Rosberg vs Schumacher

I'm a big MS fan but just like me he too is too old for F1.
I hope Rosberg gets to drive a competitive car before he too is too old for F1.

 

I agree that Rosberg is currently a better driver.

However, I think that Schumacher is bringing useful car input to the designers that Rosberg does not yet have the ability to produce. At this point in his career, Merc and MS might be better off if there were unlimited testing and MS was doing the driving.

 

isn't such a comparison highly flawed when you only take so little races into consideration? Not that Schuey lucks like being able to kick Rosbergs bum on a regular basis, but to keep it fair one should neutralize events with technical failures and other stuff not in the hands of the pilots.
It surely is hard to discuss a race, where many events take place, and being stuck in the pack can result in being knocked out by other peoples overmotivated driving. but Q should be a simple task...

It´s like looking at the points and saying this years Merc is way worse than last years, but not taking into account, that last year e.g. the Bulls preferred to munch each other off the track. It´s to simple to get an honest comparison with looking only at the very reduced aspect of the points scored

 

Schumacher: 7 times world champion!
Rosberg: 5 times on the podium!

Michael was never going to come back and win a championship... was he going to better than Nico... probably not.

So what was the point of coming back?
- To spike Ferrari and Luca that their race seat was not the only one around.
- For some sh*ts and giggles with his old mate Ross Brawn.
- To end his motor sports career in a real silver arrow.
- He was following every race at home or from the paddock ... might as well get in a car and do a few laps while he already there.

 

You could take last season into the data sampling and the results wouldn't be much different.

Rosberg outdrives Schumacher now. That's partly because Rosberg matured as a driver and partly because Schumacher is past his top performance days (which were around 2002). If we were (somehow magically) able to put Rosberg in the Ferraris Schumacher drove back when he bagged his titles, I'm pretty sure MS would have driven circles around the Rosberg of the beginning of the millenium.

Drivers' development career follows a lifecycle curve. It is naive to assume that they always remain at the top of their game no matter what. Performance levels eventually start to go downhill and that's what we are witnessing with MS these years. If it wasn't like this, other WDCs would still be around. But the Prosts, Hakkinens and Hills etc. knew better when it was time to call it quits.

Raikkoenen is the best example of this: He was at the top of his game when he was driving the McLaren, but because they broke so often and the MS/Ferrari/Bridgestone/Brawn/Todt combo was strong it wasn't his time. The title he got eventually was deserved "as a lifetime achievement award" but pure luck racing wise as he was already past his prime.

 

What puzzles me is that why he so fast at free practice, then ok in Q1, Q2, and if he's lucky, he'll get into Q3. Then he makes lighting starts, jumps a few, then within 5-6 laps, he starts struggling.

 

Rob-

I agree with your analysis. Nico has been doing a better job than MS... rather consistently. However- Schumi seems to be coming around. His qualifying is still lacking but his racing has improved. Of late in races, I think an argument can be made that Michael has been as good as Nico and in some respects better. Despite his DNF last race, and his anti stall start, he was racing better than Nico.

Perhaps this is the rare exception- but if it keeps up, it may mark a turning point in a duel that has til now been in Nico's favor.

 

What has been the effect on Mercedes sales after Schumi began marketing their product again?

 

Why do I feel like this is another excuse to bash MS?

What about comparing ALL the drivers with their team mates? Why Nico and MS?

*sigh*

 

So you think he forgets where the corners go?

 

the OP did an objective analysis, the question of Schumacher's return was one of the biggest one's in F1, I think the most exciting news of the last couple years. I always look to see how those two are doing against each other. No one else has a teammate of Shuey's stature. It was interesting to see the precise breakdown. It is fact versus a bash.

 

Wow, I must have an evil twin in Australia... I was just going to post almost those identical words.

It's always said exclusively about MS and NR.

Hamilton beats Button with ease. Button is washed up and should retire?
Vettel beats Webber with ease. Webber is washed up and should retire?
Alonso beats Massa with ease. Massa is washed up and should retire?*
Button beat Barrichello with ease. Barrichello is washed up and should retire?**
Kobayashi beats Perez with ease. Perez is washed up and should retire?


It seems this metric only applies to MS. If he was beating his teammate, the haters would hate him for not having won enough. If he is losing, they hate him for not being faster. The guy can't win. Everyone hates a winner. Or a winner who isn't winning

Not that Rob is being a hater, I don't know his motivations, but this topic has been beaten to death in this thread and others.




*ok, maybe bad example there

**interesting case. Rubens is smoking Maldonado this year. I wager MS would smoke Rubens these days too. Again.

 

hooray!

I've said before, to say MS is slow, washed up or whatever is actually an insult to Nico, who is clearly an excellent driver.

If MS was of no benefit to the team they'd just make up an excuse and he'd be gone. Sore neck. Nagging wife. whatever. He's obviously bringing something!

 

You COULD see it that way if it hadn't been discussed a 100 times before.

I'm as interested in the statistical breakdown between team mates as anyone else, but it's just MS and Nico AGAIN.

While Rob's on a role, maybe he can do it for all the teams and drivers.

 

Can we include in this all the races and qualifying laps where Schu's car was broken? Last year Schu ran 2 races with a cracked chassis and the first part of the 2011 season the car has been out-of-whack in some way or another with the exception being the last couple races. Also, I suggest adding the quickest individual sector times. Schu has many more than Rosberg but for some reason Schu just can't put all those great sector times in one lap. He's missing something......

 

Agreed. Maybe it is just a matter of bad luck but successful drivers always seem to make their own luck.

 

Ya think?

 

Fantastic post. I must agree. Schu is just not putting it together like he used to although he does have flickers or his old self every once in a while. Sad but true

 

Ain't it the truth! It seems like when a driver is really in their prime they can set up a chassis really well very quickly and not have too much issue with it. Unless of course the car truly is that bad. Unfortunately it's impossible to know at the moment. It would be great to see Zo or Seb thrown into W02 so we can all see just how off it is, or maybe the opposite could be true but I doubt it.

 

Times change. In his hay day drivers would defer to Michael on the track. No longer the case. Not to mention that the caliber of drivers is higher now than when Schui was racking up the wins.
My question is how much is he enjoying himself. Granted he's making a boatload of money but it must be very frustrating.

 

Personally I think Rob did an excellent job putting together the spreadsheet.

It is FAR better to have an objective analysis "by the numbers", than unsubstantiated opinion...

What we are able to pull away from this analysis is that NR is consistently quicker across sessions and different tracks with the odd exception here and there... "it is what it is"

Well done, Rob!

Frank