What are your thoughts on Audi S4s (B6)

I had my mind made up on a G8 GT until the recent 175 inchs of snow we received... I commute about 60 miles a day plus driving while at work (roughly 25k miles a year).

Id like to avoid paying a over $25k for a new daily when the current one dies. Ive even tossed around the idea of a wrx or sti for under $20k but i think it would get old (6'3" and the miles)

I figure an S4 might be a decent compromise. How is the 06ish S4s to live with daily? maintenance costs? how does it take to light mods?

so G8 GT w/ snow tires VS. Audi S4

 

A guy who works for me has an 07 I believe and he is always *****ing about the cost of parts. Nice looking car and plenty of power but I think it may nickel and dime you a bit.

 

Why the S4? Why not the C6 A6 4.2 with Sportline? Or why not a A4 2.0T?

The B6 S4 is a nose-heavy pig and ridiculously expensive if things go wrong under the hood. It's not just the regular 4.2 shoehorned in. They had to make major changes to make it fit.

Since everyone now makes all wheel drive, why not a 3-series Xi? Or a C-Class 4Matic?

Was one of your criteria 6 speed manual only?

Eric (@the MN/WI border)

 

Get an S4 (B5) Avant with the Bi-Turbo 6 and you're a boss.

 

Actually the RS6 450hp Turbo 8s are going for mid 20s right now, great buy.

 

I just facilitated a deal for a good client to get a 2003 RS6. Amazing car, does EVERYTHING very well. But automatic only (and the trans is a weak link)

BTW, my clients car makes 540 awhp with very few mods. Also replaced the crap DRC suspension with a Stasis/Ohlins setup that rides well and handles great for the weight/size of the car.

I highly recommend the RS6!

 

Don't get the auto. It's sluggish. Real 0-60 is more like 7 seconds.

 

RS6 was Auto Only! The RS6's also had expensive repair costs http://reviews.ebay.co.uk/Owning-an-Audi-RS6-4-2-V8-Twin-Turbo_W0QQugidZ10000000007557618

Now @ the OP. Have you considered a VW R32 or how about a Volvo S60R?

 

I want an auto because i commute in traffic daily, drive in the city all the time etc... roughly 25k miles a year

4.2 A6s seem to be a bit more expensive IIRC (closer to $30k+ then $25k+). the extra size would be nice, but even with the sport package are they as "sporty" as an S4?

no MB or BMW

RS6 would be fun but i have to assume thats bigger $ if anything goes wrong. Plus its 3 or 4 years older...

 

New WRX same body as STI. Looks hot, cheaper in the end than a used POS Audi.

 

A 2005 A6 4.2 is about $1000 less than a similar 2005 S4. Of course the S4 is sportier than the A6, but it really depends on what you're after. The auto is going to 'mute' the sport of either.

IMHO, the C6 4.2 chassis feels naturally better balanced than the B6 S4. Playing with the springs, shocks, swaybars, and tires can make a C6 handle better than any B7 S4. I can't stress enough how the weight of the V8 ahead of the front axle of the B6 S4 ruins the overall feel.

The direct inject 4.2 in the A6 makes 350 horsepower, where the S4 makes 302hp. So they feel similar, although the S4 is geared for leverage (maybe to compensate?). As a result the A6 is rated 5mpg better (25 freeway vs 20 for the S4).

You can buy a very nice '05-07 C6 4.2 for under $25K. Most '05's are even under $20K. I can even find 2008's with higher miles for under $25K. S-line cars with the Sport package are harder to find, but don't bring much more $$.

The C6 A6 4.2 has also proven to be leaps and bounds more reliable than other Audis, esp older ones. Someone here mentioned the B6 S4 BiTurbo, which has been long regarded as the nadir of Audi complexity and repair bills.

Go test drive one! Carousel and Maplewood would be happy to oblige. Then come to me to find you one

 

Should i be concerned with having an out of warranty A6 4.2? I dont want high price repairs (or parts) and/or frequent issues.

Youre right, there are pretty decent buys on them but not with CPO. The S4s wernt either, but for some reason i have it in my head that isnt as bad of an idea.

 

In my second Audi right now, about to get out of it, though. It's a 2004 S4 Avant, and I'm the original owner.......Some thoughts:
Pro -
Fantastic car, for what it is, and what I wanted, which was an update of the Avant it replaced.
Built like a tank, great performance, top of the line interior. Even the Tip-tronic auto is good (and lots of fun). My previous one was the first automatic I spent my own $$ on, which is saying something.

Con -
Once it's out of warranty, there's no such thing as a "not-horrendously-expensive fix".
There are so many computers on the newer ones (this goes for all new cars, too, unfortunately), that it's annoying.
The DBW throttle sucks. I've noted that several times here, but it's across the board for VAG cars, including the Lambos, apparently.
The Tip, as great as it is the vast majority of the time, has its moments, too. And when it goes bad, it's roughly half the current value of the car to replace it, and it's not serviceable.
Gas mileage isn't great, but that's admittedly my own fault, probably. Something about that fat torque, especially once you're above about 4500 (I once averaged about 16mpg in my Miata, over its tenure).
Check the condition and age of the suspension bushings - they flex in three dimensions, and once the elasticity is gone, so is any semblance of alignment. About $2K to replace all eight of just the front end, where most of the weight is carried.

This car was designed for about a 100K life. Period. At 45K, just shy of the warranty miling-out, things started to happen rapidly.
I only haven't replaced it yet because while everything else out there may be very nice, and even fun, but is designed and built for the same limited life, and until recently, hadn't found a good, brand-new 25 year old replacement.

Those first few years with the Audis are great, though. Just don't get caught out of warranty, or you'll start to think about how enjoyable an old Ferrari is to drive for the same running costs.

