German GP: If You Were The FIA....(SPOILER) | Page 2 | FerrariChat

German GP: If You Were The FIA....(SPOILER)

Discussion in 'F1' started by RP, Jul 25, 2010.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

?

Ferrari appears to have violated the team oder rule today, would you

  1. Penalize Ferrari for "team orders"

  2. No penalty

Multiple votes are allowed.
Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. canadiantifosi

    canadiantifosi Formula Junior

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2008
    Messages:
    919
    Location:
    uh...guess...
    Full Name:
    Canadian Tifosi Sr.
    One would think Ferrari would make these team orders less obvious when implemented. They spend hundreds of hours trying to shave a tenth of a second off pit stops, but don't seem to have a believable method of communicating team orders. This is something they should seriously look at given the FIA frowning on team orders.

    At the end of the race Massa's engineer called him "magnanimous" and also said he would explain the word's meaning later.

    Here is the definition:
    mag·nan·i·mous (mg-nn-ms)
    adj.
    1. Courageously noble in mind and heart.
    2. Generous in forgiving; eschewing resentment or revenge; unselfish.

    'Nuff said. Guilty as charged.

    Cheers-Colin Firth-Ontario Canada
     
  2. DF1

    DF1 Three Time F1 World Champ

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2007
    Messages:
    30,131
    Location:
    FRA - nice city with a really big airport :)
    Rob did the right thing and was fighting for his driver. He did nothing wrong. That rests with Domecali.

    The lap times wont support a verdict of it was ok for FA to "just pass." He didnt pass in the heat of competition. It was staged and Todt is on the line to end the charade Ferrari made today. If the rule is there then the teams agree.

    Interpretation is not out of line in adjudication at all. The caveat of the sport being put in a bad light is always something that will have weight, hence the agreement of the rule. This damages the sport and all other teams in its wake. See what Horner from Red Bull has to say about it. Sad that FA needed help today. If he needs help to pass Felipe then I feel sorry for him and this victory is surely hollow even to him. Domencali is a complete fool.

    Felipe made the most of the situation today. FA is one of entitlement not competition today. He is less than a 2 time WDC in my eyes from this race. Im a fan of MS, but not blind to the outright help that gave him extra wins and titles. I always felt FA was above that. Clearly not or he refuses the help and takes the extra talent and skill he has over Felipe and finds a way around. No excuse at all.

    I wont be bored this week waiting for another race :)
     
  3. GerryD

    GerryD Formula 3

    Joined:
    May 5, 2010
    Messages:
    2,442
    Location:
    North of TO
    Full Name:
    Guido
    You are definitly looking through the red mist. Deep in your heart, do you really think that that radio message was just a piece of fat for Massa to chew on while Massa was turning fastest lap after fastest lap? You really have to be kidding.
     
  4. alan

    alan Formula 3

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2004
    Messages:
    1,502
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Full Name:
    Alan
    What a Crock! i'm very angry with Ferrari , poor old Masa has that horror crash exactly one year ago today, what a fairy tale ending a victory today would have been. Oh no lets deny him that and give the victory to the other guy who has no special reason to want / need the win today of all days.......im so angry and, sad for Massa that words fail me. I thought they were meant to be fully supportive of Massa after his crash / recovery what kind of ******* support is that???????
     
  5. Neonzapper

    Neonzapper F1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2008
    Messages:
    2,580
    Location:
    MD/FL/Philippines
    Full Name:
    Mykol
    Did I watch an F1 race, or the movie, "CARS"?
     
  6. Cozmic_Kid

    Cozmic_Kid F1 Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2005
    Messages:
    7,573
    Location:
    Denmark
    Full Name:
    B. Frandsen
    But it doesn't help the team much to win two titles.

    I assume Ferrari is in F1 to win as much as possible.
     
  7. Scuderia-F1

    Scuderia-F1 Formula Junior

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2008
    Messages:
    624
    Location:
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Full Name:
    Anders
    +1
     
  8. Scuderia-F1

    Scuderia-F1 Formula Junior

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2008
    Messages:
    624
    Location:
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Full Name:
    Anders
    ...very well said!
     
  9. Sellnit

    Sellnit Formula Junior

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    Messages:
    975
    Location:
    Cincinnati
    Full Name:
    James
    +2

    F1 is all about "massaging" the rules, if posters don't agree they have never watched F1.
     
  10. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2008
    Messages:
    42,720
    Location:
    ESP
    Full Name:
    Bas
    In what world isn't Massa a teamplayer? he rolled over and let the big headed Alonso pass without hesitation, I'm surprised if Domenically didn't threaten Rob Smedley the way Barrichello was threatened back in 2002 ''you have a contract''.

    If I was Massa I would have stopped the car and punched Domenically straight in his face and walked off with some self respect though.
     
  11. PowerSlide

    PowerSlide Formula 3

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2004
    Messages:
    1,632
    nobody say it as well as you did, hit the point nicely
     
  12. WCH

    WCH F1 Veteran Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2003
    Messages:
    5,186


    Really well said.
     
  13. MBFerrari

    MBFerrari F1 Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2008
    Messages:
    6,057
    Location:
    NoVA
    Full Name:
    Matt B
    This is one reason I can't stand F1...the rule is a joke, but so is telling a driver to move over....they are R A C I N G. If someone can't get around a teammate, too freaking bad.

