Left foot braking with automatics?

Another great discussion I've been MIA on due to travel.
Great stuff!

Keep it coming!

That topic of the throttle-killing nanny "feature" thanks to a knee-jerking gov't who likes to address symptoms over root problems does concern me. But, just like the 1-4 Skip Shift Eliminators made for 'Vettes, I'm sure someone will devise a gadget to override it. Personally, I'd rather train people how to actually drive before over-automating the vehicles we drive but such seems the way of the future...

ROFLOL - Yeah, until his hair turns blue! (Just kidding) I have often wondered if we should, starting at the age of 65, all have to renew our license every YEAR and take a complete test to do so. This might eliminate some of the acutal risks of older people driving who maybe shouldn't be. My 80 year old father comes to mind...

Cheers & C U @ d'Track!!
C

Chuck Hawks,
Pro-Driver, Coach, Instructor & Facilitator
rEvolution Performance Driving System

 

I understand the intent of your comment, but it's not true. The reason the steering linkage occupies the space between the pedals in an F1 car is because the nose is so high (the pedals are actually higher than the driver's butt). "Most" paddle shifted formula cars are cars with an add-on paddle shifter control (DSRs and the like), and can be either LFB or RFB, driver's choice. I can't find any pictures of an indycar foot box but I'd bet you can choose either method with those as well.

No, you can LFB virtually every formula race car in existence. 3 pedals is not a limitation for LFB -- you do not need to declutch a dog ring gearbox for shifting.

 

oops, DSRs aren't formula cars of course ... so substitute F1000

 

"That topic of the throttle-killing nanny "feature" thanks to a knee-jerking gov't who likes to address symptoms over root problems does concern me. But, just like the 1-4 Skip Shift Eliminators made for 'Vettes, I'm sure someone will devise a gadget to override it. Personally, I'd rather train people how to actually drive before over-automating the vehicles we drive but such seems the way of the future..."



That nanny has been here since the early 1990s, but it is getting more and more invasive.

Hold your foot on the brake of a 2010 Corvette automatic while stepping on the throttle at a stop, the engine will just sputter long before the rear tires will try to spin.

By 2012 all North American GM automatic transmission cars will have some type of “Brake Override Software"

This video link explains brake override.


http://gbc.feedroom.com/?fr_story=2d1b1e68c7de092c84287f0476462de8ed12d46a

 

Left foot braking is great but you must be very securely strapped in the car with, hopefully a 6 point harness. Otherwise when you brake your body moves forward because you do not have your left foot on the "dead pedal" to keep your but in the seat. This can cause you to over brake. So I say, LFB when totally strapped in with a harness. RFB when using a 3 point (normal seat belt).

 

very intelligent comment....but with modern abs over braking is not an issue

....plus with lfb applying both brake and gas at the same time can be beneficial, heating brakes in cold, heating brakes in rain, weight transferetc etc etc etc

 

I always left-foot brake in an automatic. I've actually been doing it since I started driving, even though I had been taught to brake with my right foot. I took my car down to an empty parking lot and practiced. Once I got comfortable with left-foot braking, I tried it on the street and haven't looked back.

Next, I would like to learn how to heel-and-toe properly.

 

Now we know who drives around with their brake lights flashing on and off randomly with no indication of what the driver is doing. If you want to use both feet, please take your left foot OFF the brake. Don't just rest it there. The rest of us on the road would appreciate knowing what you are doing. Thanks.

 

Absolutely correct, and when I asked why the instructor went into great detail to explain that with a fly by wire throttle linked to the ESP computer you confuse the ABS system by the slight "overide" you get by riding the brake, even for a milisecond. He went onto demonstrate on a diagnostic printout how the "electric brain" gets all confused with simultaneous opposing signals, one for go and one for stop. This can result in rough idling or stalling, ensuring your 360 or 430 will need a diagnostic reboot. Its all different for track driving, hence what someone said about Schumacher RFB on his road car. (i.e. the prescribed way to operate the machine) To be honest I always found 2 pedal Ferraris to have an uncomfortable brake position for LFB anyhow, so design by function eh? I was taught that LFB braking in a road car is an abominable way to drive and I can see why.

 

Spent time reading the posts above. This has been a very interesting thread with lots of debate. I would like to chip in my opinion on Left Foot Braking (LFB).

