Avoiding FUSEBOX "China Syndrome" MELTDOWN: Pre-emptive fix

>> To quote an old friend

I know who you are talking about, and he swore he wasn't going to waste his time on the internet anymore!

>> speechless

Hey, I know that a big tube of goo is not the "answer", I am not an idiot, but what is the answer? I mean what are you saying? That you don't use any sealant at all? (I suspect that is what Bumble-o did, and guess what? It didn't work!) If you do use some, which one? What other tricks make this work?

Look Dave, I asked you this question because I respect your opinion. If I framed the question wrong, kindly correct me, OK? Otherwise if I am out of line for even asking, then please just say that, so I can apologize.

 

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uzae_SqbmDE

 

Did I read that right????? Saran wrap????


Don't make me break out the dogs!!!

I've seen it all now......

 

Chime in everyone! Yes I used Saran Wrap to test the theory that a less than ideal connection at the connector between the crank sensor and the ECU harness was resulting in my last spate of intermittent check engine lights. Guess what? The test was a resounding success! Sorry you jokers don't have my ability to creatively design innovative and cost-effective experiments.

BTW, while my car was on the lift today at Reno's most friendly shop, Infinite Velocity Motorsports, I took a look, and, 1000 miles later, the Saran Warp is holding up far better than even I expected. I think I am going to just leave it there for now. When I next get a CEL, I'll know it's time to re-do it or make a change. I bet you that before that happens, I'll have figured out a way to get my valve covers to keep the oil on the inside. At that point, I'll probably just spring for a set of Dave's connectors. But first things first!

If anyone has any links or suggestions on how to make sure the valve covers do their job, I'd sure be grateful.

 

Just for fun I went to the 348/355 section and typed "348 valve cover leak" in the "search" function and got links to various threads in Fchat, http://www.thebestemployee.com/forum/search.php?searchid=4184434.

I think you'll find your answers in there, especially the one that says, "Repair Tips Page"

 

As one of the founding members of G.F.R.T. these days I am quite pleased to just be able to stand up..... You will loose it when you see the badges being made!!!!

Randy,

OK...I'll bite. Gasket "Goo" is the single biggest cause of Ferrari engine failures we see these days. It is to be used sparingly and only where required. The excess that pushes out along the joint is what causes the "Worms" that in time break off and plug the oil pick up and oil galleys throughout the engine. I have preached on this enough here I thought everyone had read it.

Get yourself 4 cans of brake clean, jack stand the car outside in free air with NO drop lights and start to clean the Exxon Valdez so you can proof positive the sources of the leaks. Where do they start, NOT where do they drip from. Your leaks will be generated from the Cam Seal Oring and the front corners of the cam cover gasket I suspect but it has to be verified. Pull the air filter housing and trunk lid because before this is done you will be straddling that engine like Slim Pickens on the bomb.

OEM Gaskets if you can find a fresh set that has not petrified from sitting on the shelf for decades. When you remove the covers you will see the Orings on the cam seal housings cut from contact with the gaskets.... the single biggest mistake DIY's (and tech's that do not know the marque they are working on) make is to not clearance these gaskets. We need to see what your problems are and the extend of the damage to be able to advise on the direction from this point.

It will require you change your mind set and dedicate the time that will be needed to do this correctly. Accept the car will be down for a couple of days and this effort will require 4+ solid hours of attention. You give it that and focus on a proper fix and it will work out just fine. Once that is done you post pictures of what you have done to the fuse box to date and then we get that properly repaired if it is still possible. With a finger in the dyke and voltage getting where it should.... Yes, I will take your Challenge and against better judgement will sell you our Gold Connector Kit for the "T". As a rule I do not sell this where I do not believe someone will give it the attention level it requires for a proper install. If you are successful in the oil leak endeavor and getting the fuse box done properly, you surely are then at a level where you can do the Gold Connector Kit install properly. It will not fix an oil leak any better than it will fix a flat tire but what it does, it does Exceptionally well. It is worthless unless the voltage gets to where it belongs from the fuse box. One has to do these repairs in a logical order where one compliments the other. Change the quick fix mind set, mentally commit to doing this series of repairs in a proper and logical order, drop the "I know better" and follow instructions to a tee and I assure you that the results will be Extremely rewarding. Anyone willing to make that effort and commitment, I am willing to help with advise and guidance. The repairs will cost you money but given the amount of effort you have put out on that car doing things in an unconventional manner.... focus that same amount of energy in the right direction and you will have a damn fine car! None of this is meant as an insult, as professionals in this industry we get in the same rut. When we see it happening we stop, get a cup of coffee, bite the bullet, back up and change our routine. Happens all of the time to us, its just a mental thing and easy for it to happen especially when the task appears over whelming.... it isnt.

