Avoiding FUSEBOX "China Syndrome" MELTDOWN: Pre-emptive fix

Log onto suderiarampante.com and give Dave or Nikki a holler. They'll fix you up.

 

Dear Dave,

Please accept my profound apologies for any intimation that you would ever do something just to make billable hours. You integrity and character would never permit such shenanigans, and that fact is obvious to anyone who has spent any time on this board. I didn't say that, and I definitely wasn't thinking it at all! I understand though why you thought that was what I might have been implying. I should have anticipated the potential misunderstanding, and worded my question differently. I'm sorry.

Randy Lee

 

No it isn't. Dave Helms is a real gentleman to take the time and share his very valuable advice with us. However, if no one is allowed to ask questions, that value is severely undermined. For that to happen would be a real waste, and I think Dave's work here deserves more respect than that!

I think your comment is an insult to me. I asked a sincere question based upon my best understanding of his recommended procedure. I spent a lot of time and effort framing my question to point out what seemed to me to be a gap in the logic of the procedure as Dave explained it. Yes, the way a small portion of my question was worded was unfortunate, and for that I have apologized to Dave. However, now I have an answer, an answer to what I still think is a legitimate question, and one that the next guy will get to read and not have to wonder about.

What I think you are failing to realize is that the answer Dave provided is only one answer out of infinity. Dave might have given another answer, and that answer might have contained critical information, critical information that would have remained undocumented until I asked my question! In my book that would have given me a small part of the credit due Dave for his generous work here. See? You should be thanking me, not chastising!

In this case I don't think the answer is critical, but it is important. My take away is that one has to use one's judgement in diagnosing the source of the leak. If it is painfully obvious that the oil is indeed coming from the valve covers, perhaps you just go ahead, but you know that you are taking a chance. Also, now that I know what the precise purpose is of the cleaning step, I understand much better how much effort is involved and how much precision is needed to successfully carry out the step, so now I can make the best decision as to how to proceed. Try to remember guys, what is the best procedure for a pro to follow is not always exactly the best procedure for a guy working on his own car. However, such an individual would be well advised to first understand exactly what the pro does before making any changes.

Now I have that understanding.* Thank you very much, Dave!

*In this tiny microcosm of the totality of Dave's knowledge. JUST A TINY MICROCOSM! Please don't start posting comments about "...who is this guy who thinks he's as smart as Dave Helms?" I know your'e thinking it! Stop!

 

Can someone please tell me why when making orange juice we squeeze the oranges? Just want to make sure there is not any additional information that I may be missing here.. I am not a pro at squeezing oranges.. Oh I get it.. my mistake.. Be well and as I said before I hope you are able to fix your troubles.

R

 

>> cam cover condition

No, that is not a problem. The previous owner had them powder coated. They will look pretty again. What threw me about cleaning my engine with brake cleaner is that the whole block is coated with oil. (Your Exon Valdez crack really hit the mark! ) To try to clean that with brake cleaner would have been I think a problem. But now that I understand what the point is of doing the cleaning, I can proceed sensibly.

I am starting to wonder if there is another leak somewhere, but confirming and fixing the valve cover leak(s) is a good place to start.

 

I agree..

R

 

Thanks R! Judging by my progress in the last two years on this car, I am sure that I will.

 

Now my head hurts.... there isn't enough coffee in the pot to get me through that! A thread that started about melting fuse boxes and the system I designed to rectify the problem has now critiqued near every product I have designed and am building. Not just constructive critiques but "I can make it better and cheaper using freezer wrap"..... Have at it, build it and if that isn't a show stopper, price out product liability insurance to sell it after a minimum of 5 years in Beta with multiple examples being tested simultaneously. Some just don't get it, the melting fuse boxes have numerous problems and it is NOT just the fuse box that needs to be addressed.... its a package deal. Fix one thing and you will find the next weakest link unless you address it as a package. To do this effectively one has to analyze dozens of examples if not hundreds over the course of many years. The current repair mentality is to state "All Indians walk single file because the ones I saw did". The mere suggestion of this type of thing is outrageous at best and is what has led to the reputation these cars now have. Carry that argument forward to the SRI Gold Connector Kit which has been called into question..... As stated earlier, it wont fix a flat tire, stop an oil leak or reset improperly timed cams but what it does do (IF properly done following the instructions TO THE LETTER) is nothing short of incredible. Near a thousand hours of R&D, tens of thousands of dollars invested into making it as good as I possibly can and constantly upgrading it to simplify the install process..... You can damn well bet I would not be making that investment if I did not believe in this 100%. In this day and age where Instant Gratification is a requirement, it is extremely difficult to find folks willing to invest the time, effort and focus required to do this correctly. Those that do give the required effort experience the results, for others there is freezer wrap. Loose this mentality, put the gloves on and get to work doing it correctly if just this once. Not a half assed effort but one where perfection is being sought.... Once you get a taste of the results you will always strive for it but it never comes easy, it takes effort.

No apology needed, No Freudian analysis required, just clean the damn leaking lump with what ever method you choose and figure out where you need to stick your finger in the hole.

Use brake clean in an unsafe manner and blow the whole thing sky high. Use water under pressure and end up with every electrical connection on the engine soggy and unable to transmit a signal. What ever method you choose, do it completely, correctly and above all, safely. I will only tell you once how explosive brake cleaner is on a hot light bulb.... been there, wear the scars, enough said.

