McLaren's shady business practices must stop

I think it is no surprise to many by now that in the latest rounds of tests of the new McLaren Mp4-12C vs the Ferrari 458, the UK press has overwhelmingly voted for the 458 as superior. In addition, the 458 has proven to be faster on the track in almost every test.

And, in fact, the McLaren came in behind other non- Ferrari cars as well.

Since then, instead of explaining to their customers why their cars have not been well received, they have instead taken the tack of passing rumors to their customers of Ferrari in providing "ringer" cars for the tests -- this without proof and DENIED but the very press that tested the cars.

While we can appreciate McLaren's disappointment, we, as Ferrari enthusiasts, cannot sit back and let McLaren make unfair and unproven claims of "Ferrari cheating" as a whispering campaign to their customers as an excuse for their poor showing.

It's becoming quite clear that people well placed and inside McLaren are feeding information to their customers that Ferrari is "cheating" in it's tests. Below is an eye witness account relaying the information to others. In addition, a secret "5 page" email to all customers was sent out with other information they were told not to reveal to anyone else.

This backdoor slander is simply a weapon to damage the brand that we admire.

It is clear that this campaign is coming from the top levels of McLaren management. This not just some fans stirring up trouble.

It must STOP.

To McLaren: The way to win over your clients is to make a better car at a lower price. It is not to damage the other person's brand to then accept your as an alternative.

I urge anyone who is an admirer of the Ferrari brand to email McLaren International and ask them to stop this backdoor campaign.

I also ask that if any owners that have connections with dealers that sell both brands should write to them and tell them of their displeasure of McLaren taking these practices. McLaren is attempting to damage the reputation of one brand they are selling for the possibility of selling the other. I doubt many dealerships would find this acceptable business behaviour.

We know that McLaren routinely reads Fchat. This is your chance to tell them that this is not the way to do business as many potential McLaren owners are also Ferrari owners.

We hold no animosity to their creation, the Mp4-12C. We believe it is a step forward and appreciate anyone advancing the science of automotive transportation. We hope they sell many of them and have many happy customers for years to come.

But we will not sit idly by as someone attempts to damage a brand we care for just because they lost some silly tests that wouldn't matter to us at all.
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There were rumors that the McLaren was setting the fastest Top Gear lap and so forth. Is that not true?

And why are they being so backhanded in their accusations: Wouldn't it be easier to just walk up to the Ferrari and be like, "yeah the rev limit is different if you measure the frequency of the engine at WOT, this carbon fiber part would be steel in a customer car, this exhaust system has been modified if you look here"?

 

McLaren are offering to back up their claims with a money back guarantee, so maybe there is something to this rumor.

 

Do you know for sure that that post is genuine and not an attempt to discredit McLaren ?

The habits of the Piranha Club die hard on both sides.....

 

It's geniune.. and not the only reference.

 

This isn't the first accusation of Ferrari bringing "upped" cars to comparison tests. There was a big bit about it on Jalopnik a while back. Honestly though, I think all companies are guilty of having rather special press cars.

 

I think we can all agree that McLaren International is not stupid. They’re offering an excellent sports car and I’m sure they will sell many of them.

Since they’re not stupid, we can also agree on the simple fact that they sent ringer cars to the tests just like Ferrari and all other manufacturers who send cars for comparison testing. The best McLaren can claim is that the Ferrari ringer cars seem clearly superior to the McLaren ringer cars.

End of story.

 

Much ado about nothing.

Competitors always criticize one another.

 

So, if Honda sent out a secret memo to all of their owners that Ford is cheating on it's tests with the press with the F150 -- and provides no proof or evidence -- Ford, it's dealers, and it's customers should just say "it's no big deal?"

I don't think so.

And I think the loyal owners of the F150 would ask Honda to stop unless they have something they want to say in public.

 

The problems with McLaren blaming Ferrari for the recent wave of bad reviews on the MP4-12C, as i see them :

1. McLaren must also be secretly bad-mouthing other competitors (lambo, porsche) who recently posted faster lap-times than the MP4-12C. The anti-McLaren conspiracy must be vast, indeed.

2. In defending EVO, the alleged "Ferrari ringer" was recently denied as such by Chris Harris, the very guy who previously "blew the whistle" against "evil" Ferrari.

