Car & Driver tests 458, McLaren and GT2

Guys, take it easy - no reason to get all hot and bothered over CD review. I've been getting that mag for years; they ALWAYS favor the newer car if the comparo is even close. Probably makes for more interesting reading and better sales, in their view. All in good fun, I say.

 

Good point, its much easier to make a turbo quicker than an NA car....

 

+1

 

Email Ron and tell him.

 

No need. He reads Fchat.

 

LOL...no matter how fast the 12C goes, it still has a problem with how it looks, IMHO.

 

I find it ironic that people keep comparing the two when one of them hasn't even shipped a single car yet (months behind schedule).

Maybe you should wait until real people actually drive one before giving it a thumbs up or thumbs down...

Motor Trend called the Dodge Carvan and Renault Alliance "cars of the year". 2011 went to the Chevy Volt which will probably go down in history as the "green Edsel".

I don't think many Mac guys will take their opinion very seriously when deciding to buy one.

 

I'm just shocked someone would pay $250k for a Porsche 911

 

LOL, post of the night

 

If someone gave me a McLaren I'd have it long enough to put it in the paper, sell it, and buy a 458!

 

Exactly, maybe Mac can use their speedy adaptation process and come up with a new look in a couple of days?

 

LOL. You know it! A typically half-baked review from CD though. Why would they bother having price and fuel economy for $200k+ cars?? I guess they'll ding the Rolls for being 10k more than the Bentley. Silly at best.

 

The acceleration times are "drugged" by launch control systems (otherwise known as lunch-your-transmission systems) that are completely useless and destructive in real life, they are just a gimmick for journalists. I would like to see acceleration figures with a standard launch to compare how today's supercars really fare against the previous generation.

Also, I am astonished by the F458 chassis being rated so low by C&D. Have they actually driven a GT2 on the limit? Sure you can get top-notch lap times in a GT2... if your name is Walter Rohrl... for anyone else, the experience of driving a GT2 to the limit while it tries to snap around and kill you against the next wall at every corner is not what I would call "accessible" to most drivers

I rate the 458 chassis a lot higher, as in the real world it is the car that is most accessible, easiest to drive to the limit and hugely rewarding on real roads as well as on the track.

 

+1

 

yep ...

so if we ignore :

- arithmetic errors (in favor of the McLaren, naturally)
- fuel economy
- price

then the 458 wins handily

C & D conclusion : the McLaren is a good car ... for the price. Got it

 

I was thinking the same thing, esp. after watching the 5th Gear tests and review. I think they just want to create a stir and disagree with the Brits.

 

No, it's just journalistic laziness.

What the mags should do is just review the 12C and tell people the good and bad parts. This constant comparison of the 12C and Italia is not only boring, it's not productive.

WHO CARES????????

What's important is to tell people who want a 12c what they think of it and what they might want to consider if buying one.

I swear all of these comparisons go back to Ron Dennis and his claim the 12C would blow the Italia out of the water and raise the bar for all sportscars. He has only himself to blame as time after time, it's shown that didn't happen. Everytime there is one of these comparisons -- it just makes people want the Ferrari more. Ferrari continues to get free publicity because of McLaren's need for it.

LDM must be laughing his bottom off.

 

I would buy the Fcar just based on looks alone.

Plus I am a Ferrari guy.

And I have absolutley no clue where to buy a MacCheater car if I wanted one. And where would I get it serviced. Not alot of MacCheaters in the hood. The only one I have ever seen was at Pebble Beach.

 

They don't have the Golden Arches in Colorado?
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These car magazines remind me of all the hunting magazines I get. I mean, how many ways can you kill an Elk? Is the 270 enough gun? It's like cable TV, 500 channels + 24/7. How can they ever get content of any quality for that much programing ( Kardashians being the high water mark).

They sit around and say, " what can we write about that's new or original ?" , well not much.

I agree with bdelp that American writers don't compare with the Euro guys but I don't like many of them either.All these writers, for the most part , have conflicts of interest because of advertising dollars which are the life blood of their magazines.

The only time they are able to be really honest and objective is comparing a new model with last years version of the same make, and only then if the new model is better.

It doesn't take long for the real truth to get out. You can trash those utterly useless and usually unqualified car comparisons.

 

That's the post of the night, IMHO.

 

And he has only 38 posts.

A true genius.

 

I thought they usually include a "subtotal" of the scores without the price one?

I always calcuate that even if they don't.

On that count, the 458 wins by a couple of points.

Either way, these are two very good sports cars that are, of course, different in several respects and have their relative strengths and weaknesses to each other. I continue to fail to see the big deal over this comparisons stuff...they are close in many ways and slightly different in some ways. Always will be.

 

As I keep saying, it is an inevitable fact that Coke gets compared to PEPSI like McDonald's being compared to Burger King and Nike to Reebok. It is also inevitable that while classified as being in the same niche/sector, there will always only be one Coke and one McDonald's. The PEPSI and Burger King are serious challenger and I think Warren Buffett could not have put it better...

Buffett says that he thinks PepsiCo is a great company and that he enjoys eating some of its Frito-Lay snack products like Cheetos and Fritos, although he does so while drinking a Coke. He recalls that when he was much younger he drank Pepsi because it was less expensive.

I think McLaren is a great company and I do find the MP4-12c a marvel, and I would like to appreciate it while driving my 458

There will always be one Coca-Cola, one McDonald's and one Nike. While PEPSI, Burger King and Reebok could be as good as if not better than Coca-Cola, McD and Nike, the forever comparison is there with only one leader. Whopper is innovating just like Macca but we have one and only Golden Arch. That's it.

Comparison will go on but end result will always be based purely on personal tastes. Some like Pepsi, but most like Coke right?

 

Very well put and I agree with you except some things get in our head and confuse us.I think I like Coke the best but would never bet I could tell the difference in a blind testing.For sure the Ferrari is and that's a very strong reason I won't bother with a personal issue over which car I want.