and compare the predictions with what actually happened, but obviously it is still a hot issue. So let us not raise the stakes more than necessary. To me, facts are clear and most marketplaces tell of far higher prices than the doomsday predictions, and the economy is more stable at the same time. This is proof enough, because it is not predictions or theory, it is facts.

Regards to you all!
Caley

 

Look more carful at this advert on mobile - the pictures are from a US car, with engine bay from a non cat car and interior from a third car. We have seen these "cars" before on mobile, and my advice is to read between the lines before entering these "down-payment-offers".

And we are discussing the general market level for F40 prices, not one offer which is most certanly a scam.

Caley

 

Plenty of questions - interesting approach.

Look at the car at mobile and compare with the description of the "black leather interior".
What do you think about all this yourself? That an ad at mobile where nothing matches, for a high milage car from an unidentified seller, is the best indication of market prices?

To me, the biggest questionmark is how prices can be predicted at below USD 200 K by

- referring to odd adds where nothing matches
- misreading GBP for EUR
- comparisions to inflation to describe how low the value actually is today
- exchange rate discussions and predictions about the relation between the USD and EUR
- references to possible very high milage cars
- discussions about the financial crisis

Wow, all this instead of a single answer - is the general market for F40s supported by any facts that they will trade below USD 200K?

No such proof is available, and to my opinion the trend is upwards for these cars. I try to deal with facts because it is much more reliable than predictions. Anyone can check the car sites and see if the trading prices are generally supporting the doomsday predictions or not.

I am an investor in the financial market, just like yourself, and we all have differing opinions on a daily basis. And there is always a crisis in the economy in some area, and in others it is not. But generally the world markets are more stable now than 8-9 months ago. Of course it will be new crisis again, but also new booms. It is a part of the game, but this is not a thread for financial discussions, and I have no intention to dispute your personal opinion. It is yours and I respect it. I just can not find any proof for it in the marketplace, so I have an opposite opinion than yours.

And I have asked a very simple question:
has any F40 of normal milage and condition sold below USD 200 K, and is this a trend for the rest of the F40 market? My best answer to that is no, since I have no knowledge of other than the opposite. So I think I will let others debate this for a while now, so we both can see which opinion is supported, which was the general idea of the tread.

And regarding your question about the 288 GTO, I have one myself, and was recently offered more than USD 600 for it. By a buyer I know and will pay any day if I change my mind. This is facts to me. In my opinion, the market is what is really happening, not what people guess or think but do not do. But of course, we are all different - that is the charm of life!

Take care!
Caley