3. All the journalists who have found serious issues with the MP4 apparently did not recognize this "miraculous" Ferrari ringer ... that somehow went from being the "beatable target" for the MP4, to a track weapon with unprecedented lap-times. Really? Why not consider the possibility that, instead of Ferrari miraculously improving over the course of months ... an improvement that went unrecognized by all the journalists, mind you ... is it not more likely that the production version of the MP4 doesn't live up to the promises of the pre-production version? Oh wait ... all the journalists are part of the conspiracy too ...

4. What about the excuse that the car Ben Collins tested had a suspension failure, excessive roll in cornering and braking, and premature ABS intervention (all symptoms which also went un-noticed by the Stig, apparently)? Are we abandoning that story now, and just relying on the "Ferrari cheated" story?

I don't give a rat's tail about the MP4 vs 458 saga. NONE of the press will influence which car i buy I was silent during all the pre-production McLaren hype ... but as the MP4 continues to disappoint, i am a bit put-out that McLaren will turn to that same PR machine to try to put the blame on Ferrari

Isn't McLaren supposedly an ENGINEERING company, first and foremost?

 

If they were 'loyal owners' they wouldn't care what anyone else says or does or thinks of their pride & joy

 

If they don't care what people think of their brand and their choice, you're right. But, I think we do.

No one needs to own a Ferrari.

Look, if McLaren wants to come out and say something against their competitor... go for it. But, to do it this way is not only unsavory, it looks badly on them.

They are big boys. If they can't take the heat without blaming others for their poor results, they should get out of the kitchen.

 

First, I don't think Ford owners really care about anything Honda has to say. (Ask me how I know that.)

2nd, How many 458/Mp4-12C examples, tested in a controlled environment, will EVER be operated at their respective performance limits by their eventual owners? Do those numbers really matter? Really?

Lastly, Regardless of the alleged "secret messages" sent out by McLaren, and what it claims, the Grain of Salt rule should apply.

 

I think the main problem is McLaren thought after the positive launch drives that the car would win all comparison tests and this gave them the confidence to allow so many comparitive tests.

Conducting oneself by blaming others for having superior cars isnt sporting at all. I for one think that any secret e mail may harm any goodwill people had towards the company.

 

just had to continue my last post ...

McLaren is claiming, among other cheater tactics, that the alleged 458 "ringer" had an "increased rev limt".

Really? REALLY?

And not ONE single journalist noticed this? Or, all the journalists are complicit in the conspiracy ... ???

Weight savings in the 458 ringer, higher power, improved aero, higher rev limit ... and not one journalist noticed ANY of this? Not one journalist said ... "holy cow THIS 458 is insanely faster than any 458 we've ever tested. Wonder if it's related to those revs that go way higher than before ... ".

wow

yep. surely THIS is why the MP4 has disappointed one journalist after another, after another ...

 

First impressions with a product of this caliber are key and right now the reviews are in. In short, the McLaren is the new hot girl at the bar, problem is you met her and her personality sucks. 95 out of 100 guys want no part of the girl and her attitude, the 5 guys who want this girl could care less what the 95 think. Those 5 guys are Ron Dennis’ customers.

I think Dennis has two options at this point, stick to focusing on the 5 out of 100 customers that want his car or try to please the masses (the guys that are paper racers and spend all day writing YouTube comments without ever driven an exotic in their lives). Perhaps at this point they need to do both options, but either way the key focus in both options is gaining credibility. Credibility will build trust and produce more supporters of the brand.

Option 1- Ron Dennis could take the path of the CEO of the clothing company Patagonia. That guy is uncompromising in his mission to build the most environmentally driven clothing company in the world and he won’t change his ways because a few writers or customers don’t agree with his plan. In fact, I think this CEO basically said publicly that if a potential customer doesn’t agree what he’s doing, shop somewhere else. It’s the love us or leave us attitude. His business has leaped some 30-40% since that statement because he has stuck to his principles and haven’t wavered. His credibility and trust have held true with the only people that matter, in the case of Ron Dennis, the McLaren customers.

When you play a game of word association with Ferrari you get the words like “passion” or you hear the senses being mentioned, like the sound of the car, the smell of the leather, the sight of the curves on the car. While word association with the McLaren you think more concrete terms like “technology” or “uncompromising”. Two very different mindsets and perhaps customers. Ron Dennis knows who his customers are and these customers share the same values he has. There are McLaren supporters on this board that will fight you tooth and nail because they buy in 100%to Ron’s message and philosophy.

