http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iohH9jQdb5s This video was highly entertaining. The driver was a bit sheepish through some corners and the squeaky brakes were horrible to listen to but what a fantastic car! Those P6 cams with kugelfisher injection sound just awesome..........
I have always loved these cars! At one point I looked at buying a GT4 with a Group 4 built spec motor as a street/track toy, but the P6 cams suck on the street, absolutely no power where you need it, that and the fact that this thing got clobbered on the track by newer cars, just like the Michelotto 308 in this video. 355 challenge cars just walked away down the straights.
Agree. Ralph Tolman, a gentleman in the car club i am a member of has a GT2 class 308 racecar, and he absolutely drives the wheels off the car. it has been an amazing honor to get several rides with him and his son in the car. he is even better in his 360 CS!!!!!! the stuff a great driver can do with a 308 is amazing. great thread, loved the vid.
This is F-Chatter Racing-Baker. It's not a real Michelotto but a recreation that was amazingly built up in his livingroom!
Two years ago there was real one at Infineon Ferrari Challenge historics. Its outqualfied everything in the field, including the BBLM's, because it was raining heavily. Very cool car. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
I got a chance to hear and see the silver/maroon 308 at New Jersey Motor Sports park last year. Truley amazing.
Where would someone get one of the Kugelfischer pumps for a v8 if they wanted to tinker with such a beast ... are the old Mercedes units similar at all or are they specially built race only units on the Ferraris. Not to hijack I find it intersting a later Mich 308qv had the standard K-jet fuel injection ... is that for real or a clone. cheers
That's the saddest news ever! Regardless, awesome setup. Awesome car! Sean, the Kugelfischer systems for the V8 cars are sort of a combination of two BMW 2002 kugelfischer pumps. I have heard talk of running two BMW 2002 setups on the one Ferrari V8 engine as the system for the Ferrari is all sorts of rare as they were built specifically for that engine and nothing else......
who knows were to find gr4 kugelfischer pumps?... my understanding that bosch bought out the KF many years ago and most of the race pumps from the 70's and 80's arent available any longer. the later michelotto qv cars are homologated B spec cars and are a lot different from the regs of the earlier more radical gr4 cars. unless u build 200 units you couldnt run a KF unit on the cars. hence the 288gto development. but by the time ferrari came out with it it was outdated and would have gotten slaughtered by the 4wd audi, pugs, fords RS200 and S4 lancia on the world rally circuit. btw the 037 lancia was last 2wd world champion car due to a freakishly dry year in 83
Thanks for the details on the QV itteration. Regarding the KF unit ... I was surfing around and the units used on the BMW 2002 are like hen's teeth ... I think I was seeing prices upwards of $10k for a 4 cylinder setup. I also found a really cool pic of the 308 pump unit and it really looks like 2 of the BMW units if someone happened to be able to get those or re-produced them. There was a really cool tech description I found on one of the BMW sites also ... apparently a magnet or something on one of the shafts? ... I was hoping the pump was more similar to the Bosch MFI that's in my '73 911 ... there's a plate that moves around in the Kugel that effects the plungers that I don't think the Bosch MFI incorporates ... also didn't see any mention of a "space cam" that is kind of the map for the Bosch unit ... be nice to know more about the similaritites (if any) between the Bosch MFI and the Kugel unit. Also saw some guys using Lucas units on certain motors and Kinsler which seemd a bit more primitive. cheers
LD you might want to check the availability of the very early aston martin DBS v8. i dont know much of the cars first hand but i do recall they were equipped with a bosch MFI. alfa montreal had a MFI with spica system also.... a variant powered the 33 racers. most likely both are much more trouble than its worth to adapt to a 308 especially with all the EFI hardware around. never the less MFI cars are way cool! cheers
The Kugelfischer setup for the Michelotto 308 is using a specific pump and this was its only application. It is simply impossible to find. I hear some people in France have an original pump that thea are willing to dismantle and make new castings. In any case even if this happens it will be extremely expensive and of doubtful use.
Just curious, does anyone know the hp and weight of the Michelotto cars? I'm wondering what that MFI setup is worth vs. a modern MAP setup with some custom cams. I've never heard one, but I really remember what an old MFI 911 sounds like and they are incredible.
Less than 300bhp. More than 1000Kg. No special sound. No major wins. No factory support. Only nostalgia.
Correct, I had the pleasure of seeing the car and his 'workshop' last year. At FOD he was having problems with his brakes I guess. Best Jurgen Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
What are you having put on your car? I somewhat expected with the quality of your build you would be installing a KF system? What else is worthy and "period correct"? Webers? .. boring . Another possibility that has been mentioned before was modifying a K-jet head so it doesn't need the flap but it would still be a mechanical style fuel injection. I mentioned before I like the look of the Lucas unit also. The mechanical FI is really interesting to me after playing with EFI for so long ... understanding all the mechanism is a new challenge. What kind of injection is on the 288? cheers
