Question regarding Kers for 2011

IIRC the FIA and the constructors agreed to make KERS mandatory.

 

Yes,

Only to add: The plan is for teams to be able to buy a KERS system from a rival team for the set price of €1 million, on condition that the amount of money spent developing such a system is not more than €5 million. Teams are not, however, obliged to supply their systems to another team if they choose not to do so. The idea of a standardized KERS system has been quietly forgotten.

 

You can bet at least one team next season will have some tricked out electric motor everyone wants to get their hands on.

 

Has it? - I do hope you're correct on this - Last I heard (FWIW!) were proposals for a "standardised" system

I also don't believe it's mandatory next year - You can run it, but don't have to (?)

As I mentioned somewhere else, Porsche have done a GT3 hybrid using a Williams developed flywheel system - It's big (lives in the passenger footwell) and heavy, but apparently works great - The energy is used to drive 2 motors on the front wheels and it hauls ass out of corners if used right - It almost (!) won the 24 hours at the 'Ring a while back [A valve spring broke apparently.]

I really hope they "let 'em at it" with this stuff - Not 'cos I'm a greenie, but it's another avenue that can "improve the breed". I'd like batteries, flywheels and anything else they can dream up allowed....

Cheers,
Ian

 

Are the KERS systems restricted by the rules in terms of power?

Otherwise, given the ridiculous IC engine restrictions, this could be the battleground of the next power war.

 

How is that going to work? Suppose a team doesn't have the resources to develop KERS because of the costs and there aren't any sellers...because of the costs?

 

If you can't come up with a few $MM in the first place, you're not even getting an entry [I just read that the "Bernie Bond" for any noobs next year is $24MM for example] - A (hopefully!) working KERS system for a million is a drop in the ocean for these guys.

As to units being available, they will be - I guess it's kinda like engines - I don't think the motor manufacturers are obliged to sell to other teams, but they all do - Presumably helps with cost amortization (?)

As for the 5MM limit on development cost - How can they enforce that? - Williams Hybrid Technology (I believe is the name) have already spent *way* more than that on their system - Will it therefore be outlawed?

Cheers,
Ian

 

IMHO, either everyone runs KERS, or the idea should be thrown out of the window.

 

Simple answer is I dont know as yet, but will try to find some more info on it.

From F1 tech:
While the FIA still allows the system in 2010, FOTA judged it was opportune to make a gentlemen's agreement not to use it due to the hight costs involved.

After yesterday's meeting however, it turns out there are more and more supporters of the system. Williams technical director Sam Michael revealed that Ferrari and Renault would be willing to supply a cheaper and more powerful KERS to teams who want it.

"Basically Ferrari and Renault put forward proposals that they could do KERS for less than a million euros," Michael is quoted as saying by Reuters.

"Those have been accepted but what Ferrari and Renault are both saying is that unless we increase the energy level from the current 400 kilojoules up to 600 or 800, to make KERS more beneficial, they are not prepared at this stage to commit that they will actually do KERS."

"Renault will supply anyone who asks for it on the grid and Ferrari will supply any of their customers, anyone who is running a Ferrari engine."

It looks however like more discussion is required before an agreement will be reached.

Williams F1 meanwhile is thought to be ready to use its own flywheel system from Williams Hybrid Power, especially now that they have taken a large stake into the company.

 

With KERS making a comeback for 2011, Cosworth will provide their customer teams with engines that are fully capable of being mated to the energy recovery systems. Although so far Williams is the only Cosworth-powered team which has announced it's intent to use KERS.

"Our plans for 2011 are flat out. We want to make sure that we are well prepared for the return of KERS," Cosworth's Mark Gallagher shared with our colleagues over at 'Autosport'.

"Getting that done is a great deal more complicated than just letting the teams simply attach the systems. We need to reconfigure the engine, plus change the ancillaries – but that is what we are ready to do to ensure our teams can run KERS if they wish."

 

But I thought last year the majority of teams didn't bother with KERS because of the R&D expenses. At around $2MM USD, I'd think it would have been more prevalent. As I recall, only 4 teams showed up with it, and one dropped it mid-season. And as far as putting a cap on developmental costs, you're right. It's unenforceable.

 

I think that is the problem, teams spent boat loads on the system, for it to be kicked out on a whim, but I blame Mosley for this. The teams agreed amongst themselves not to use it this year.

I think what they are trying to do is bring in a system for all to use and for those that can't afford to develop one they can buy one, not a perfect scenerio but better than the one before IMO.

 

I'm sure that's the plane, but it takes us back to the question of can it be done under their fiscal parameters?

 

No - electric motors are, compared to internal combustion engines, very simple machines, and very well understood for decades. The progress in electric motors mostly comes from new materials and manufacturing processes, not from improvements in the design or way of operation. A electric motor from 1940 isn't that different to one from 2010.

 

Interesting that.