C&D: 599 HGTE vs. LF-A

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/car/10q4/2011_ferrari_599_hgte_vs._2012_lexus_lfa-video

This one didn't end well for the 599. What was most intriguing was that the LF-A didn't get the nod on price, interior features, or other areas not connected to driver involvement but was instead preferred beacuse they deemed it a better, more exciting drive. It took points on areas such as balance, steering feel, driver engagement, engine noise, etc....areas where Ferrari traditionally shines. Has anyone driven the LF-A? Is C&D out of their mind or is this a valid observation? C&D essentially stated that Ferrari needs to re-instill a little more mojo in their cars.

What's more the test numbers for the 599 were very disappointing...all-around performance was far less than what previous tests have recorded.

 

Its a matter of latest and greatest. Honestly i hate the LF-A and everything it stands for.

 

Wouldn't a better compo be LF-A vs 599 GTO? This test is irrelevant...

 

I agree that a test with a 599 GTO would make far more sense.

In this case were the stats recorded for the 599 in rainy Britain?

This video is pretty interesting in that regard, see 8min 57 onwards.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9clwjR5zxQ

 

and what does it stand for in your opinion?

 

I expect people who frequent sites like this one to be of average to high intelligence.

That's what I get for assuming things.

Sorry, I couldn't help myself. This statement is just so silly.

 

I would personally chose a 599 ...

But according to what I have read, the LFA is a perfect sportscar,the only negative side is the Gearbox that is not Quick enough.

 

Isn't the LF-A significantly more expensive and made of carbon fiber??
And it has no GT pretensions whatsoever. Silly comparison. Put it against the GTO, as others have said.

Forza,


Cavallini

 

No GT pretensions?

What's the Leather 10-way power adjustable seats about? How about customization down to the color of stitching on the door handles? Chris Harris claims its the best interior in the supercar world... “The fit and finish, and just the sheer levels of fetishism, that have been lavished on this interior, I think, know no equal. It’s just stunning. The materials are stunning, the finish is stunning, it just feels so special.”

The GTO isn't a GT. The LFA is a Sportscar/GT. I love Toyota, and Ferrari, which is why I joined this site. But the LFA is only produced in 500models. The Nurburgring edition is more towards the 599GTO. But even then, it still isn't a decontented interior, still has the all the luxury features. Do you get a backup camera and widescreen GPS in the 599GTO? How about those GT pretensions again?

 

You are an example of your own statement man. Its an opinion. Much like i stated. Learn comprehension and comment on something more worthwhile. Your whole post is nothing more then an example of itself. I just dont think the LF-A offers what it should for a price that high. I dont like it. You do. So go buy one.....

 

I just received my copy of C&D and am having a hard time believing how the Lexus beat the 599 HGTE. I'm shocked that the 599 needs 3.8 secs to 60! C&D tested a 599 back in summer of 2007 and timed 3.3 to 60.

 

Re: the slow acceleration times, there could be several factors:
1. tested on a wet, rough surface
2. could the press cars Ferrari provides to the mags for initial testing be ringers?
3. this particular 599 had an issue, though it was never mentioned in the story

 

Agreed...and then there'd be, as Troy Aikmann says: No Question About It!

Enjoy!

 

C&D has not been to kind in the last few issues, first the 458 which is universally praised finishes behind the 911 Turbo "S", and now the 599 HGTE behind the LFA. In the past C&D had been pretty Ferrari friendly and had some of the quickest acceleration numbers, now they have some of the poorest. Funny they got the worst time for both a 458 and 599 on the 0-60 and the best anyone has ever done on the LFA. C&D and R&T are now owned by the same company and a shadow of their former self. To think R&D had writers like Rob Walker, Innes Ireland, and C&D had Brock Yates and Csaba C. Fortunately, Peter Egan is still at R&D and John Phillips is at C&D.

Really the European magazines like EVO do a much better job with guys like Chris Harris. When he compared the 458 to the 911GT3RS it was a much better argument.

No offense to anyone here, but IMHO the LFA is not an attractive design regardless of what the price is, followed by the Nissan GTR. They are aesthetically pretty bad. Just my opinion.

