...a real classic Maserati! | Page 24 | FerrariChat

...a real classic Maserati!

Discussion in 'Maserati' started by wbaeumer, Feb 2, 2008.

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  1. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
    Looking on this photos I am not convinced by the lines of the rear fender (ph. 3 from top).
    First I was sceptical about the radiator opening but it seems they got it right here! I never saw the car in this finished condition so I can not say more.

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  2. johnei

    johnei Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 22, 2006
    1,298
    Seattle
    Full Name:
    John Wiley
  3. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
  4. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
    #579 wbaeumer, Oct 27, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2010
    The A6G-2000 #2137 was sold by RM in London for 620,000 GBP. Plus 12% Premium = 700,000 GBP (=801,898 Euros).

    Hmmmm....highest and alleged bid in Monaco earlier this year was 850,000 Euros.

    The car had got a new body and we heared by a member of this forum, who saw the car in Monaco, that it was not very well made.

    So this was quite a poor result compared to the very good and original Zagato (#2105) that was auctioned at Pebble Beach in August this year.

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  5. The Red Baron

    The Red Baron Formula 3

    Jan 3, 2005
    1,141
    Full Name:
    Warren
    Was there a VAT of 17.5% on top of this price that had to come out of the purchasers pocket?
     
  6. Wolf

    Wolf Formula Junior

    Nov 17, 2003
    500
    I think that was all the money in the world for that
    car considering it needs a proper new body and a lot of attention (=$$) and
    then will always be a rebodied car regardless of the excellent
    racing history.

    Regards

    Wolfi
     
  7. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
    Not sure about that!

    The car was sold to a collector from Southern Europe.

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  8. mairesse

    mairesse Karting

    Nov 20, 2009
    145
    London and Cotswolds
    Full Name:
    Gordon
    On the VAT question I think it depends where the new owner registers it. But even if it is the fiscally retarded UK there are rules which reduce it to single digits (5 or 6% I think) if the car is rare enough, which clearly this is.
     
  9. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
    I think within the EU there is no VAT? The car was in Italy and is now going to be registered in an EU-country or in the UK -which is also in the EU.
    So...?

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  10. mairesse

    mairesse Karting

    Nov 20, 2009
    145
    London and Cotswolds
    Full Name:
    Gordon
    The catalogue made a specific disclosure that VAT applied on the purchase. I think any car imported into the UK, new or old, EU or outside, is liable for VAT. Of course I think this only applies once - if you can establish that a car was once UK registered then you are in the clear.
    It wouldn't surprise me if the UK's tax rules were more arcane, illogical and incomprehensible than anyone else's. Our tax system only exists to punish success and take the pleasure out of owning nice things.
     
  11. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
    in R&T 9/1965, p.96:
    There was an A6G-1500 for sale in the NY-region that was fitted with a Corvette-motor. I have no idea which car this was.

    The only car I know that was once fitted with such a motor was the ex-Bill Noon-A6G.

    So, anybody?

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  12. billnoon

    billnoon Formula 3
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    Aug 22, 2003
    1,176
    La Jolla, California
    Full Name:
    Bill Noon
    It was not a Corvette motor but a Ford small-block V8. That information however now appears to be a mistake as the former Chula Vista owner who had the car in the late 1950s and sold it to a well known La Resident who then sold the car to a Sacramento attorney all stated otherwise about the V8 engine.

    The confusion on this centers on an odd-white A6-1500 that the Sacramento owner came across after purchasing 086. He inquired with Maserati about the car and even sent them some photos. Maserati thought at the time he was still both referring to and sharing photos of 086.

    As far as I know, this is the "mystery" A6-1500 that had the Ford V8 and 086 was always fitted and running and driving with its original drive-train as it remains today.

    Anyone else ever hear of a Las Vegas based white A6-1500 with some odd features and an American drive-train?

    Cheers,

    Bill
     
  13. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
    Hi Bill,
    thanks for your clearification reg. #086.

    So, then there must be another "white" A6G-1500 somewhere in "Sin-City" (as war as this still city has any "sin"....).

