458 vs McLaren MP4-12C--- Your thoughts?

But there are independent tests galore for the 458 (not to mention plenty of customer deliveries) so there are plenty of real world impressions to go by for those who have yet to drive it. For the McLaren you have Ron's say so. Not quite the same thing, is it?

 

Good info, thanks. Still, 300-400 lbs is a significant difference.

As for all the comments about technology....Ferrari has always been a leader in exporting F1 tech into their road cars. Yet it never got in the way of the driving excitement like it did with the NSX and, more recently, the GT-R. Hopefully the MP4 will be similar.

I'm not familiar with the McLaren buying process.....but has anyone here put a deposit down for the MP4 or at least gotten their names on some sort of list?

 

Hey! Where are all you "I'd never buy it without a 6 speed" guys? That's all we heard when the 458 said it was coming out without a 6 speed.

 

Thanks for the clarification; that sounds much more reasonable.

It wasn't really clear when I was responding to this:

 

One thing is for sure. If this car DOESN'T borderline trounce the 458 in almost every way, which it should with carbon MC, twin-turbos and 600hp and 433tq, the success of the entire operation will be questionable. The latest figures claim a 1/4 mile "around" 11.0. If they're not drastically underestimating that figure, it doesn't sound very impressive.

For me, it's too average to the eye and the ear, internally and externally, to ever want one. I don't really care what the 0-60 times are. I care about how it feels, sounds and looks when I'm cruising along at 30 mph and accelerating to 80, and most importantly when it is at rest.

It's not the parts that matter as much as how they all come together.

In a way, I want Mclaren to succeed, for the reason you mentioned above....competition. Ferrari always responds brilliantly to competition. The Zonda F's incredible sound to me is the reason why the 599 GTO sounds so incredible. Ferrari couldn't stand to be upstaged by this new kid on the block. Hopefully the same will happen with this alphabet soup "Ron".

There are and will be plenty of fast, well-built, well-handled and engineered cars available these days. What has and apparently will always separate Ferrari from every other sports/super car maker EXCEPT Zonda, is the combination of excellencies.


Forza,


Cavallini

 

I will keep my 360 and upgrade it a long I can (in performance) but I will get the McCLaren to see how it perform. I like the Italia but I like more the Scud!.
I will love to see what those turbos can pull of specially coming from such a great name like McCLaren!!

 

2010 Ferrari 458 VS 2009 16M @ Goodwood FOS

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtSG7yDAIjo

enjoy

 

Wow, is this for real? Italia gets murdered here. It clearly cannot carry as much speed through corners.

 

you mean the 16m...it's the car on the bottom

 

You are right, they flipped the cars. I am an idiot.

 

Video means nothing - different drivers, different weather, different years.

If the cars have the same lap time at Fiorano - it's unlikely there would be this difference. People I know who own both say the Scud is better on a track. Lighter, better brakes.

At best they're equal

 

1) a what? Call that a car? When did they start building engines?? Yesterday! Anyway who wants a car that looks like a 360 Modena gone wrong

2) all scud lovers are persuaded that their beloved car is quicker than a 458. At Monza on the4th july the best scud was only 2 secs / lap slower than the best 458...

 

Oops forgot to mention that the scuds were all modified (suspension, brakes etc) and the 458 were bog standard,,,,

 

ChalStrad,
The OP didn't say the owners said the Scud was FASTER than the 458 but that the Scud was BETTER on the track. Probably a true statement. The Scuderia is more of a track car than the 458 it should FEEL BETTER on the track.

 

For sure the 16M wasn't being pushed to the limit and I don't blame the driver. That "track"/layout is super tight, as tight if not tighter than the Monaco circuit.

 

Can't wait for a Italia x Mp4 REAL review

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAQ3WvzpSSI&feature=related


If I had the money I would be VERY VERY happy to have such amazing options!

 

Interestingly enough, independent tests so far show that the cars are tied on the track: both quatroroute and nordschleife (super test) are basically the same. Obviously, the scud has better tires, on the other hand the top end of Italia should be a big advantage at the ring, yet it is not.

 

In this month's Car Stephen Bayley (a man who I don't always agree with, but it can't be denied that he certainly knows his onions) calls the Ferrari a "bravura statement of aerodynamic glory" while describing the McLaren as "more derivative than inspired". He goes on to say "There is something humourless and sexless about the McLaren; something extravagantly wonderful about the Ferrari" and "In the Foster-designed North Korea that is the McLaren Technology Centre, faceless technocrats have worked on the MP4. By contrast, the epic partnership of Ferrari and Pininfarina began in a restaurant, and Ferrari's other epic design partnership was with a repair shop over the road run by Sergio Scaglietti."

Personally, I think to prefer the McLaren over the Ferrari (at least on looks) is to favour comfort over art.

 

I spent some time with one at Pebble.

I like it better in the Carbon than in photo's.

It's a first class operation.

I look forward to driving one.

IMO if it were VERY Good looking it would be a direct/serious hit to the 458.

It's not VERY good looking but these guys are very serious and it will be interesting to see where this all goes.

 

No doubt it will be sensational to drive, though probably of a different flavour to the 458.

 

They promise an ownership/buying experience like no other exotic on the market now.
It will be interesting indeed.....

 

The Ariel Atom weighs only 1000 pounds and can hit sixty in under 3 secs but is little more than a go-kart. What's more, the 458 had a faster lap time around Top Gear's course than the Atom. Check the video again and you'll see. So much for light weight.

There's more to a Ferrari than just how fast it can go around a road course and there will always be a car that's faster than yours, rest assured. The Mclaren will fill a small niche in the marketplace but I don't think Ferrari has anything to worry about, and neither should its owners. How often are you going to race anyone, anyway?

Final thought: when someone who isn't a car nut comes up and asks you, "What's that?" and you reply, "A Ferrari 458 Italia", their response will be, "Ooooh! Gorgeous!" but when they come up to a Mclaren owner and hear that it's a Mclaren, their response is more likely to be, "A what?"

 

There's also racing Heritage to consider. If you want a car from the Company that's won more F1 Races than anyone it's an easy choice.

McLaren.

 

It does look very good in some photos.

>8^)
ER
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Tell that to each and every Lamborghini owner. Or Konigsegg owner. Or Zonda owner. Or Veyron owner. There's an ass for every saddle and I'm sure McLaren will sell whatever they produce but I'm buying my 458 Coupe so that I will have a good shot at a Spider in a couple of years. It'll take McLaren a long time to develop a convertible version of their car, if ever, so I'm sticking with the plan and waiting for the 458 Spider and getting a 458 Coupe in the meantime.