Emission Test Failed...help with codes needed

Welcome to F-Chat. You can use the search function to answer most questions. I just did a quick search and p1691 seems to be an open circuit in your check engine light (ie. someone removed the bulb).

P0432 & P0422 are catalyst efficiency codes (bad cats or O2 sensors). P0341 = Camshaft Position Sensor Circuit.


Good Luck

 

Congrats on the purchase and welcome to Fchat!

If the check engine light was removed when you purchased it absolutely go back to the seller and ask them what's up. I had the same thing, but didn't notice until 6 months later when I went to register it. and mine actually passed a dealer PPI, goes to show what that was worth.

Depending on where you are in PA, a great local expert shop to help is Pocono Sportscar (near NY border).

 

Sounds like the previous owner removed the Check Engine light bulb...you can easily remove the cluster and confirm. Two Phillips screws to the left and right side of the instrument housing is all that is required. Release the steering wheel height adjuster so the wheel drops down, and place a towel across it to protect.

As previously mentioned the most likely diagnosis for your problems (which still need to be confirmed by a Ferrari Technician:

P0341 probably a bad cam position sensor, a simple repair to swap it out for a new one. Not sure of cost, but probably less than $100 for the part plus 10 minutes labor to swap it out.

P0422 and P0342 "low catalyst efficiency"...which invariably means the cats have failed. A VERY common problem, I have replaced four on my car alone! But again, an inspection or post cat CO/HC test will tell you for sure. New factory cats are expensive...aftermarket may be a better option. (about $2200 for the pair plus a couple hours labor)

P1691 Not sure, that has been requested for information, but is not on the list anyone seems to have...it may go away with fixing the other stuff....maybe.

Good luck with the previous owner...he is probably going to claim ignorance...heck, maybe he was suckered himself...but there may be a duty for him to correct before selling to you...I am not an attorney.

BTW, who did the PPI? Any shop worth their salt would have noticed the CE light not illuminating upon start up (key in "on" position, but before cranking), AND they should have scanned for codes with an OBDII code scanner as part of the inspection.

 

Let me preface by saying I'm not a professional mechanic or a Ferrari expert but have learned alot on this and other chat rooms. I too am new to 355 ownership. Most of what we will experience as new owners has happened to others before and the search feature is a tremendous asset.

I am assuming you do not have a Check Engine light on, correct? If so, then the bulb was probably removed by the prior owner to avoid fixing the real problem(s). The catalyst codes seem to be common when cats are changed to aftermarket or fail or when O2 sensors fail. Not sure what the implications of the cam position sensor code are.

I'm sure other more seasoned experts will chime in here but I would get it to an experienced mechanic before putting on too many more miles.

 

I am also NOT a Ferrari technician...but don't believe it would be common to get "catalyst low efficiency" codes with a bad O2 sensor, either pre or post cat...as there are specific codes for various types of O2 sensor malfunctions and failures.

As you stated, the "catalyst low efficiency" codes are most commonly caused by failed cats, or sometimes an incompatible aftermarket catalyst.

 

If your mechanic does not have an OBDII scanner , find another mechanic. You may mean he does not have and SD1 or SD2 (proprietary Ferrari), that is okay, if he has a generic OBDII scanner. Seriously, take it to a competent Ferrari tech, either dealer or independent, but do NOT take it to someone who is not intimately knowledgeable on the F355...this is not a car you want someone learning on, no matter how experienced they are with other cars. There are just way too many idiosyncrasies with these cars.

If you don't want "check engine" lights, you are going to need to get a high quality replacement. Either recore the originals, or buy aftermarket. The oem ones will fail again in 15k to 25k...they are crap.

 

Be sure to confirm the cats are in need of replacement with a post cat emission sniffer check and physical examination. It only takes 15 minutes per side to remove and confirm their condition. I am guessing the ceramic cores have broken loose from the housings...that is the usual failure mode. Post picks when you get them off.

 

Once your bulb is back in and working you should be able to clear all of those codes.

It is NOT uncommon for a 355 to throw an o2 code- and it does not always mean you need to repalce your sensors or cats.

I'd try to clear the codes first and drive the thing- You'll need about 150 miles and 4 or 5 drive cycles to get the car back to "ready" for Emissions. Anybody with a good OBDIi reader can do all of the above.

 

P1691 is probably open circuit on your CEL. P1692 was short circuit on mine.

 

Seriously? I have never heard of that here, or from anyone of my friends that owns a 355. Invariably when the CE lights up, there was an actual problem that needed attention.

 

His CEL was either burned out or not present, so that in and of itself relates an error code that will not allow the car to pass emissions.

