Brawn on MS - proof is in the telemetry | Page 4 | FerrariChat

Brawn on MS - proof is in the telemetry

Discussion in 'F1' started by Ferraripilot, Sep 29, 2010.

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  1. Aircon

    Aircon Ten Time F1 World Champ
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    Peter
    is there a link to that guy?
     
  2. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    John!

    I have never known a surgeon who was worse at their job at 41 than at 30. Sure they eventually lose it, but for them it's much later as it is indeed not as athletic, but just like justice Renquist at 80 years old, they are 100% all there. Granted F1 is more physically demanding, it is also mentally demanding on an equal if not greater level.

    The idea of the sport is to concentrate and make their way around a track as quick as possible all the while maintaining their senses through the vast g-forces they are subjected to. Sounds like an astronaut to me, and plenty of 40+ year old astronauts are at the top of their game no problem. However it is undoubtedly more difficult to maintain the required physique at 40+ than at 23, but still possible. Plenty of iron man finishers and heavy competitors 40+
     
  3. Aircon

    Aircon Ten Time F1 World Champ
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    exactly. while MS was happy to admit he probably wasn't as good now as he was at his peak, he didn't quite seem ready to admit he was 'past it' :)
     
  4. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    John!
    that sounds about right. it's going to be more difficult for him now, but certainly not out of the game for a mentality fit guy like him
     
  5. LightGuy

    LightGuy Four Time F1 World Champ
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    David
    Fat Lady aint singing yet;

    "Old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill".

    MS just has to get his mind in the right place again. And Mercedes the tightwads are not going to pay anyone to sit on their but. They'll have him drive the transporter if nothing else.
    But yes now Rosberg has come into the limelight as he should have been all along.
     
  6. TifosiUSA

    TifosiUSA F1 Veteran

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    DJ
    Yes, case in point Austria 2002 is brought up all the time on here.
     
  7. ProCoach

    ProCoach F1 Veteran
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    +1
     
  8. ProCoach

    ProCoach F1 Veteran
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    I remember that test...
     
  9. mbarr

    mbarr Karting
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    Jan 11, 2004
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    Nice analogy. I think with any true sport, the prime years are from the mid 20's to the mid 30's age wise. I'm a huge ms fan, but i think he has passed his winning years. I'd love to see him up front again, but i dont think its going to happen
     
  10. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    John!
    You may very well be right. I just need to see him with a proper instrument at his disposal to see for sure. He certainly remains in brilliant shape so I have to hand it to him for keeping up with the kids in that department.
     
  11. Wolfgang5150

    Wolfgang5150 F1 Rookie

    Oct 31, 2003
    4,706
    I really don't want to get into another Schu argument again; nor does this section need another one; but today's practice was interesting - based on the comments made by Brawn that started this thread. Suzuka is alot of high speed corners, and MS had his best Friday practice in a long time; which would validate what Brawn has said. Not sure why he can't work the tires in slow corners (also of interest was how Massa admitted he is having the same problems). Maybe the MS of 10 years ago would have struggled as well (who knows)
    Anyhow - just thought it was interesting........
    KS (not MS)
     
  12. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    No.

    That man was invincible.


    The fact that you (and I consider you a fan of his) are even raising this question shows that he is not doing himself and his legacy a favor right now.
     
  13. barbazza

    barbazza Formula 3
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    John
    How does this diminish his legacy exactly?
     
  14. CRG125

    CRG125 F1 Rookie

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    Thats the problem, the guy is human and every sports person has a bad season. He is still IMO one of the best of all time.
     
  15. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    #90 tifosi12, Oct 8, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2010
    Depends on what you define as legacy:

    - If you are talking about the long term effects, then there is no effect as the history books will always show him as the man with most WDCs etc

    - If you are talking about the short term effects, then you can see how people are starting to ask questions: It is one thing if the non-fans like eg. PSK question the authenticity of MS' 7 titles, but it is an altogether different thing if MS supporters like Wolfgang5150 now are making comments like this. And I'm not picking on Wolfgang here. Just go to any online forum and read the blogs and you'll see thousands of people "hating" on Schumacher and wondering whether he ever was a worthy champion etc.

    It is a problem as old as sports itself: When is the best moment to leave? The lucky ones get out on top. Whether it is basketball, soccer, boxing or racing, makes no difference.
     
  16. Wolfgang5150

    Wolfgang5150 F1 Rookie

    Oct 31, 2003
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    OK - I'm making a vow not to turn this into an arguement.
    To me, his legacy is fine; what he's trying to do is almost impossible, if he becomes competitive - or wins - his legacy will only grow.

    He was invincible back in the day due to a combination of factors, but one of the biggest was his relentless testing. I remember (and miss) his testing starting every Tuesday-Thursday after a race. If he had today's car back then he would be pounding around Fiorano - or somewhere else - developing the car.
    I believe that part of the lure to come back has backfired on him - the original appeal of no in-season testing, based on being able to spend time with his family. I'm the same age as him (we were also married in April 95), and our kids are the same age (Pretty sppoky actually), so I am familiar with his family dynamics and can relate as I used to travel alot for work. At the end of 2006 he did need a break....
    I think he thought Brawn would develope another world beater, he wouldn't have to test, and be able to spend alot of time at home. Obviously this plan hasn't worked.
    BUT - I don't put it down to his losing ability.
    Just my opinion based on facts & experince - and I do value yours as well.
    Kevin
     
  17. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    You're married to Schumacher?!? ;)


    Sorry, couldn't resist.

    I value your opinion as well and you're quite right about the lack of opportunity to test and the sucking car. But I also strongly believe if we could timewarp Nico and the MB into 2000, MS would have waxed him.
     
  18. Wolfgang5150

    Wolfgang5150 F1 Rookie

    Oct 31, 2003
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    lol - I KNEW that didn't read correctly.......

    Your probably right about 2000; one of the things that rarely gets mentioned about MS was his relentless work ethic.....
     
  19. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Goes along the lines of him introducing serious fitness for F1 drivers.

    Senna and others were already trying to be fit, but he took it to a different level with his fitness guru Willy Dungl. MS brought workout gear into his trailer and pioneered the "neck muscle" training machine.
     
  20. barbazza

    barbazza Formula 3
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    The haters will always hate. Makes no difference if he came back or not.

    As my fellow Van Halen fan said: "his legacy is fine" :)
     
  21. Wolfgang5150

    Wolfgang5150 F1 Rookie

    Oct 31, 2003
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    lol!!! Pretty cool you recognized it! (go to youtube and search for EVH 'Ripley' - wow!)
     
  22. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    You pretty well nailed it.
    It is difficult for an athlete to know when to retire and tough to pull the pin even when, in their heart of hearts, they know the time has come.
    A comeback on the other hand is so rarely successful that is almost always ill advised.
     
  23. Wolfgang5150

    Wolfgang5150 F1 Rookie

    Oct 31, 2003
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    A very fair statement; the easiest comparison is Michael Jordan - his legacy is unrivaled to most people. The majority of people (myself included) can't remmeber too much about his comeback.....but i can't remove the image of the red #23 with that famous fade jump shot.....
     
  24. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    I'm still trying to forget his foray into baseball.
     
  25. David Hudson

    David Hudson Karting

    Jan 20, 2008
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    David Hudson
    And the Schumacher moto-gp experience! Best, David
     

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