Herb Chambers C&C

Not rescheduled. It's every second Saturday of the month. The trick is figuring out where it will be held next.

I don't expect this post to last long anyway.

 

Why shouldn't the thread last long?

 

Because the event is a blatant advertisement and wholly against the rules on this forum.

Plus I don't want to be threatened for banning because I'm involved with it or being told I put some member up to posting it to avoid rules, so it would be better if they just removed it before an admin got here and blamed me for it.

I know this sounds stupid, but just trust me. I don't post any events or events that I'm associated with on this forum, ever (the GTG is Jay's event btw). It just saves a lot of headache and grief.

 

Why ban someone or remove something if other members may really enjoy attending? Isn't that the point of the forum is to spread the word and direct others to events we may not otherwise hear of?

 

nope, the forum is a business, and maximizing revenue and profit is the goal the part about cars and owners is secondary after expenses hehe

 

That is the truth.

 

+1

And Allen is a great guy.

 

These events are good with sweet cars if the weather is perfect and no other events/shows/races are on the same day.

Ferrari of NE opened the show to everyone, which brought out a huge ricer/bondo/beater crowd ... not sure if Herb has had the same results

 

As someone who watched the Honda thing be born, grow, peak, decline and now wither away in the ghetto, stuff like this makes me so sad. It went from enthusiasts who put their all into a car to now, where the cars are cobbled together w/ ebay parts and stolen parts--just rolling messes. The riff-raff ruined it all.

a) I drive a nice one b) I parked it well away from the exotics when I went to a Herb Cambers show last summer. Time and place, I suppose.

 

I know this may fall on deaf ears, but I remember when the Hot Rod guys called the bikes rice rockets and imports were big time scoffed at. Then the racers scoffed at the street guys. Then the rally cars scoffed at the smaller imports. I've seen an EVO 8 owners yelling at Ralliart guys car saying he didn't want his car parked next to him and then 350Z owners saying they were with the exotics and that the SRT-4 guys were just Neons and should stay away and as our automotive community continues to diversify it will change as well.

You would think in the last 100 years we would understand what prejudice was and change.

Let me explain to you what I don't want parked next to me or talking to me. A guy who thinks he's better than me or a guy whose self-esteem is so low that he feels that he needs to belittle me to be bigger. You know the guy who says, "my car is faster than yours and costs half as much"? You know who you are.

So if you see someone with an eBay special Integra maybe you should ask them why they did what they did. Maybe you'll understand they don't have the money to do it right and they feel like junk because of it and you letting them park next to you just made them feel accepted and have hope that one day they'll be able to do their car right. Otherwise, they see you as a stuck up, etc. etc. and congratulations on creating the stereotype that I fight so hard against.

I'm in this because I like people who like cars. So all I care about is that you come out to whatever event and enjoy the cars and the diversity. We don't have to like everything, but we should be able to enjoy each other's company.

 

good writeup, but I shudder to think what Enzo is doing in the grave when a Daytona has a bondoed ricer parked next to it not about attitude or pretension, just common sense. Same goes for the eyesore house in the neighborhood that is falling apart and lawn is a jungle. Or when you go to a nice restaurant, and the guy next to you is in jeans and T shirt ....

 

I get your angle, darthnefas. Hell, musclecar guys are curious and complementary when my car is near them at a show/cruise night. However, I don't even try to show my car at a high-end/exotic show/cruise. It's irrelevant and uninteresting there. Understandably, a guy w/ an Italian exotic (vintage or modern) isn't going to care about a Civic--regardless of how well-modded it is and regardless of how much it's been autocrossed and tracked.

Meanwhile, I'm a car nerd who has soaked up an encyclopedia's worth of knowledge about just about every segment of the automotive hobby. No one thinks about that when they see a Honda.

As for the state of the import "scene". Well, my piece of junk, daily driver beater, 321k mile Civic hatchback (that was once nice) was stolen out of my driveway--from a nice house in a nice neighborhood and found completely stripped in a rough section of Providence--by these same "enthusiasts". So yeah--I'm definitely biased.

As a 15 year vet of the Honda "scene", I've experienced all of these biases. At this time, in the Northeast, a really undesirable element has taken over much of that "scene". There's no denying it. I'll even sound elitist--the desirable cars that once cost $20-30k to do a "proper" build on are now dirt-cheap and attainable to the same element who are in the circles that steal them (in the same ghetto where my car was found stripped).

Seeing a beat-up, cobbled-together Civic with a (most likely stolen) 99-00 front end conversion sitting on cut springs just makes me sad. Even when I was younger, I'd save up for the "good" parts--granted, this was well before ebay was flooded with knockoffs of everything. The web boards of yore would always echo the sentiment of "save for the quality parts rather than cutting corners".

This manifesto is all rather self-loathing when you think about it, but that's how it turned out. It was all downhill after the Fast and the Furious. The VW scene stayed safely underground and the Honda scene got raped.

