The official MP4-12C Thread

What do you guys think of this int?
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

To be honest, I'm skeptical of the track-pack, too. Not enough is known about this option. As far as cameras go, they soon will be out of date as newer, better HD cams hit the market every few months. Plus, why lock yourself into specific cam locations on the car when detachables are more flexible and above all, a helmet cam provides the best vantage point for seeing what the driver sees and element of speed. It's all a little too gimmicky for me, but I remain open to see the details when they are available.

The data would be useful, perhaps, depending on what they collect and how much better than an off the shelf racing package. Of that, too, I would not be certain.

 

I'm not feeling the dark tan, on this car. The best interior I have seen so far, personally, is the carbon and black/orange two-tone, on the McLaren Orange press car.

 

Damn - I must be colorblind. I thought that was Mclaren Orange on the seats.

 

Fair enough, but I am tired of constantly fighting with data/camera rigs and having to plan around it when going to the track. If I can just jump into the car, go to Monticello and always be ready, even if the cameras are not the latest issue, that would be really neat. It's like with nav units on cars. Yes, a newer Garmin is a couple hundred bucks an will run circles around any OEM system, still the convenience and integration is worth the extra expense. At least to me.

 

it might be. I think this is the same pic.
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Interior I like. Black alcantara/leather with orange stitching. Looks great with or without carbon, I think. Add orange calipers, works with many exterior shades.
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

A nice Graphite Grey option with non-stealth wheels.
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Like it

I'd go with that, or the orange sports interior. Although It looks crap on the configurator, the space fabric looks much better on the pictures and videos I have seen. Anyone here seen it on any demo cars?

I've never had a car with alcantara interior, how does it wear? Is it a pain to keep looking fresh? I am looking at keeping the car 5 years, putting 50,000+ miles on it, and don't want the interior to looks like the dog's dinner a couple of years down the line.

 

Which silver is this, titanium?
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

I would guess Supernova. But honestly, I can't tell in some of the pictures, especially when they are somewhat more artistic or using HDR photo effect.

 

That pic looks over saturated. The color looks properly rendered in the prior photo. There is no orange leather interior, just a "Saddle" tan and light tan - more like the standard light beige Ferrrari uses. I was thinking of spec'ing the dual color with the "saddle" inset with the very dark brown leather on the bolsters and upper dash rather than the black shown above. That would be with a British Racing Green exterior, which I think should look pretty good.

I agree with others on this thread that it would be nice to see some of these actual colors in the wild. The configurator sucks as far as color rendering, and you can't rotate the car to see all the angles. Are you listening McLaren?

 

I was hot for the car until I attended the big soiree in Dallas and the factory rep told me the weight was 2866 "dry." I asked if that meant no coolant, oil, intercooler coolant, hydraulic oil, fuel, etc. and he said yes.

Seriously, "dry weight?" That is about as useful as weight without seats or wheels and tires.

Tells me the car is really well over 3K lbs which is better than my Lambo, but may not be any better than my $72K body-on-frame Z06.

My crappy Elise at least weighed in at 1930 with fuel. Not in same ballpark power-wise, but more true to the light weight philosophy.

I'll wait until I can get one on scales and actually drive it.

Not that they need my $ or order to sell out for at least 2012.

Bummer that the car is probably only incrementally better than a 458 (if at all). I was sort of hoping for a quantum leap.

 

Are you talking about the weight being marginally better than the 458, or the performance?

 

Plus, z06 (and zr1) are over 3300 lbs. a minimum 200 lbs more than MP4. Not to mention that it looks (if the rumors are to be believed) like the Macca will crush any of those cars in straight line or on the track. You are not getting an incremental improvement. Only Ferrari track-only specials will be able to play with this car. You are getting a quantum leap.

 

+1

 

I thought the same, until I played around with the configurator a little.

If you select either full dual colour leather, or custom zoned interior with single colour dash, you get 3 additional secondary leather colour options.

Almond White
Mclaren Orange
Stone Grey
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

http://www.ricardo.com/en-gb/News--Media/Press-releases/News-releases1/2011/New-Ricardo-engine-assembly-facility-commences-pilot-production/

New Ricardo engine assembly facilityRicardo has today announced that production has now started at the brand new state-of-the-art, high performance engine assembly facility that it has constructed at the company’s Shoreham Technical Centre.