 

I hope your able to get your oil leak under control.. The only thing I am out of my wits about is that your wrapping connectors and parts of your wire harness with plastic wrap.. In a hot engine bay YOUR NUTS.. I wouldn't do it in my daily driver (Honda Civic). Find a better temporary solution and get the plastic wrap out of there.. Shame on your mechanic for not telling you the same.. Next we will hear that someone is wrapping their exhaust in wrapping paper to protect it from dirt and debris so it stays nice and shiney.. Your plastic wrap is not a solution on any scale.. it is a hazard in which your putting yourself and your passenger as risk.. wake up..!!!

R

 

Amen....

Good morning Dave.. Hope all is well..

R

 

Boss Chairman, thanks for your concern, but it is totally misplaced. The location of the wrap is directly in the air stream under the car, and very far from any items of high temperature. As I said, I have put 1000 miles on the car in the hot Cali. sun and inspection reveals that the Saran Wrap looks pretty much just like it did when I put it on. I'll remove it when I get the valve covers properly sealed, or just get tired of the whole discussion and solder the wires. Come to think of it the concept the the plastic wrap is any more vulnerable to heat than the plastic connectors it is covering is kind of silly, but, again, I appreciate your concern.

 

Chuckling out loud!

 

OK, Dave, I get the idea. Couple of questions. When you say to start with cleaning, in order to locate the sources of the leaks, I get a little confused. I mean, once it's clean you won't see any oil, right? Or is the drill to clean it, and then go for a short drive to see where the oil starts leaking from?

On the other hand, I have looked, and I have seen films of oil all about the cam covers, so what exactly is the point of trying to pinpoint the leakage areas? I mean, and please correct me if I am wrong, if one assembles the thing with the gasket clearanced around the o-ring and a tiny, OK, very tiny, but continuous line or seam of sealer between the gasket and the head, and the gasket and the valve cover, that should do it, yes? In other words what else can one do? Have the valve cover surfaced? Have the top of the head surfaced? I've never heard of anyone doing either of those, so really what else is there to do, but just do it right and hope for the best? To put a fine point on it, say I notice that oil seems to be leaking out a 1" section in the middle outside part of the juncture between head and cover, what should I do differently? Put more goo there? Probably not, yes, so what then? Sure, when I have the cover off, I'll inspect it and the sealing surface on the head for irregularities, but what beside the careful application of the aforementioned sealing goo, can I do about any I find? I suppose that if there is some really heinous issue, ill have the offending part welded and machined or buy a good used one, but it would have to be pretty heinous before I would go to all that trouble, especially if its the head.

Also, isn't brake cleaner a bit extreme for cleaning inside of a street car's engine bay? Won't it damage paint and other stuff that it comes into contact with? Why not some water based cleaner?

Dave, thanks so much for taking the trouble to fill me in. I know my questions probably seem to you like babbling, but I am dead serious. I build, configure, and program computers for a living, and the main way mistakes are made is by making assumptions. Yet if one is ever to get anything done, that is precisely what one must do, all frickin' day long. A fine kettle of fish, I don't mind telling you. So, please understand, what is an obvious assumption to you is black magic to me. I try to envision it, and if there seems to be some parts that I cannot make sense of with my beginner's mind, I ask questions.

OK?

 

I gotta say this: Dave, one thing you do not have to worry about is the kind of job that I will do if I ever install a set of the gold connectors. I have been soldering and wiring things since I was a kid. My wire-fu is strong sir! My newest trick is repairing LCD monitors that I used to throw away. Turns out that almost every time all that is wrong with them is a few bad caps. You just unsolder them from the board, and solder in new ones, and your junk monitor is like new!

One of these days I'll post pictures of my Mondial's completely re-wired, all LED, instrument panel. It is a thing! (All LEDs except the generator light - that one has to have the resistance curve of an incandescent to work correctly.)

 

Yes.
Then read the thread and check the pictures here, http://www.thebestemployee.com/forum/showthread.php?t=105576&highlight=348+valve+cover+leak

 

>> Yes

Uh-huh, but why? My valve covers leak a lot and all over the place. Maybe this would make sense if there was just one small leak, I suppose, although I still don't see how the knowledge of the location of even one small leak would affect one's procedure in the repair. It is not as if one could remove the valve cover, apply a dab of sealant at the offending area and replace the cover. I wish! No, you have to do the whole drill from start to finish with a fresh gasket o-ring and everything, so again, what good does it do you to learn the exact area or areas of failure from the previous job?