I'm an outsider looking into the Italian exotic arena with great interest, respect and enthusiasm (especially toward the vintage stuff). I'll be the guy who hung onto the car he built in his 20's that he just can't get rid of--much like many other car enthusiasts in this country. I'm already well on my way.

So, Tifosi--that's how it is on the other side of the tracks.

 

lol, The way you're seeing it is very logical. The question I have is, who let the bondo car into the car show? My point isn't bondo. Again, I think we're seeing, as was posted above, the stereotypes involved. When I say Civic, everyone sees a dark skinned latino kid in a hoody with a non-matching doors and stolen engine with bondo holding the bumper together. Trust me, that kid isn't showing up to ANY show that a Daytona would remotely be involved with.

So a respected low-rider club shows up with cars that are straight up artwork and they want to park next to the fully restored Daytona? Is it still a problem? I would hope not. Best off, I've seen these shows in Cali and they're awesome.

So both the responses weren't based on the brand, but the person that made that stereotype.

As for the guy in the jeans. Why do you care what he wears? Stop looking at his table and enjoy your food. You just never know if that nice suit your wearing is a faux paus to the French guy who is glaring at you two tables over and if he told you your suit was junk I could only imagine the reaction. The reality is the French guy could be right. How would you like him to treat you?

As for the junky house? Don't think that there isn't a fair share of Ferraris I've seen out there that the owners didn't treat their 355 quite the way we would've liked. It wouldn't stop me from letting them into the show, but should I tell them they can't park their junky Ferrari next to the Daytona? We can't control that. We really just need to worry about ourselves in that matter and hope that the example that we set does the trick.

 

Agreed, artwork cars are fine, clean and ok. But it is a fine line when the bondo ricers show up and don't have the sense to know their place.

Dress codes in the best restaurants; say you take the love of your life out, and you plan to propose to her with the ring. Right when you think all is perfect, joe schmoe gets in looking like a schlub that is dressed for McDonalds. Makes you wonder if paying the high price is worth the ****ty milieu.

Another example; you live in a rural area, and you own some land/fields. Common courtesy is that you let equestrians pass through, maybe an ATV, etc.. So you make it clear, love to help out the neighbors, but last thing you want is to have friends over to enjoy the view, and then comes Joe Schmoe on the ATV doing donuts in the field in view of your house. Makes the homeowner look like a tool getting walked on. And you try to be discreet, and not involve the PoPos. Some people in this world just do not have manners or respect, whether it be private property, dinging others' cars in a lot, or showing up to a show and being out of place.

 

...so I could park my immaculate garage queen Civic next to a swirled, buffer-trail laden Ferrari and still feel welcome? (I'd still feel like an elephant in the room)

Regardless, this is good (and interesting) discourse.

BTW

<--38 y/o Italian-American dude who used to confuse the Asian kids who drove modded Hondas back when no one knew that Hondas could be modded--certainly not by a white guy in MA (back then).

 

Know their place? Those are some strong words there. I guess I have to ask myself, are any of us that special, regardless of what car we drive? Is my place at the back of the bus because I like driving.

My friends and I always have these little debates about cars we want. Mine for instance is a Ford Escort Cosworth RS. 7,200 of the car was produced in total over about 5 years specifically used as homologation vehicles for racing. They even have a motorsport version that didn't come with sound deadening. In my view, this car is exotic in all the right ways. They stopped production in '96 because the new noise regulations didn't allow for the loud exhaust.

I've seen the car I wanted (grey) parked next to a Bugatti Veyron at the Greenwich Concours. If I dig I could find pictures. Nobody knew what the car was, but Miller Motorcars never even batted an eye when it rolled up next to the Veyron and subtly parked. They didn't realize that there were less of that Escort in the U.S. than there were Veyrons.

Here is one picture (noticed CT plates): http://sportscaradvisors.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/1995-cosworth-ford-rs-escort.jpg

The idea is, you just don't know.

And again, if I'm proposing to my soon-to-be wife a guy in a full clown suit could be sitting 2 tables over balancing plates on his head and I'm not going to see him. It just isn't going to happen as I'm thinking about how I'm getting the ring into the champagne. I know why the clown is there, because the food is good! Maybe it's just because I have rich friends who don't even own a single suit, who own upwards of 10+ exotics. Who do they have to impress? Nobody. So it isn't the cheap guy you have to worry about because when a guy drives up in a Zonda they don't care what he's wearing, he's getting escorted to the best seat in the house.

I've never had a kid stupid enough to drive through my yard with an ATV. I'm from the South and southern justice rarely involves the police unless they need to clean up a body.

 

herb just hasnt had a great turn out in the least bit...

 

Keep in mind this is Ferrarichat. It's not bringallcarstotheshowchat

Personally, I'm very happy to chat with enthusiasts of any marque. Heck I was a 'ricer' for years with my heavily modded STi, which is still an amazing car and my daily driver...and a 'gearhead' with my '69 Firebird. But I think political correctness has run amok saying that any car should be included in any show. Why is it wrong for someone to host an 'exotics' show? I've attended many muscle car shows which have an age cutoff - no 'modern' cars allowed. Makes sense to maintain a common theme...and with regards to the restaurant analogy, finer establishments may say jacket required. Prejudice against those without jackets???? Hardly...they're maintaining a common theme and I see absolutely no problem with that.