 

Well said Dave. Love your Avatar - says it all!

 

It only takes ONE answer (out of infinity) to address the issue properly. All you have to do is follow the suggestions and quit second guessing everybody.

You are over thinking and over complicating this issue.

 

Well put D.. How are you.. hope all is well.

R

 

>>You are over thinking and over complicating this issue.

I know it looks that way, but I promise you I am not. I needed the information contained in Dave's subsidiary answer. He most generously filled me in, and now I understand what I need to understand in order to proceed. 'nuff said.

 

There are very few times in my life that I've been left speechless, but some of the posts on this thread don't even deserve a response.

I've only been doing this professionally(top tier racing) for 45 years and if there is one thing I've learned it's this..."I don't ever have to compete with ignorance and stupidity".....why? Because they defeat themselves and are never a threat.

Everything in SRI's gold connector kit is not only first class but it WORKS!!

 

Dave, I have a quick question. I think my fuse box on my 87 Mondial 3.2 is OK. Everything seems to work fine. Visually I see no charring or burns. Other than the rear windows going up and down slowly (which is probably a separate 23 yr old thick dried out grease issue), everything "seems" ok. How do you know when to bite the bullet? Is there a test you can do, such as checking voltages somewhere? Heat checks on specific wires in there? Your thoughts please. Thanks in advance.

 

Making a fusebox for TR : its ready.
Acording to the Wiring diagram of Mr. Robert Hayden, TR Euro specification, everything is working fine.

Guido
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Watch the two red wires where they enter the fuse box for any signs of distortion in the insulation. Watch all of the plug connections for any heat browning of the white plastic plugs. The 3.2 is quite tolerant of these problems and will give you plenty of advance warning that something is a miss.

Honestly, I see no advantage to doing the upgrade in advance of problems or signs of heat damage as my system is meant to deal with that. If it isnt broken, drive the wheels off it.

 

....here ya go.
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Those are just amazing, to look at........

 

Thanks Dave! We will keep watching!!!

 

Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Yes Guys, those boxes are amazing TO LOOK AT, but they WORK PERFECT ALSO.

Except for Dave, Zertec and myself, nobody came up with a SOLID, PERMANENT solution.

Spending all your energy on TALKING and not using your energy in inventing ideas or making things better, great....

Zertec's fusebox I did not see...so I have no comment there.

Dave has a GOOD solution...thanks Dave for putting your energy in those POSITIF things.

But I have some doubts about his solution :

- He is using your ORIGINAL box and this is irretrievable. If you want to sell your car, the future buyer will say it is not original, even that it is better than original. He will have a point to reduce prices.
_ Until now nobody showed me the inside of Dave's boxes> So I assume the original plastic layers are still in place and waiting to fall to dust. Also he is using copper wires to make connections between female, male and relay connectors. So why your criticism regarding to the system he is using and mine ?

Regarding to the boxes I make : since 2 years my boxes are working perfectly. My experience has resulted in even better connections, not more than handwarm relays and no more electric gremlins regarding fuseboxes.
- All elements are new. Mainboard is 2 mm instead of 1.5 mm original.
- Female connector pins have 2.5 mm2 copper pins that spread the warmth all over the system (see picture). Those are all handmade by myself...you dont find them on the marked.
- Copper wires that are used can stand 4000 w or in 12 V term : 333 A.
Female and male connectors can stand double amperage of the original connectors.
- IF a solderpoints cracks, what I dont see to happen, this can be fixed in a minit.
- The white connections can be re-used after some minor transformation. The LOOK will be as close as possible to original.
- Your old fusebox you can keep, you dont have to send it for transformation> If you sell the car, it can be put back (if a buyer wants it) . Only the female connectors in the white connectors have to be changed.
I'm thinking of producing some boxes in limited edition. If interested let me know, so I can send you more information. Those boxes are very SOLID and a PERMANENT solution.
- There are NO secrets about my boxes...you see how I make them. All of you can make them this way...

Guido
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

I hope you did not misunderstand my posts Richard. Personally I believe it is Great to finally have choices in this industry.

I highly respect the effort required to do what you have done, that is no small under taking. That stated, calling to question anyone elses design with a lack of knowledge of those designs is questionable procedure. There are a number of very well done fuse boxes (boxes Only) available now for folks to choose from if they are needed.

It is good to have doubts but make sure they are based on knowledge, not lack of the same.

 

But to know more about whats inside I have to see how it is inside of your boxes...
Without seeing it...the doubts will stay. Why is it so difficult to show what inside those boxes ?
On the other hand every one can see how my boxes are made....no secrets there.

Guido

 

In regards to Dave's board mods, suffice it to say that the high amperage circuits that cause most of the problems on these circuit boards are completely isolated from the original printed circuit paths AND isolated from the under designed connectors (the white ones) along the bottom of the circuit board assy.

The mods have their own dedicated power supply and output paths. Otherwise, the original board is intact.

You might consider that in many cases, saving the original circuit board for future resale value is a waste of time when many of them have melted, burned and damaged internal printed circuits, therefore moot.

Because of the electrical weaknesses in my TR are eliminated permanently there is no way I would take a hit for non-originality during a sale. That's like taking a hit for installing one of Newmans one-piece differential carriers in place of the exploding two-piece OEM unit. That will add even more value to the car. If a potential buyer has a problem with permanent solutions to expensive failures then I'm wasting my time with the guy.











..................