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  14. ColdWater

    ColdWater Formula Junior

    Aug 19, 2006
    621
    bicoastal USA
    Confirming Bill's remarks, there is no doubt that #086 retains today its original, matching-numbers engine. The origin and validity of the story about a temporary Ford transplant are unclear, but there are no traces whatsoever of any modification to the engine compartment. The engine mounts, interior panels, cooling system, etc. are all identical to known factory originals. The individual who first restored #086 in the early 1980s has stated that he saw no modifications at that time.

    In August 1983 the 'Sacramento owner' wrote to Mr. Cozza about the mysterious white car, which was clearly an A6 1500 but with modified bodywork, particularly the windscreen, grill and taillights. The letter states "The vehicle has two complete engines, each of which carries the identifying numbers, A6 1502." These must have been Maserati engines, as the Sacramento owner would undoubtedly have remarked otherwise. Perhaps an American drivetrain was added later ?

    I have just discovered that this mystery car, with unquestionably the same modified windscreen, grill and taillights, is on display in the new Museo Automovilistico de Malaga in Spain which opened on 17 September. The collection is owned by Joao Manuel Magalhaes of Oporto, Portugal. The car is now painted red (of course): http://www.museoautomovilmalaga.com/ingles/coches/dolce.html

    Anyone available to look for chassis / engine / PF body numbers ?

    Don
     
  15. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
    Don,
    unfortunately no photo(s) here of the mysterious "white-" now red-car.
    Anybody?

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  16. ColdWater

    ColdWater Formula Junior

    Aug 19, 2006
    621
    bicoastal USA
    #591 ColdWater, Nov 1, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Walter,

    You will regret asking for these. They were taken in 1983.

    The back as it is now can be seen in the link to the museum's website that I posted above. I have a current photo from the front, but it is from a friend and I hesitate to post without his prior authorization.

    The windshield is a match for the grill and taillights, if not any other part of the car. And now there are three portholes in each fender, one more than a Cisitalia, perhaps because this is 6 cylinders rather than 4 ? Or maybe Buick influence ?

    There cannot be more than one car that looks so . . . distinctive.

    Best,
    Don
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  17. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
    Don,
    yep, you are right. The rear end lurcks in a little on the website.

    Its s/n 093. I got pictures of it in 2005, now painted in an incorrect red (Ferrari-red?) color.

    The car was sold new to Principe Vittorio Massimo, Roma, Italy and was painted blue -which is a fantastic color IMO.
    Unfortunately they missed it totally with the red...

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  18. Boudewijn

    Boudewijn F1 Rookie
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    May 15, 2003
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    Boudewijn Berkhoff
    #593 Boudewijn, Nov 2, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  19. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
    Boudewijn,
    ...agree with you! The car looks quite out of portion!

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  20. ColdWater

    ColdWater Formula Junior

    Aug 19, 2006
    621
    bicoastal USA
    #595 ColdWater, Nov 2, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    It seems that someone had a Maserati, but really wanted an AC Aceca.

    Thanks for the s/n, Walter. But I would say that color is the least of this car's problems.

    Don
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  21. billnoon

    billnoon Formula 3
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    Aug 22, 2003
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    Bill Noon
    What engine / gearbox does this car now have? When in Vegas in the late 1970s / early 1980s it had a Ford drive-train.

    From the photos back then and now, it is a fair guess the car was substantially rebodied. If anyone has access to the car, there should be hundreds 2, 3 and 4 digit PF numbers on just about anything you look at that could come apart if any of the coachwork trim is original to the car.

    Cheers,

    Bill
     
  22. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
    Owner Project Master

    May 10, 2006
    17,846
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    John!


    Anyone know if this was the car that somehow lost it's drivetrain somewhere along the route 66 desert in Arizona only for it to be rediscovered sitting outside for many years in the 90s? I believe Kyle Fleming unearthed the thing years ago but cant' recall what it was for.....
     
  23. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
    Don, very well said ::))

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  24. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    Mar 4, 2005
    8,987
    Bill,
    just checked my records - its a correct A6G-1500 installed in 1-carb.-specification. No idea about the gearbox.

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  25. Boudewijn

    Boudewijn F1 Rookie
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    May 15, 2003
    4,133
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    Boudewijn Berkhoff
    #600 Boudewijn, Nov 2, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017

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