New Ricardo engine assembly facilityThe new Ricardo engine assembly facility has been designed to provide a near clean room production environment in which each and every process is carried out according to strict quality principles and within a comprehensive ‘no faults forward’ culture. This facility builds upon the established reputation of the Ricardo Performance Products group which has, for example, seen the company produce the advanced Ricardo-designed transmissions for the iconic Ford GT and the Bugatti Veyron supercar, as well as numerous driveline systems and components for the highest levels of competitive motorsport.

New Ricardo engine assembly facilityAt the core of the new 600 square meter building is a ten station vertical conveyor based mini-line supported by incoming materials inspection and line-side delivery of components. Each station is equipped with a sophisticated ‘human-machine interface’ (HMI) providing guidance to each operator on the precise sequence of operations required at each stage. The tools and assembly equipment used at each station are instrumented and provide data – down to the level of the torque applied to each fastener – directly into a central warranty database for each engine built, and hence provide complete finished product traceability. Each line station is interlocked via its HMI to ensure that all operations and checks have been successfully completed and recorded before the line can be indexed and the engine moved forward to the next station. In addition to the main production line, the new engine assembly facility includes a cylinder head sub-assembly line, dress area and an end of line hot test cell so that the performance of every engine produced can be fully tested and validated.

When fully commissioned in the late spring of this year, this impressive new high quality assembly centre will be capable of producing up to 4000 engines annually across two daily shifts. The facility has been designed and configured around the requirements of its lead customer, McLaren Automotive, for whom it will act as the production supplier of the all-new McLaren M838T 90 degree, V8 twin-turbo engine. The high-performance (600 PS), low emissions (279g/km CO2) engine has been designed and developed by McLaren Automotive in partnership with Ricardo, and will power the McLaren MP4-12C high-performance sports car that is due to go on sale from May 2011. With pilot production of engines commenced and initial deliveries already taking place, commissioning of the new Ricardo engine assembly facility will be continued over the next two months as production volumes are ramped up.

Commenting on the commencement of pilot production at the new Ricardo engine assembly facility, Ricardo CEO Dave Shemmans said: “We are extremely pleased to be able to announce the pilot production of the first products to be produced by this extremely impressive, quality-focused assembly facility for high performance engines. This is an important milestone and we look forward to completing the commissioning of the facility and to supplying the engine needs of the McLaren MP4-12C sports car over the coming years. The successful design and construction of this facility is highly complementary with our existing production facilities for motorsport and niche vehicle drivelines and transmissions. It also serves to demonstrate Ricardo’s comprehensive capability to design and develop the ultimate in high performance powertrain systems incorporating the very latest technologies, and to take them into quality assured and fully warranted niche production.”

 

http://www.racer.com/driven-mclaren-mp4-12c/article/197034/

There are all sorts of extraordinary things about the extraordinary new McLaren MP4-12C that will, even after a day of driving it, leave you dizzy with a mild sense of disbelief. But the thing that really gets you, what blows you away completely and makes you wonder if the world hasn't gone ever so slightly insane, is its performance.

Not just in a straight line (although in a straight line this car is devastatingly rapid) but anywhere: around corners, under brakes, changing gear, on rough roads or on perfectly smooth race circuits. Wherever you drive it, the 12C is mind-alteringly fast – to a point where a Ferrari 458 Italia, the car with which it is so clearly intended to compete (the McLaren's UK list price of £168,500 [$272k] is actually slightly less than the 458, if you're counting), would not see which way it had gone. On any road, in any kind of conditions.

And in the end – even though this is, in fact, just the beginning – the 12C's stratospheric level of performance actually defines precisely what McLaren Automotive, the car company, is all about. Not least because it occurs on every level throughout the company.

The more you learn about the newest supercar maker, in fact, the fresher and more vibrant it seems. And the culmination, of course, is the MP4-12C itself, which may be the first of many new road cars that McLaren will produce over the coming years, but which also happens to be a quite astonishingly accomplished machine in its own right.

To understand how and why it's as good an effort, you must scroll back to the beginning of 2007. That's when the project began, and when the likes of Ron Dennis sat down with a small team of people in Woking, England, and decided that a mid-engined sports car to rival the best of the best was indeed to be the way forward.

Interestingly, McLaren didn't then embark on a traditional recruitment campaign by poaching designers and engineers from other manufacturers. Instead, it harnessed ideas in a much more radical way, encouraging “thinkers” from all walks of life – many of whom were not employed in the regular car industry – to become involved with the project.

McLaren's amiable chief test driver, Chris Goodwin, describes the atmosphere at the time as being “genuinely exciting and genuinely eccentric. There was even a touch of the Spitfire mentality in the way the thing came together at the beginning.”