Option 2- Ron Dennis needs to insult the critics of the car in a smarter, sly way. Elevate Lewis Hamilton and Jenson Button as the ultimate critics and the only people who matter when comes to evaluating the fullest potential of the car. The message is these drivers are the only ones truly qualified to drive the car way beyond what any writer could. You see this with infomercials all the time. An infomercial can try to sell anything, but the product doesn’t really have credibility until you have an expert saying how great a product is that it sells. McLaren can do this by creating a big time Hollywood produced video of the car for YouTube, make it movie like with Lewis Hamilton and Jenson Button as the protagonists. Again it goes back to the credibility factor. This film shouldn’t be a documentary, but an action film, a real movie production, maybe ten minutes or so. The film must portray track time and lifestyle of F1 drivers, meaning show the guys with hot girls, five star hotels, restaurants…etc., all to associate the car with the ultimate lifestyle, one you could live if you buy this car. In other words, it’s the car that opens the door to this lifestyle. The track footage must be Top Gear level filming and most, most importantly show they guys having fun. That’s one of the biggest knocks on this car is that its too clinical, too many computers controlling the car, Lewis and Jenson, must display and voice in a believable way that driving this car is the best thing they’ve ever done in their lives. Maybe show them (or a stunt driver) going flat out along a mountain pass at extreme dangers, basically riding the extreme edge as only a McLaren can. McLaren has done Jenson and Lewis company produced sterile videos already, but they’re not good enough. It has to be kicked up at least 5 notches. I’d love to see after all the lifestyle and track footage to the extreme for Lewis and Jensen to say, “man I’m so lucky to have this car” to close the film.

Just my 2 cents.

 

Isnt Ferrari the company that lies to its customers about its production numbers ?

I believe they claimed 400 Enzos yet the vins show 500 cars.

I cant really get worked up over giant unethical companies engaging in schoolyard fights

 

I'm posting on an action figure sight that Jerry doesn't actually sculpt the figures he claims he does. In fact, he's cheating. He buys them from some guy in Argentina and sells them as his own. If you go to Buenos Aires, you can by them on the streetcorner for 10% of what he sells them for.

Of course, I have no proof of any of this. But, I want buyers of his figures to by mine instead. I want to discredit Jerry's business with collectors so that mine look more appealing. So, I spread the rumors through private emails to customers to cover my tracks.

Now, are you worked up?

 

If it were MY company, yes. But I couldnt care less about Ferrari or any other company that doesnt directly affect my bank account...especially when the company, like Ferrari, is already known to be unethical.

They are big boys and can handle their own problems.

ive never understood the concept of this personal relationship people have with giant corporations like Ferrari or Apple.

 

Was just thinking the same... Sure is a lot of energy being expended in this thread. Drive what you like. Believe who you believe. The companies are fierce competitors. They are gonna do what competitors do... Compete.

 

I'm with him ^

I don't care what Ron Dennis has to say about Ferrari, nor do I care what Luca might say about McLaren. Furthermore, they don't care what *I* think. This whole thing is a giant waste of time, including this post.

 

And that's where you are completely wrong. You're looking at the little picture when the big one is staring you right in the face.

This is about business ethics. This is not about McLaren vs Ferrari. It's about one company practicing in an unethical way.

Tell us --- do you really believe this is a good thing for McLaren to be doing? Really? You would approve of it? "Yeah! McLaren! Go tell some more unsubstantiated claims and get people on the internet talking trash! Whoo hooo! We don't care. It's FUN!"

Sorry, I wouldn't think it was a good business practice. And I wouldn't if someone trashed Jerry's business or your business in a secret campaign to discredit you for their gain on your loss.

I don't think anyone should.

If you want to trash another company --- BE A MAN and come out with your evidence. Don't hide in the shadows and let others do your dirty work.

Come on Ron: Hold a press conference and tell us the 12 things that Ferrari cheated and how you know. Otherwise: STFU.

 

Nobody is asking you to change your opinion about anything.

This is about how one company is working unethically. Sorry, that's not a waste of time. If you think it's OK for one company to do this to another, fine.

 

Hmmmmm, Business and Ethics. Now there's an oxymoron. Is that like military intellegence?

 

Passion, eh? Could Ron Dennis be a secret Ferrari admirer? LOL...

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78S-wj2PkC8[/ame] (2:20 mark)