I am going to stick my neck out and state that I think that cleaning, driving, and observing is an obsolete habit acquired while working on other cars whose valve covers are not so demanding. There are lots of engines where one can do the above, spot a leak, and do a spot repair. Unless I am misinformed, not so on the 348! On this engine there is only one procedure and that is to remove the valve cover, clean the cover and the head, and then re-install the cover with all new gaskets and sealant - no shortcuts. So again, how does taking a bunch of time to discover the points of failure on the old job help one to do better next time??? Do you put extra goo in places where it leaked last time? I don't think so, what then? Please enlighten me!

 

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Funny guy

 

So, Tony since you are so intelligent, why don't you drop the humble act for just a minute. Come on guy, let your light shine! Show off just this once and explain just exactly what the answer to my question is. Or if my question is so stupid there isn't an answer, please break it down for me and really embarrass the heck out me once I, guided by your light, see my question in all it's imbecility. I mean it's pretty easy to poke fun at someone who is ignorant compared to your encyclopedic wealth of knowledge, but its more gracious to share of your bounty, isn't it?

Thank you ever so much!

 

Oh hell, I am so stupid. I thought Tony was making fun of my question. I should have realized that it's just a self portrait.

 

Hey buddy, I hear Men's Hairclub has worked wonders! Give them a jingle.

 

"""I am going to stick my neck out and state that I think that cleaning, driving, and observing is an obsolete habit acquired"""

Why? Because I am trying my best to save you from your own worst enemy, yourself. I am nothing but a simple mechanic that happens to work on these cars. As a rule, I break home computers and do not even try to fix them.... I grew up with the most brilliant EE I have ever known as my father and had schooling in the same.... but I work on cars as a living and a hobby, I stick to just breaking PC's. Anything sticking yet? At least after two pages we are past stating Assumptions as Fact but that following instructions thing.... As Absurd as it sounds, there is method to my madness and we do not waste time cleaning and driving cars just to make billable hours, I am too damn busy for that nonsense.

Case in point, A few weeks back we had a situation with a 348 oil leak where someone drilling out a broken plastic plug wire retainer clip from the cam cover, drilled straight through the cover itself. The resulting leak dripped from the front corner of the cam cover and for all the world looked like it was the gasket. Situation 2 had an engine recently serviced where some brilliant individual decided to substitute an SAE Oring on the seal holder.... no amount of "GOO" would have sealed this high durometer reading, under sized Oring.

As "Obsolete" as the concept sounds to you, knowledge is your friend. In the first case the cover never had to come off to fix the problem. In the second case one could have used a whole tube of GOO and it still would have leaked.

Last.... why Brake Cleaner? Because water has a difficult time breaking down oil. The minds eye visual I am coming up with at this point doesn't have current cam cover paint condition as a top priority on this car.... just a guess on my part.

 

I would just leave it be.. Do what you want and how you want.. What evere makes you comfortable.. to question someone like Dave Helms when he is giving advise and instruction is an insult.. If Dave advises to hop on one leg four times before picking up a wrench.. guess what I am doing? It doesnt matter if it makes sense to you.. follow his lead and report as indicated.. This forum is lucky to have Dave and we all benefit day in and day out.. Stop insulting, annoying, patronizing etc.. each other.. This thread is becoming a pissing match...which is not good... lets simmer down folks and concentrate on the task at hand... Clean your motor, take for a drive and find out where the oil leak is coming from.. then report back before the people that really know what they are talking about decide to give up on you and leave you on your own..

R

 

My opinion? I would leave you to be on your own and wish you all the best with your car. Seems like we are shoveling sand against the tide boys..

R

 

I think you are wasting your time with this guy Dave.

I have seen some guys change rear main seals on American motors because the bottom of the engine was covered with oil. The correct way to fix it in the end was to spray brake kleen on engine , run it & repair leak at intake manifold or in some cases rocker cover.

 

They just LOOK like they are leaking all over the place.
CLEAN THEM OFF AND GO FOR A DRIVE. You will then find the SOURCES.
Read the hundreds of other threads dealing with this exact issue and you will find all of your answers and how to fix the problem.

Quit arguing with what other people already know the answer to. http://www.thebestemployee.com/forum/showthread.php?t=105576&highlight=348+valve+cover+leak

You are the newby in this issue. LEARN from the guy that has been fixing your leak problem for the last 30 YEARS.











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Spasso...YOU SAID IT ALL!