Valencia for new engine mapping changes

Really now. Mark my words, this does indeed mean Red Bull will not take pole at Valencia. Their special settings give them over half a second in qualy trim, and this will especially make a difference in Valencia.

 

Anyone else having trouble believing that a computer has to be plugged into the car to change the engine map? I know what the MoTec can do on my car, and I'd be surprised if the ECU in an F1 car isn't capable of heaps more, including having multiple maps at the flick of a switch.

If not, what are the engine mode changes that we already witness giving fuel consumption and power changes by turning knobs on the steering wheel? Aren't they different maps?

This sounds a bit suss to me.

 

+1 to Aircon. There's got to be room in there for a qualifying map.

 

Once again the powers that be choose to change the rules for the sake of the show.
It's easy to see why, but we're half way down a slippery slope and gaining speed.
We wonder why the drivers show little sportsmanship and have distain for the rules of conduct (on and off track). A fish stinks from the head down.

 

The car is not better overall at Red Bull because the Mclaren has better race-pace and a not nearly as powerful off-throttle EBD because the Merc engine is not so good with it. RB have perfected the off-throttle EBD technology and their car is a package deal meaning if the rear end goes, something else will need to be changed to accomodate the issue and my #1 guess is going to be the front wing will be changed. In on-throttle areas they will be fine, but off and it's all over and the car will not have the same balance in qualy trim Vettel had grown used to. Braking stability and turn-in will be game over and it's going to a bit like a Porsche vs Ferrari situation where you have one car which is great into the corner but unable to jump on the throttle as quickly, and the other with the opposite issue.

Early guess is Vettel will still win the WDC and Red Bull the WCC but not by the margin many originally believed. Mclaren will be right on them

 

I thought all the engines had to use a standard ECU (supplied by a McL subsidiary)? Surely they all have equal opportunity program maps as they see fit. I'm confused on this one - can anyone explain, in simple terms, what is going on?!

 

Well the whole idea is to hobble the RB so mission accomplished.
Any team that succeeds will be punished in today's F1.

 

This is my impression as well.
Somehow I thought they were "sealed" or else what is the point ?

 

I guess it's all a matter of perspective. Whiting decided not using exhaust pipes for their intended use is not right, and furthermore decided using superficial exhausts gases when the engine is not making power to not only not fit into their silly 'green' strategy, but is a moveable aero device in the form of over-active engine mapping when the engine is not acting as an engine. In my opinion, his logic is sound.

 

The ECUs are standard and are "sealed", but within the permitted parameters and variables they are fully programmable. So, for example, there is no traction control program hidden in the system (a la Benetton 1994), and no way for a team to add a secret traction control program, but the ignition timing, fuel injection timing and volume, are based on 3D maps (manifold pressure, throttle, rpm) that are fully set by the individual teams. In addition, there are be multiple maps permitted as suggested, so a lean map for fuel conservation, a rich map for maximum power, maybe a rain map for limiting or smoothing the torque curve.

I am curious, since multiple maps are currently permitted, to find out exactly what the FIA is banning between qualy and race. It almost sounds like Red Bull had an even wilder set of ECU maps for qualifying (it's known that they saved their wildest hot blowing setup for Q3, running different settings in Q1/Q2), but maybe with the fixed number of maps in the ECU it can't accomodate the regular set of race ECU maps along with a special Q3 map?

Other point, which I raised here weeks ago when discussion of banning the hot blown diffuser modes was first raised by the FIA - so the FIA says hot-blowing the diffuser (meaning the practice of injecting fuel either very late in the power stroke or exhaust stroke so that it ignites in the exhaust pipes to create greater exhaust temp/velocity and keeps exhaust flow into the diffuser even when the driver is not pressing the throttle) will be banned for Silverstone... BUT, that applies to when the driver is not on the throttle.

As I suggested in the previous discussion, what's preventing the teams from developing a map where the first 30% or 40% of throttle travel now has extremely late injection of fuel and late ignition so that the engine makes very little power but generates exhaust flow, just like the current hot-blowing off throttle mode? The driver would need to "re-learn" his braking and corner entry technique to keep 10 or 20% throttle on at the same time as braking. Sure, the power would be non-linear through the start of the throttle travel range, but I don't think it would be hard to adapt - the teams could even change the throttle pedal resistance to use a very light resistance for the first 30% travel, then double or triple the force for the 30% - 100% range, so that the driver could feel more easily the change point.

 

Ermm good points

 

The only way I can see the Fia governing the off-throttle EBD is by outlawing the type of ignition maps used making this possible. Traditionally, we know of a 3d map as you noted adhere to the 3d guidelines, but teams now have a 4th dimension of mapping based on the engine not making power but rather transforming the engine into a blowing unit during off-throttle. The engine mapping required to make this tuneable has to be very apparent and I would not believe located such software and subsequently banning its use or at least minimizing it would be difficult. I believe all mapping must be made available for review should it so be requested anyway.

 

The logic is consistent if and only if you accept the underlying principle. In the 19th cent. there were compelling arguments as to the number of angels that could dance on the head of a pin
If a team or driver is found to have violated a rule, sanction them, don't rewrite the rule.
If rules are mutable they are meaningless. As it stands there is no reason for any competitor to respect them.
If a driver knows that there is a chance that a dodgy move may be upheld he has every reason to attempt it.
What we are seeing here are attempts to improve the show not the sport.
If a team knows that legal advantages can be disallowed for no other reason than they work too well how can they operate?

 

This wouldn't be very repeatable. Easiest would be for a particular map to blow as they would on overrun with the trigger being simultaneous throttle and brake application. Whatever the case, if they go for something like this it'll be clear for the world to see in the throttle telemetry the world feed shows us sometimes which is based off TPS signal.

And this effort by the FIA isn't just some conspiracy to cramp RB, they're doing it to prevent (to the extent possible this season) something the rules deem very clearly as illegal. Blown diffusers are as obvious movable aero devices as they come.

 

I hear you, but for the sake of debate I don't think I agree (!) Charlie is the one guy above reproach and I honestly don't think he's doing this to hobble RB. [And, thank God we can't blame Mad Max anymore ]

Indeed - The (in?)famous rule 3.15 (?) - If the mass damper was a MAD, then this surely is.

I may be naive here, but I'm not convinced Charlie is doing this to improve the show - If that were the case it would happen any time a team dominated early in the season, and we know that's not the case.

Cheers,
Ian

 

Charlie is a honest man in a crooked deal. I imagine he stays with the sport for the same reasons that I do.

The fact that the manipulations are ham handed does not mean that they aren't real.

There are a lot of well reasoned explanations here but if any rule can be changed in mid race how can there be any real logic applied. Fercristsake the entire car is a moveable aero device if you want to parse it suchly!

 

I'am sort of with you on this.

I really like Tech advancements and developments in F1, seems a shame they ban them so quickly but I understand why.

 

Can't argue with zat....which also is a shame...

 

The crux of the matter is that if they continue chipping away at the sport piecemeal there won't be anything left. Where will that leave Bernie's show?
Why not just cut to the chase and call it world wide wrestling on wheels?

 

Hahaha The day it turns into a spec series, is the day I stop watching.

 

Then you won't miss the BBC next year

 

The rule isn't changed: no movable aero devices. The rule however didn't anticipate the engine as a movable aero device. But by using it that whay it's still illegal. So the rule is not changed, just clarified.

 

Meaningless semantics in my book. Otherwise why not punish them for the violation?
The rule was changed because the RBs are too fast.
Keep "leveling the playing field" and you end up in a pit.