It's important to remember (possibly because it's curiously easy to overlook) that the MP4-12C is truly a British car. Its twin-turbo 3.8-liter V8 engine was developed jointly by Worthing, UK-based Ricardo Engineering and McLaren itself. The carbon fiber tub and the entire suspension system (also radically different in its design) were developed in-house. Only the 7-speed dual-clutch gearbox (courtesy of Italian company Graziano), the enormous Brembo brakes and the custom Pirelli tires were externally sourced. Yet, in each case, McLaren worked in conjunction with the manufacturer to develop a custom arrangement for the car.

It's hard to know where to start when describing what makes the 12C so very special, both technically beneath its handsome bodyshell, and dynamically out in the real world. In its tail, nestling unusually low to the ground and well in front of the rear axle line, sits a twin-turbo V8 that produces 592hp at 7000rpm and 442lb ft from 3000-7000rpm. This is mated to a 7-speed dual-clutch gearbox that features what McLaren describes as a “pre-cog” selection system which, in practice, enables shifts to occur faster and more seamlessly than one could possibly imagine, up or down the 'box.

There's no manual option as such, although the paddle-shifter's gearchange speeds and the throttle map settings can be tailored to suit an individual's needs courtesy of a rotating switch at the base of the center console. The suspension, which is also fully adjustable from within the cockpit, is perhaps the 12C's most potent trump card, and is certainly one of its more intriguing features, there being no conventional anti-roll bars and an open differential at the back.

ROLL CONTROL

In theory, you'd half expect the rear-wheel-drive 12C to struggle for traction and general handling composure as a result, but in reality McLaren has produced an ingenious solution to each of these regular issues. The car's roll is controlled hydraulically by a matrix of sensors that effectively mean there is no roll, while its dampers are actively operated. Together, this all but eradicates mid-corner lean, while providing the 12C with incredible agility, as well as a supremely refined ride. McLaren claims the car generates up to 25 percent more grip mid-corner than conventionally suspended rivals.

As for its lack of a differential, the MP4-12C develops much of its traction via a system called Brake Steer, which tickles the rear brakes to kill wheelspin and keeps the nose more planted than it otherwise would be under cornering load. The system was first developed for McLaren's F1 car during the Coulthard/Hakkinen era, whereby the drivers operated a third pedal to apply the brakes to improve traction and keep the car better balanced mid-corner. The system was banned when Formula 1 photographer Darren Heath famously uncovered the extra pedal when taking a picture of the McLaren's footwell.

On top of this, the 12C also has more conventional traction control, anti-lock brakes, ESC stability and a launch control system. This can fire it to 60mph in either 3.3sec or 3.1sec, depending on which model of Pirelli tire the customer goes for (regular P Zeros or stickier Corsas). Under really heavy braking it also has an air-brake system that deploys to ensure maximum stability when the 12C is in full deceleration mode.

There are so many key statistics surrounding this incredible car that it seems churlish to highlight any one in particular. However, the car's dry weight of just 2,868lbs when fitted with the lightweight alloy wheels (as our test car was) is genuinely extraordinary. With fluids and a fuel tank that's 90 percent full, this still means that the 12C weighs little more than 3,000lbs. It's only once you grasp how little the McLaren weighs, relatively speaking, that its performance begins to make sense.

Not that the 12C feels in any way intimidating the first time you brush the underside of its handle-less scissor door and climb in behind the wheel. The cabin, on first impression, appears simple almost to the point of mild blandness. But what you also notice is how excellent the all-around visibility is, and how intuitive the cockpit seems, all of which is intentional.

“We wanted to create an environment that's easy to get on with straight away,” explains Goodwin. And from the way everything seems so logical, so quickly, it's not hard to understand what he means.

Take the steering wheel, which – unlike that of the Ferrari 458 – has not one single function engineered into it other than an airbag and a method of reach and rake adjustability. At a stroke it represents an entirely different approach from that taken by many other car makers, Ferrari especially. The intimation is that McLarens are for driving, not just for playing with or looking at. It's a refreshing departure from the norm, even if the cabin itself does seem a touch bleak as a result.

So what makes the 12C stand out from the crowd when on the move, out on the public road? Just about anything and everything it does, to be honest. Its ride quality is truly ground breaking, as is its steering precision, its brake feel and power, its gearchange speed and refinement and its seemingly endless traction. But to begin with, at least, what defines the 12C is its performance – the pure and very brutal thump of acceleration it can deliver. That's what leaves the biggest impression, even days and weeks after you've walked away.