In my conversations with several very well qualified Ferrari shops they have related to me stories of several codes present on cars brought in for routine service that checked out OK- they cleared the codes and the car was able to pass Massachusetts emissions tests after putting enough miles on it to be in a "ready' state.

A CEL does not immediately mean that components need to be replaced. Obviously he'd need to get the car to a shop who can read the codes, determine whether any components are in fact bad and then clear the codes.... whether actual mechanical work is needed is not known at this time.

Without the CEL functioning you cannot get the car ready for an emission test- with a functioning CEL you can- and then if the CEl comes on again you know you have a systematic problem that needs to be addressed.

 

I understand about the light, and was not saying it did not need to be corrected. Agreed one needs to confirm the issue before replacing anything...(see my posts in the OP's various threads he has started where I stated exactly that). Granted my sample is small based on myself and three friends with 355's plus the posts I read here over the past several years. It certainly is of little consequence to clear the codes and see if they come back, but my experience is that you will likely be disappointed with the results of that method.

I apologize for not being more clear, I was only questioning the issue of "phantom codes" not his need to replace the CE bulb and verify the other two codes. Failed catalysts and O2 sensors are probably the two most common causes of CE lights on 355's.

 

Yeah agreed-

My car threw all four O2 sensor codes and a crank sensor code- After exhaustively checking everything we cleared the codes and all was well. If there's one problem with 355's it's the fairly touchy ECU programming that throws far too many CELs.

Obviously it's important to always check out a CEL- we've all heard far too many horoor stories about deferred maintenance and it's ultimate cost.

 

I think wiping off the o2's would do just about nothing. If you're going to the trouble of removing them, just replace them. Mine were working fine on a scanner but they were original so I knew a new set would switch faster. (and there was sometimes a very slight surge sensation at steady cruise and low throttle openings)

With new o2's in the car it runs perfectly smooth.

My stock cats were fine but I went ahead and replaced them with metallic as the consensus seems to be that if they havn't failed they will.

I don't like test pipes on these cars as I don't like to smell like unburned hydrocarbons.

I did remove the secondary cats on mine. (which only operate when the bypass valve opens so I don't get any smell in the cabin). After looking at them I don't think it's really worth the effort in terms of flow.

 

+1. And remember, you (Charles) don't have O2 sensor codes, you have low catalyst efficiency codes. The Motronic monitors O2 function and will throw a separate code if they are bad. I agree that a "lazy" switching O2 sensor can get past the Motronic and not set a code, that has been seen here before.

Bottom line on the Techron fuel additive is "good luck". Won't hurt to try. It is a bit early for cats, they usually last to 17 to 20k miles.....but there is always the exception. Let us know what happens. And what about the code for the bad cam position sensor? That still needs to be address, and I doubt even more that fuel additive is going to help there either.

 

Charles, I can only communicate my own experience. My 355 has those Cat below efficiency codes, both sides when I picked it up. I cleared the codes, put 800 miles on the car with 4 tanks of gas. With each tank of gas, I added a bottle of Chevron Techroline bought at the gas station and drove the snot out of the car until the next fill up.

So far, the codes have not returned. I cannot say that they won't return, just that they have not returned. Good luck to you with this. Remember to drive the snot out of it.

 

Good to know it worked for someone, I stand corrected!

 

Long live the Italian tune up!!!

Once the smogging is done, cat bypasses will be worthwhile in your state, you lucky dog! If you want new cats, look for hi flow metallic core versions - check with gothspeed here since he has some pretty cool ones at a very reasonable cost for fellow gel heads. Tubi is way to screechy for my sensitive ears; Larini is just loud. You might be happy with just the cat bypasses. Try them and see. You might save some cash.

 

After spending the day at the dealer yesterday, they did the fuel block update and also a obdII connector update (adding a additional grounding pin) that would allow communication to calif smog machines.
I should have not taken for granted that they would not check there work. Had they hooked to a machine, knowing i needed a smog they would have cleared and diaged the code. From reading the Fab Forum I am understanding a open circuit, Bulb, Connection or Cable on the Check engine light. I have never seen it lite up, I will search further for a procedure to extract the bulb and make available the circuit for testing. hope to meet some of you soon in cali next month.

 

Peter, there are several threads on removing the instrument cluster and replacing the various bulbs. It is very easy, two Phillips screws on each side, at the bottom of the cluster. Lower the steering wheel first, and drap a towel across the steering column to protect from scratches. All the instruments can be simply unplugged, then you can take the cluster into the house to work on it.

You may wish to buy new bulbs for the illumination "while you are in there" and replace them all. Pm me via email if you need any help or suggestions.