When I was learning how to drive, I got scolded by my instructor for using my left foot to brake. But after getting my licence, I started to accustom myself to lfb. Yes, it will start out to be weird to lfb. First timers will stomp greatly on the brake pedal. But after a few days of practice, you're good to go and modulate your braking pressure thru your left foot.
I guess it's a matter of habit and being conscious of using which foot to brake. I switch between lfb and rfb when driving. Most brake pedals in cars are installed higher than the accelerator, hence making it difficult or even tiring to brake at such a height. People say that in times of emergency, a lfb-er will jam both the brakes and accelerator together, resulting in undesirable consequences.

I beg to differ. It always takes an extra effort to know that the left foot is for braking. Ever since getting my licence, I've been able to drive auto and manual with no problems.
From a racing pt of view, I believe there is much time to be gained from lfb. The transition period when one lifts his right foot from the accelerator to brake pedal will have contributed significantly to the lap timings, hundredths of seconds. If one is fine with lfb and can perfect his or her braking technique, lfb is definitely the way to go.


Cheers
Douglas

 

I have a fairly thin foot but a size 11/12 depending on the type of shoe and it just seems that not matter which car I drive my feet hit each other. Even with racing shoes I always seem to rub. Just for laughs but when I drove my Escalade after reading the posts today I tried to LFB and I felt like I was squashing my man parts. I guess some cars are not designed for that

 

What is the point in a new test each year (starting at any age!) when the driving tests do not really test ability to control a vehicle under real road conditions. I run across so many "drivers" who would be banned from the road if I were tzar. And I don't see any real relationship with age. In fact, right now I think the older folks who are totally incompetent are considerably outnumbered by drivers of younger ages and vehicles. Haven't yet seen any old folks on the cell phone, smoking a cig, all while trying to negotiate traffic! And if this were a rant I could really go on and on.

What is a real road test you ask?
Well - I signed my daughter up for a 2 day Tracktime performance school when she turned 18 and became eligible. A lot of that basic stuff could be condensed into something that would save lives if mandatory and made affordable.
If I had any more teen aged kids they would have to do the same, even if it pinched the budget a bit. Just like saving for college!

Cheers
Warren

 

I recently drove a friends new 458 and as per usual.................left foot brake.

 

This is very interesting... HOWEVER, it is counter to my experience. I LFB my Stradale ... and I'm sure there's brief overlap in many corners when I'm driving aggressively... and have experimented with intentionally staying on the gas in certain short corners where I need to shift weight to the front tires but want to keep the drivetrain pushing. I've never seen my car show any signs of confusion. Certainly never had to reboot it.

In fact, the prescribed way to launch the car would involve pressing on both pedals at once... so, I know the CS is designed to handle that in at least some scenarios. And since you're told to press both pedals at once there, not sure I buy the argument that they positioned the brake awkwardly for LFB to discourage you from LFB... I think that's more just because they positioned the pedals the same as a standard 360 (which needs space for the clutch pedal).

 

The first time I drove an F1 gearbox car was a 360C at the track. I instantly fell into left foot braking, and within a few laps I had the modulation part down. But more importantly, I was quicker. That was subsequently LFB all 2 pedal cars, all the time.

 

Morons trailbraking on I-95 at 65 MPH in a straight line for miles. Seen em many a time. But, if he can drive that way - more power to him. Many can't and many more shouldn't.

Me - I can drive either way. I prefer LFB on track and RFB on street.

 

I felt the urge to speak up and be heard on this subject as the fundamentals of left foot braking have not really been mentioned, a couple of people have commented in a round about way.
As a Mitsubishi Evo 7 rally driver I can speak with experience as there is no place where car contol is more important.

The principle benefit achieved from LFB is the weight transfer on the vehicle, this will combat understeer, help to unsettle the back end when required etc.
Not only that the brake pedal is always covered with the left foot in anticipation and the accelerator pedal can be used at anytime, keeping up engine revs, saving time and improving car control
Watch some 'in footwell' footage from a good rally driver, its magical to see the harmonisation between accelerator and brake pedal.

Having said that my evo turns in really well and there is no huge need for left foot braking but I still use it for some of the other reasons I mentioned! Takes years to master!!!

Hope this helps a little!

 

I left foot brake with all automatics.
Its just more fun.
Problem is when you come from a stick shift car and the brain forgets to switch over. Go for that "clutch" pedal and...
Make sure your belts are fastened and no-one is on your bumper.

 

Left Foot Braking is fun when driving a Hot Hatch Front Wheel Drive Car, like a Mini Cooper S JCW, it stabilizes the rear of the car when cornering hard

Greetz,


Joseph