 

I couldn't agree more about the comments about C&D and R&T. The British mags are pricier over here but they are worth in IMO. I hate how the US mags always have a brief intro about the two cars and then go right into ranking them. I like how the Brit mags talk about actually driving the cars and cover each car's strengths and weaknesses while actually talking about the overall experience with both. I don't think cars like these are things that should be ranked with the point system that the American mags use.

I actually do like the way the LFA looks, particularly those vents on the sides just by the rear quarter windows, but it doesn't look like a $400 grand USD car.

 

From what I have read, the paddle shift transmission in the LFA is outdated. I recall one of the mags - I forget which - describe it as where Ferrari was 10 years ago. Even if the car is otherwise excellent, an outdated shifter of the kind described is a significant hurdle to overcome. Obviously, I have never driven the LFA, nor do I own a Ferrari (maybe one day).

 

I wonder how the values of the LFA will hold against the GTO... Seems like Lexus has a pretty good track record in keeping them up and not taking taking a bath a year or two after purchase

 

but then again... they haven't produced a car in excess of 100k before either...

so when the collapse of the world comes... the higher end always has a further distance to fall.

Also, 599s are still in the 200s... everyone should remember these cars sold for 500 when the first came out... the 500 was significantly market up... thats not the manufacturers fault. Whats the relation of a 599 sticker vs its current price??????

 

There's only 500 examples of the LFA, like I said before. It's Lexus's first Supercar. It'll retain value thanks to limited numbers. At 375K you're only 1 out of 500 to get one. The HGTE comes close to that price and is far from limited to 500 examples. You can't get the GTO for less than 425K either, so compare it all you want to the LFA, it's still got 99 more models on assembly than the LFA (which has yet to even hit production, all the models their testing a prototypes). The Transmission they're using is a single clutch automated manual because they wanted to maintain the 'feel' of the shifts. The article says that they only complained about the 'clunkiness' in AUTO mode not Manual, so that argument is pretty useless. No one knows how the production cars will be either, because no production car is out. The tires will be different, and you can probably assume the Launch Control will work properly.

 

Insults from platinumsc aside, you are now venturing into troll territory.

Please answer the question (I really do want to know): what do you think the LFA stands for? You don't like it because it's not a good value is a far cry from hating everything it stands for.

 

LOL at this whole post, I am thinking 100K in a few years, guess we will see...

 

I bet, just like the NSX huh? How much is that thing going for? You still see models with 30K miles retaining 60% of their value. Same thing with the Toyota Supra. You can't even find one for less than 25K without miles over 100K. You should do some fact checking. Lexus holds it's value far better than most auto makers, the same should apply to their first Supercar.

 

Both cars have gotten rave reviews worldwide and you can't go wrong with either. I've heard both the LFA and GTO in person and they sound glorious!

The LFA won by a point so for all intents and purposes it was a tie

I agree here, the Euro mags are far better. Chris Harris does a great job for EVO and Excellence now. C&D lost me YEARS ago as did most mags here.

Sports Car International was the best mag here by far but no longer is around

 

The impressive aspect of the LFA is the apparent responsiveness of the engine - more F1 like than even the Ferrari. The rest of it I'm not so sure about; might be a cool additional sports car for the guy with a dozen high end cars or so. Didn't realize that a 599HGTE was so expensive - $400K is kind of crazy and very close to GTO territory. Makes a used 599 for $220K or so look like the deal of the century.

 

I hated the attempt at marketing it like they did, trying to sell it like the F50. Like it was going to sell out immediately then command a premium from all those who wanted it but couldnt get their hands on it. For the price, it was never anything that was going to command a premium, let alone make up for the price it was already at. They stated that every car was sold out, but then they started saying more were available. Then they pulled the whole "lease to own" wannabe F50 style of purchase. Like I said, I hate everything it stands for. Not saying the performance isnt impressive, becuase it is, but I just dont like how they brought the whole thing to market and how they handled it from day one. Hopefully that doesnt label me a "troll".....