The first time I put my foot down and held it there properly, the amount of thrust that was unleashed through the rear tires came genuinely and sincerely as a shock. It starts from the very moment you nail the throttle at anything beyond 1500rpm, even in fourth gear, and by 3000rpm you can already feel your organs being squeezed hard into the seat.

From there until the cut-out at 8500rpm there is just a vast, constant wave of energy that catapults the MP4-12C forward – with more conviction than any road car you can ever remember this side of a Bugatti Veyron. Including the legendary McLaren F1. And the numbers would appear to support this impression.

STANDING QUARTER MILE

According to McLaren's own data, the 12C will, in its optimum settings, do 0-60mph in 3.1sec, 0-100mph in 6.1sec and cover the standing quarter mile in 10.9sec. When we tested the McLaren F1 back in 1994, it did 0-60mph in 3.2sec, 0-100mph in 6.3sec and the standing quarter mile in 11.1sec. Whichever way you look at it, the 12C accelerates harder than the F1 – until it reaches somewhere between 160 and 170mph, at which point the old timer's combination of longer gearing and more slippery aerodynamics allow it to glide gracefully away.

And then there's the noise, which is virtually non-existent at a steady 3000rpm/top-gear cruise but brain-bendingly loud at 8000rpm in third gear. Not quite in 458 Italia territory for sheer volume or quality of sound, perhaps, but not far off. And you can get rid of it more easily than you can in the Ferrari, the 12C's throttle being more sensitive under lighter loads, meaning you only get an eruption of sound when you want it.

Another amazing discovery about the 12C is that you don't need to go berserk in it to realize how quick it really is, and it's the torque that makes it feel so effortless. Even at half throttle it provides enough acceleration to leave most other cars reeling in its wake, including one guy I encountered in a Porsche 911 Turbo who wouldn't take no for an answer. And at full throttle it feels quite magical in the way it picks up and hurls itself down the road, to the extent that a Ferrari 458 would struggle – and fail – to keep up.

And that's before you so much as mention the 12C's handling, ride, steering and braking capabilities, all of which are perhaps more extraordinary still than the straight-line speed. There's so much grip and such a high level of dynamic composure to the car that you really need to drive it on a circuit to get anywhere near its towering limits. Which is precisely what McLaren allowed us to do at the Portimao racetrack in Portugal, albeit for a few brief laps. What's most spooky about the 12C's chassis, however, is the lack of inertia it suffers from. The nose snaps to attention and glues itself on to the apex of whichever kind of corner you aim it at (and at seemingly any speed). And the rest of the car then just seems to follow.

Yet despite the urgency of its responses, there's nothing neurotic in the way the 12C behaves. There are no spikes in its behavior, no sharp edges to its handling (or ride). So while it feels nailed to the ground in any corner, it doesn't feel nervous or scary. And that, apparently, was one of the key goals when designing not just the chassis but the car's whole dynamic personality: It had to be quick with a capital Q in terms of response, but at the same time approachable and friendly near the limit, and supremely comfortable as well.

And that's precisely how the 12C feels – on rough roads, smooth racetracks, meandering highways, even when it's bumbling through busy towns. The new McLaren is impossibly fast, yes, but it's also easy to drive in a way that's unprecedented at this level of motoring.

It's quite a car, in other words. And one that Ferrari should be very worried by indeed.

Steve Sutcliffe/Autocar

 

For those of you who missed it, here's a great discussion of the suspension with great pictures....have been drooling over this suspension ever since this article was first published.

http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010/09/2012-mclaren-mp4-12c-suspension-walkaround.html

 

And go to this page for tons of review links:

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=313343&page=2

 

Actually, the measured weights of the C6 Z06 I have seen are from 3076-3180, depending on fuel load. ZRI is quite a bit heavier. Anyone who dismisses a C6 (even in base form) is not giving the car its due - you may not like the looks, lack of exclusivity or other features, but the cars are truly impressive.

I of course expect the MP4-12C to outperform the Z06 and 458 and even the ZR1 in most objective measures (acceleration, lateral G, lap times, etc), but I don't think it will be a quantum leap in performance.

Rigth now, all we can do is bench race off of numbers and that exercise has cooled my jets.

I'll say it again, the actual curb weight does not sound that impressive. Carbon fiber tub and other innovations and it beats a Vette with a 427 cubic inch pushrod V8 and body-on-frame construction by 50-100 lbs? Frankly that is a bit disappointing given the price and technology delta.

I actually hope I am wrong as I want to want the MP4-12C, but I have lost my desire to be an early adopter. I need to see the Emperor's New Clothes for myself before I change my wardrobe.