Indi runner EFI redesign | FerrariChat

Indi runner EFI redesign

Discussion in '308/328' started by smg2, Jan 30, 2011.

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  1. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ Sponsor

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    OK, just a couple hundred hrs of design and engineering on this layout. will be doing the 2V layout next.

    Twin Throttles, very probable on servo type of throttle to remove linkage. both options are possible too.
    What do you guys think?

    Material specs for plenum box;
    Polycarbonate & Nylon 6/6
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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    smg2, Jan 30, 2011
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  2. SteveG75

    SteveG75 Formula Junior

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    That is sweet. Very nice job. Makes me want to whip out the credit card when you get the 2V setup done.
     
    SteveG75, Jan 30, 2011
    #2
  3. jeffdavison

    jeffdavison F1 Rookie

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    Makes me want to rip out my credit card NOW for the QV version!

    JD

     
    jeffdavison, Jan 30, 2011
    #3
  4. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ Owner Project Master

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    WOW. that is incredible. How much for a 2v setup
     
    Ferraripilot, Jan 30, 2011
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  5. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ Sponsor

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    No idea on cost. I just finished the design, now i need to make a prototype and check fitment.

    The 2v version should be a couple more days.
     
    smg2, Jan 30, 2011
    #5
  6. duck.co.za

    duck.co.za Formula 3

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    Very very neat !! Keep us posted .
     
    duck.co.za, Jan 30, 2011
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  7. Grahame

    Grahame Formula Junior

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    Do I see a theme, what with your 2v injected project and your avatar, also looking heavily injected? :D
     
    Grahame, Jan 31, 2011
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  8. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ Owner Project Master

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    Please keep us up on this! No doubt the nicest injection setup I have ever seen.
     
    Ferraripilot, Jan 31, 2011
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  9. stevel48

    stevel48 Formula 3

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    Is this for QV's? I think it looks great. It's a hell of a lot prettier than the stock box intake. Put some chrome trumpets under there and it'll look pretty hot.

    So what's the plan going forward? Will you have them manufacured?
     
    stevel48, Jan 31, 2011
    #9
  10. GrayTA

    GrayTA F1 World Champ Owner Rossa Subscribed

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    Wow, that is beautiful!!! Nicely done!!!





    PDG
     
    GrayTA, Jan 31, 2011
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  11. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ Sponsor

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    smg2, Feb 3, 2011
    #11
  12. chris_columbia

    chris_columbia Formula Junior Silver Subscribed

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    Let me start by saying I know very little about intake design. I do like that the thottle body(s) is moved to the side so that normal fuel rails can be used without interference with stock TB. I have several questions:
    1. Do you gain much power with 2 TB's?
    2. Do you gain much power with 2 seperate plenums?
    3. Nylon 6/6 seems risky. I know when running, the plenums will stay cool, but after shotdown I would think air temp could easily exceed max use temp of ~212F for Nylon 6/6.
    4. How would the polycarbonate be made? Thermoforming would not create the ribs and details you show, and machining would require the material to be polished(extrememly time consuming). Injection molding would require a $100K+ tool.
    5.How do you attach the bottom of the plenum(s) to the runners?

    Could you incorporate your previous idea of cross-over runnners in this design? Thus increasing runner length and low end torque.
     
    chris_columbia, Feb 3, 2011
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  13. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ Sponsor

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    Chris, good ?'s I'll do my best to answer them.
    1. the power gain is more from the EFI, there may also be an advantage to the smaller plenum box as the runners are longer.
    2. not really and that requires very careful synchronizing.
    3. It's technically Zytel or Nylatron and that has an upper range of 248F, the max I've read after shut down is ~180F. It's also very common in the auto industry.
    http://www2.dupont.com/Automotive/en_US/assets/downloads/nylon_under_hood.pdf
    4. It can be machined and them flame polished, I have a machine shop that specializes in plastics.
    5. That bits a secret for now :D
     
    smg2, Feb 3, 2011
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  14. luckydynes

    luckydynes F1 Rookie

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    Sweet! Looks like a really cool Lego kit :).