I haven't been to the Herb Chambers shows only because they're a bit far away...but I would guess that an open invite to the whole automotive world would turn away some exotics who would like to participate in an exotics only event. Given the thousands of other single marque events, I see no problem at all with that concept.

 

I'm not against Exotic ONLY events if it's clarified what exotics can attend. I think if you don't include Luxury in that you'll end up having guys that fit in who won't come because they don't "feel" their car is exotic. I'm still amazed that Audi R8 guys don't think their cars (using engines from Gallardos) can't hang with the exotics!

My point only involved open shows.

If you're only going to exotic events or one make events I think you're missing out on a lot.

If you keep it to ONLY Ferrari then you're missing out on Bentley, Rolls-Royce, Aston, Jaguar, Lamborghini, Maserati, Fiat, Audi, BMW, Mercedes, TVR, Gumpert, Zonda, Koenigsegg, and Bugatti!

The problem is this isn't California. This ideal of not parking next to each other and being Ferrari only kinda thing is a New England mindset.

Go to a Cars and Coffee in Irvine and you get inundated with every kind of car there is, from exotics, hot rods, and actual race cars and concept cars! No arguments about who is parked next to who. Up here Ferrari has a show and they get more 350Zs than Ferraris and they're the dealership!

Irvine has their show at 7 a.m. with hundreds of cars. Whenever someone asks me if they could have a show up here at 7 a.m. I say, "if you want it to fail". You can't get anyone up here to move before 9 a.m.

Then you ask the exotic guys if they want events in New England and they scream yes, but when you hold them, they don't show citing the things that have come up above (to early, mixed company, too far).

Did you guys know that there is a 3 rally event in New York that is limited, but not closed to one car type, and it commonly has 200 to 300 exotics that drive 100s of miles and the event costs $125 and starts at 7 a.m. and it doesn't do the VIP eatery thing either. When we pitched it to the New England crowd we got a couple of members from the Viper Club and that was it.

So my thing is, the stuff is out there and I've asked folks to tell me what they want and we'll make it happen. 55Fanatic there could easily put together an event that could cater to what you guys wanted. He's done cigar nights, BBQs, rallys, and a great Cars and Coffee event! So don't tell him what we can't do, but what we CAN do.

I'll even put it up on here too if it doesn't conflict with Ferrari Chat rules.

 

Absolutely--and that's why C&C in SoCal is so much more impressive. I just can't picture a C&C here where someone would bring out a Lusso or an LP400 Countach. Dudes literally bring out million+ dollar classics to those events. That just doesn't seem even possible to happen here. C&C here seems to mean "mostly modern exotics" I guess this is why SoCal is the epicenter of every automotive trend.

Then (as you said), there are cars from every corner of the car hobby--muscle, Japanese import, VW, etc...--and they all seem to co-exist.

I dunno...

 

I know that most people don't think that New Canaan, CT or anywhere in Fairfield County is a part of New England, but the Zumbach's Caffeine and Carburetors this past Sunday morning attracted 130 vehicles of all sorts, from about a dozen Ferraris, 30 or so Porsches to Lotuses, Model A Fords (2), Jaguars, Alfas, Morgans, Aston Martins, a Plymouth Superbird, an Oldsmobile Carrera Panamericana racer, a Camaro drag racer, to a dozen motorcycles and a lot of other interesting cars.

Everything is low key. Show up at 8, have a free breakfast, maybe win a wine and cheese basket in the raffle, go on a planned tour.
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And that makes me sad, because those cars are here, hidden away in garages and not coming out, but yet when you talk to them they say they would really like to have a cool event that they could come out to and show it off and hang out with new friends.

People really are missing out on the spirit of this industry. You only have to talk to people like Leno and Herb for a couple of minutes to really understand and feel it. They don't just own those cars, they LOVE those cars and they can tell you everything about them and the experience of driving them and then for them to ask you what you like about your car, just seems to boggle the mind, but they are truly interested in what you have to say.

I don't know about you, but I would rather here the passion from an owner than a MotorTrend or EVO video any day.

Guys like Pete, Manolis, Joey, on here have really changed the face of New England and they end up having people fight against them to make stuff happen. I don't want these guys to get tired of putting these events on! I would like people to volunteer, to say, hey how can I help! I want to see more and this year is turning out to be less.

 

Precisely. I mean, as custodians of these works of art, there is almost a responsibility to let the public (or at least the "car" segment of the public) see them. Seems like too many MA/RI collectors are content to leave their treasures in hermetically sealed garages.

It's odd--because there's no better icebreaker than a great car when among car people. We're a nice bunch--regardless of how much smack gets talked on web boards. M<Aybe these people just don't know this.

I will say--some mindblowing stuff came out at last year's Tutto Italiano at Larz Anderson, but that's a much more formal event. So see these masterpieces in a plain ol' parking lot is truly a wonderful thing.

Oh well...