F1 ENI MAGYAR NAGYDIJ 2010: Race

Of course I don't believe MS would do that to RB or anyone else.

I guess you could call it a racing incident? MS pushing him too far? RB pushing the issue when he may have just gotten him the next lap? As a racer, I don't believe you should ever do what MS did today, Webber did to Massa in Fuji a few years back, etc. Whether right or wrong, my .02.

Alex

 

I keep thinking some here like this Nascrap style of racing. Or maybe I am just getting too old to understand the 'ethics' of it all any more. I am not hung up with gentlemanly racing, but I know when I see a good clean pass and I know when I see someone that is clearly beaten taking desperate measures to preserve a position.

Maybe Rubens should have a bumper installed on the front of his car and just push MS out of the way next time. YEAH, that's the ticket.

 

A bird flew across the start finish line.

 

Why do your posts always come from some other planet?

 

LOL

To give Bigodino an answer:

One of the cars lost a big part of its front wing and it ended up in the middle of the track.

 

I think you guys are forgeting that he is the best car developer around and right now with no testing, a team needs the best and MS is the best in that field. I think we will have to wait untill next seasons half way point to see if they should toss him out. Todays move on RB was complete rubish to say the least.

 

Interesting reads. Thank you. I knew about the seating capacity of Hockenheim. I didn't know that Mercedes had preliminary issues with the signing of MS. But those last 2 articles were from December '09. Anything recent that actually have to do with his performance and Mercedes' problems besides your speculation? I searched and couldn't find anything.

Alex

 

Yes all good points from you and Is..

I took some screen shots, it can help either way, at the time I really thought he was out of order.
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It' not my fault you are wrong.

 

You make a good point, but with the testing ban, basically a dead point. Considering next years official rules haven't been released yet, they can only do so much towards next years car.

I do believe, however, that MS and Brawn are doing things throughout weekends in hope of getting a jump for next year. But with the new Pirelli tire, I don't think anyone knows.

Alex

 

He certainly was one of the best car developers, but is he still today?

http://www.speedweek.ch/art_14000.html

http://www.motorsport-aktuell.com/automobil/nur-startplatz-14-schumacher-und-das-chaos-setup-1959207.html

These articles talks about why he qualified so poorly in Hungary: He developed the setup into the wrong direction.

Since there is no testing and the rules for 2011 not fully defined, it is hard to develop any car at this point. My feeling is, that in the current F1 the main development of the car is actually done by the "third driver": The guy who sits every day in the simulator at home and tests, tests and test. Each team has such a guy and it is normally neither of the two regular drivers.

 

Your right, some of the people in here I truly believe are young and dont have a clue. This is Nascrap all the way. Im sure if we started a poll on wether F1 should install an intersection at some point on the track that about 1 out of 10 in here would say "sure go for it, it would liven up the racing and make more room for younger drivers to move up" Its the "I am indestructable" youth attitude.

 

As I said, I came across a recent article after Hockenheim, but can't find it anymore (it was a weblink and it might have been replaced by now). If I find it again, I'll let you know.

Personally I don't think the unions have that much power and Brawn/Haug should be able to keep MS for next year. But MS shouldn't be pulling such Kamikaze stunts again, they don't bode well with the fans. And at the end of the day F1 is nothing but a gigantic marketing exercise (at least for the manufacturers).

 

Yep, it's racing, it's exciting. No reason to penalize the drivers for that.

They could have done that if RB or they both had wrecked the car.

We see many times how they pust each other going down a straight where they could lock wheels. It's just as dangerous.
I think the drivers know kinda like a 6th sense, how much room they have to drive the way they do.
RB just have some ill feelings towards Schumi still that he needed to get rid of.

 

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Agreed, but why are the rules for next season not in concrete yet? The simple answer is to keep things close. Its all too obvious that this is no longer the pinicle of motorsport by a long shot. Ill bet that if you let any one of the top teams test and develop outside of the other teams rules that that team would lap everyone within one season. What is happening is a total farce and it is so easy to see through it.

 

The point of pushing RB into the wall at 280+ Km/h is to put drivers off trying to overtake him in future, to make them scared about trying to overtake him. He wouldn't see it as he pushed RB into the wall, he'll see it as RB choosing to drive into the wall.