    Lit off my Haybusa throttle body motor/dry sump motor yesterday. You should come down and check out my test rig. I'll get subscribed and post some pics.

    Will you have one of these setups running in the near future? Thanks for sharing. I don't need yet another side track project but that looks pretty cool and all the Porsche intakes are plastic these days.

    cheers
     
    luckydynes, Feb 6, 2011
    #14
  15. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ Sponsor

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    smg2, Jun 23, 2011
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  16. Hans

    Hans F1 Veteran

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    Nice design.

    Not so sure about the polycarbonate though...

    Firstly, it may look nice on a 2009 Supra, CRX, or whatever riceburner, but to me it looks completely out of place on a 1970's/80's Ferrari.

    Secondly, how tidy will this transparent cover look on the inside after 15 minutes of running and the crankcase breather oiling up the inside?

    And finally, our cars are 25 to 37 years old now. How will a polycarbonate cover hold up over such a long period of time? My bet is brittle and yellow.

    I'd MUCH rather see this machined out of aluminium.... sorry.
     
    Hans, Jun 24, 2011
    #16
  17. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ Sponsor

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    to each their own..

    The polycarbonate will hold up just fine, the plastics of today are not the plastics of yesterday thankfully. There are many ways to keep the oil residue from infiltrating the airbox.

    The overall size and shape is nearly identical to the factory box, this is an improvement in runner length and flow along with the ability to use EFI.
     
    smg2, Jun 24, 2011
    #17
  18. chris_columbia

    chris_columbia Formula Junior Silver Subscribed

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    I love it. Think how easy it will be to run the fuel lines. And it looks like the hose to the intake is very short and avoids the current intake routing over the rear exhaust bank. I thick a drop in modern intake system will appeal to many. Of course, that is many of a very small group. But, hey, it's nice to see someone taking the strong interest.
     
    chris_columbia, Jun 28, 2011
    #18
  19. Pizzaman Chris

    Pizzaman Chris F1 Rookie

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    Very cool Scott.

    I like the box. How is a air cleaner hooked up to it? Did I miss it somewhere?
     
    Pizzaman Chris, Jun 28, 2011
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  20. Newman

    Newman F1 World Champ Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

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    You need one of those. Long runners, plenum......
     
    Newman, Jun 28, 2011
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  21. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ Owner Project Master

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    Yup. Would work well. We'll see....
     
    Ferraripilot, Jun 29, 2011
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  22. Sigmacars

    Sigmacars Formula 3 Silver Subscribed

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    your cover looks great but ther is a few thing to consider, i have an injection moulding shop for 30 years i got 40 mach.and mould for all the OEM,s polycarb has an expansion of 0.006"/inch when it gets hot so the cover has to move or it will crack or leak for shure.i been building mould for years so give me a Pm and i help you as much as i can.for thr Nylon go with the Nylon 66-40GFHST it is very good for under the hood.
     
    Sigmacars, Jun 29, 2011
    #22
  23. texasmr2

    texasmr2 Two Time F1 World Champ BANNED

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    Oh my an example of this should be in the Smithsonian, I'm getting alittle flushed! Although I'm not an owner (yet) people such as you who embark on such projects are an inspiration so keep up the good work.

    Smithsonian piece:
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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    texasmr2, Jun 29, 2011
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  24. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ Sponsor

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    An update, the above intake design is going to be bit longer till a prototype can be made. simple cost issues really.

    However not all is lost. Here's the design that is going into prototype. It's a crossover layout that does not have any clear poly covers.

    screen shots, not rendered due to graphics card issues.
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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    smg2, Jul 7, 2011
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  25. texasmr2

    texasmr2 Two Time F1 World Champ BANNED

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    Can you share some off hand numbers as far as the increase you are hoping to achieve over the stock manifold and runners? I'm thinking of the cfm and velocity but please correct me if I am off as it has been years since I researched and studied applications such as this for my MR2T.
     
    texasmr2, Jul 7, 2011
    #25
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