 

If you're going to have a $50-60K car, you can expect to have repair bills commensurate with a $50-60K car. However, you can still be smart about it. Sure, an Audi dealer will charge $130 an hour, and full retail for genuine parts. So that front suspension job could cost $2000. OR, you find a good independent shop that charges $80 an hour, get the o.e. Febi-Bilstein suspension components from a competitive source (I can buy every control arm up front for a C6 or B6/B7 for under $300) and you can get the job done right for way under $1000.

If you're a checkbook mechanic just lease a new car and be done with it. Especially if you just drive into your local dealership, enjoy your latte and loaner car, and say yes to whatever they say. Then even a Toyota could be prohibitively expensive out of warranty.

 

CPO is a warranty. A warranty is insurance. You pay a premium and hedge your bet. You can buy a warranty for any car at any time. A CPO car is not less-likely to fail than a non-certified car.

So do your homework. You have three paths to take if you want a warranty: buy a CPO unit from an Audi dealer, buy your car from wherever you like and purchase an Audi warranty from an Audi dealer, or buy your car from wherever you want and buy an aftermarket warranty from wherever you want. Look at the overall costs and coverages and make an appropriate decision.

I wouldn't buy a warranty, but that's me. I know where to go to get work done right, at a reasonable price, and know enough not to get screwed on work I don't really need. If you cannot afford the unexpected repair, that's a different story. But if that's the case, as I mentioned, just lease a new car that is under warranty. Esp if you use your car for business, and esp if you do 25K miles/yr.

 

Back to topic:

If your choice boils down to a 2005 S4 Tip w/ 60K and a 2008 Pontiac G8 GT auto w/ 40K, I'd buy the Pontiac. Newer, lower miles, cheaper to repair, 100K mile powertrain warranty standard.

Buy a set of 17" wheels from a GTO and fit a set of 235/55R17 Blizzak WS70 winter tires. Coupled with the G8's traction/stability controls, you'll do just fine in the winter despite rear wheel drive.

And you'll have a car that can easily eat the S4 for lunch

 

Since it was snow that brought on your thought of an Audi, going with an S4 isn't going to be any improvement. One of the biggest factors in performance in the snow is the tires. Pretty much all the cars mentioned are going to be pretty bad without decent snow (or at least all season) tires.

I had an 00 Audi TT Quattro for a few years. I loved the cars, but the repairs were terrible. Oddly enough my AWD Jag X type was great! Any used European car without a warranty is leaving you subject to some huge repair bills..

 

As others have mentioned, S4, S6 and RS4 will all be big money when (not if) they break. Have a good friend that owns an independant Audi shop and stories of $5 - $10K repair bills are not uncommon. I had a B7 A4 with the 2.0T for 70K miles and it had no issues. From what I understand the 2.0T is the most reliable engine Audi has made with the possible exception of the 4.2L in the older A8. I'd suggest a 2006 - 2009 A4 2.0T. You can find ones with a warranty for $20K - $25K all day long. Add a $500 chip and you've got a car that is faster than a B6 S4, more reliable and much better on gas mileage.

 

S4 mileage and repair frequency would make baby Jesus cry...

 

Maybe even grown Jesus

 

At this point, these aren't even close to a $50K car, or even $20K. Audi depreciation is BRUTAL, but I knew that going in - both times.
The $2K for the front arms was with the Bilstein/Febi package (about $400 a year and a half ago), installed by my independent shop, and also included the two sway-bar C-links and alignment, but still........
It's a labor monster.
And then, there's anything that ever goes wrong at the front of the motor - which literally has about 15mm to the core support/radiator - i.e.: the "face" of the car comes off, except for two bolts at the bottom of the core support, which tilts forward for access.
Good thing it's a fun, well-built car, or it wouldn't be worth the trouble, and even thennnnnnn...............

BUT, you won't have that fantastic V8 sound!! And the V8 S4's sound really is that good.....it's almost a Schedule 2 drug.

I'd be mighty temped by kaisen's suggestion of the G8. One thing the S4 won't do is "throttle attitude" driving (rotation), and I've tried (even with a serious rear bar, it still just grips). You just won't have that Audi interior, or bills.

I AM gonna miss the S4, tho.

 

I bought my Audi S5 Cabriolet based on the excellent experience one of my law partners had with his S6; no problems whatsoever in over 70k miles...only oil/filter changes and tires. After $15k+ miles, my S5 has been problem free as well. It is my understanding that the Audi S5 was recently awarded the best resale value in the "Luxury Sports" class. After driving an M3 and three M5s as daily drivers over the last 15+ years, the excellent material and fit and finish of my S5 is a welcome change from the 'Chevy like' build quality of post 1993 BMWs. An Audi Prestige interior is simply the best on the market outside a Bentley; which is owned by Audi. Plus,the new Walter de Silva designed Audi's are the best looking luxury coupes/sedans on the market IMHO.

 

+1

 

I agree. Go with a wrx. The auto does rob some power, but the benefits outweigh the drawbacks based on your stated needs. Stay away from ANY out of warranty Audi. They are the bottom of the german heap when it comes to reliability. I'm a professional car appraiser/buyer and appraised 16,000+ vehicles and when it comes to longevity, its BMW, Benz, Porsche, Audi in that order. Audis under warranty however are great. Beautiful, best AWD system, and comfy. Get out of it before 4yr/or 50k though.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

 

http://www.jdpower.com/autos/Audi/2009/ While your anecdotal is interesting, other than the Q7 and A3, JD Power rates used Audi reliability as 'about average' or 'better than most' which is as good or better than the reliability ratings for BMW, Mercedes and Porsche.