However My suspicion is that when Schumacher see the video replays from the various angles, he will realise just how close to the wall RB really was and that maybe he did push things a little too far this time.

From inside his cockpit it may well be that he didn't realise how far over he was pushing RB into the wall.

As for RB making "the stupid move here", Schumacher could see it was a done deal, he was watching his right hand mirror for long enough, he didn't need to keep coming across once he saw RB storming up the inside of him.

The reason he backed off "so clearly and quickly" was purely due to the fact that he knew he couldn't keep up with the Williams so there was no point trying. He tried to stay with RB through turn 1 and attack him into turn 2 and then just gave it up as RB left him for dead!.

Lets not forget, BTW, that Schumacher is the same guy who was happy to put his own brother up against the wall years ago!.

Here's some news for all the Schumacher fans that the Tifosi had to come to terms with during his time at Ferrari:

He's not perfect: (Jerez '97), sometimes he pushes things too far: (brother Ralf pushed almost into the wall, twice, Hakinnen pushed onto the grass at over 170mph Spa 2000), he makes mistakes now and again, and when he does, he has trouble admitting it, even to himself! (the same problem that Senna suffered from).

Today was another display of his biggest foible, he can't handle being beaten.

 

Yes it is, and Bernie pressed on the team orders at Ferrari last race, admitted that it was keeping F1 in the news days after, I suppose it goes with the F1 business territory.

 

Sounds like he is a die-hard FChatter then...

 

MS in a interview after the race: "well I and the drivers have are opinions, and Rubens has his".

Or words to that effect.

 

Deserved.

 

I think a 10 spot grid penalty is nothing......I would have put him in a lawnchair for 2 or 3 races as a spectator and let him really stew about his unsportsmanlike driving. Maybe then he might get it.

Not buying this MS POV couldn't tell he was going too far BS. They didn't crash because they can guage down to the MM, but counting on that in a move like MS made is foolish.....he virtually had Rubens trapped between HIS wheels....couldn't let off, couldn't acclerate, sqeezed against a wall. Screw MS.....I may make another F1 race this year just so I can take a bull horn and boo his bully a$$.

 

I see a big white 'runoff' line then the wall. MS would have known the white line was slightly more than the width of a car. I don't see a photo of him on it or crossing it and I don't think I will because 'THAT' is over the limit.

Barring a crosswind .

Steve's photos prove the case. The penalty is undeserved and it pains me to admit that. (good for my bet though.....yessss).

 

Cue the calliope music.

Let's see: it's "unsafe" to have Liuzzi's end plate on track (14 laps after he tagged Schumi in T1), so let's bring out the SC, ...
... and have a runaway wheel, a collision, and plenty of penalty opportunities instead.



And somebody get the Ferrari "strategists" (sic) some caffeine. Or a clue.

Leaving aside how late they were, getting the word to Massa to close up in anticipation of a DT for Vettel (two or three laps after warning Alonso).

Last race, team orders told Massa to let Alonso by. Now they forced him to let Hami by. (Massa's pit lane time was a second and a half longer than Hami's.) Massa had to let Hami by in order to not arrive at the pit before Alonso left.

Stacking Massa behind Alonso's (bad) stop, in order to switch Massa onto the tires that *DON'T* work as well on his car?

Even before seeing Webber pull his stunt with the options, my first reaction was that they should have left Massa out on the options ---
-- if, for no other reason, to keep Vettel from running off into the horizon again, and to give Alonso a chance to have a go at the Red Bull.

Once again, Ferrari has shown a marked *IN*ability to adapt race strategy on the fly.

Every time the SC rolls, Ferrari shoots themselves in the foot.

The new SF motto: Better Lucky than Good.

Sheesh. I think I'm gonna start rooting for Webber.


Or, better yet: for Wilson, Silvestro, and Sato.
F1 is looking a bit scripted.

 

+1

Heck, I saw that move and I'm not even sitting on pit lane. In fact I was expecting that they told Massa to push like hell so Vettel wouldn't come out in front of him. And I'm sure Massa would have done just that.