    What a joke.

    MB
     
  14. TurboFreak650

    TurboFreak650 Formula 3

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2004
    Messages:
    2,419
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    Giving Vettel, the unspoken yet clear #1 at Red Bull, the new front wing from Webber's car, was a case of team orders. Giving anything considered an advantage to the #1 driver could be called team orders. It's done to have the best possible result. I definitely prefer this than having a selfish, foolish wreck like the one Vettel caused recently with his own teammate. Even better would be to see them duke it out without crashing, but when egos get in the way, that tends to be dangerous.

    Alonso was clearly faster and both drivers are employees of FERRARI, they aren't individual business enterprises. This year at least, I don't think it will make much of a difference as one of the McLarens or Red Bulls will win the WDC and WCC anyway.
     
  15. sindo308qv

    sindo308qv F1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2003
    Messages:
    3,575
    Location:
    miami.fl.
    Full Name:
    sindo
    Why risk a pass on a team mate, taking both out when you can just let the faster car by?
    By that rational then eliminate the blue flags and try to pass backmarkers too. It's what's best for the team and their chances to win the two championships, especially lately where championships are being won by a point or two.
     
  16. becker

    becker Formula Junior

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2001
    Messages:
    340
    Location:
    Arlington VA
    Full Name:
    Becker Cuéllar
    Team orders happened , happens and will happen no need to get so whinny about it (I thought Fred was supposed to be the Whinny one)... the issue was they made it too obvious almost as in the MS days
     
  17. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2002
    Messages:
    49,624
    Location:
    @ the wheel
    Full Name:
    Andreas
    The rule is stupid and needs to go.
     
  18. sindo308qv

    sindo308qv F1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2003
    Messages:
    3,575
    Location:
    miami.fl.
    Full Name:
    sindo
  19. menoy

    menoy F1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2005
    Messages:
    2,661
    Location:
    PL
    Full Name:
    MRodziewicz
    No, no one thinks so. That's the key word though - thinks. As far as plain facts go, there was no order and when you're playing by the rules it's facts that count.
     
  20. HolyRoller

    HolyRoller Formula Junior

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2008
    Messages:
    518
    Location:
    SE NC
    Full Name:
    Captain Slow
    In other news, 15 minutes later Ferrari announced a $1,995 increase in the 458's MSRP for "additional factory prep."
     
  21. RP

    RP F1 World Champ

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2005
    Messages:
    17,667
    Location:
    Bocahuahua, Florxico
    Full Name:
    Tone Def
    Sindo, not the spirit of the rules, or what I see as professional car racing. It is very unlikely that Alonso would have been able to pass that car that he had been following for the entire race, if the Button/Hamilton duals this year are an example, there would not have been a move over flag displayed to Massa.

    Just plainly wrong to let Alonso through. The rule was established for a reason, live with the rule, or get penalized. Which is what is happening to Ferrari. Thankfully.
     
  22. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2008
    Messages:
    42,720
    Location:
    ESP
    Full Name:
    Bas
    Team orders are abused, that's why it is. Like today, we've seen that it gets abused.

    I've got full understanding of the rule if there where just a few races to go, and one of the drivers has a significant advantage in points and needs them. Anyone understands that, even the driver who has to concede the position.

    But today, it was a total farce. There are plenty of races to go, Alonso couldn't get passed Massa despite being on his tail a while, despite that Massa encountered most of his traffic at the worst corners (and Alonso had many of them on the straights, so more advantage to him). They were fairly similar in points, with so many races to go.

    I've lost all my respect for anyone in Ferrari, bar Massa and Smedley. Although Massa and/or should have punched Domenicalli straight in the face for good measure.
     
  23. LSs1Power

    LSs1Power Rookie

    Joined:
    May 31, 2004
    Messages:
    22
    Massa was a bottleneck especially after changing his tires after the first stop. He was all over the place and at some point if FA did not lift, both would have crashed and left the race. Vettel was gaining on FA because of Massa at some point.

    Ferrari waited too long to issue this order, they should have kept him longer in the pit (Opps i got two Front Right tires, wait until i get the Left Front tire lol). That would have been easier.

    Massa have no chance of winning this year and this was a lucky break for him. I doubt he will be able to repeat this against the likes of FA, LH & Vettel.
     
  24. MBFerrari

    MBFerrari F1 Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2008
    Messages:
    6,057
    Location:
    NoVA
    Full Name:
    Matt B
    Why do you hate Barrichello? He is told to NOT WIN a race he had won? IF you were to drive cars for a living, and the goal of driving those cars was to win races...and if you were told to give up and not win even though you were a better driver in that race, wouldn't you be pissed too?

    I take offense to your remark as a Barrichello fan...he didn't "cause" anything. The rule is stupid but the actions of asking a driver to move over in a race are beyond farcicle.

    The purpose of racing cars is to win. If you can't make your car go faster than the other guy, you lose - period.

    MB
     
  25. sindo308qv

    sindo308qv F1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2003
    Messages:
    3,575
    Location:
    miami.fl.
    Full Name:
    sindo
    Well, according to Steve Matchett, I think he mentioned that a team can
    ask it's slower car to move over for the teams faster one. Am I correct?
     

Share This Page