Hi Fellow FChat, I recently purchased a used 2006 F430. But maybe I am so unlucky, in the 2 months of ownership I have encountered 2 "big" problems. The first problem was with the suspension control unit which has been resolved by changing it with a new part. The current problem is with the F1 transmission. I was wondering if any other fellow owner had similar problem and can shed some lights. The symptom is when the car is at gear 4, the gear indicator light will flash. When the car is at other gears, it is fine. Then recently, when the car is at gear 4 and indicator is flashing, it suddenly change to Neutral (N) and then the CEL lights up. Happened 2 times. So I brought it to my mechanic. After a few days of checking and blip (correct word?) the pump, the problem is still there. He told me this is due to low pressure at the pump. After further checking, he conclude that the SELESPEED (Part No. 232406) is at fault. This part cost a bomb. I don't know whether to change the part or try to fix it. My mechanic said that it might be fixable by sending it to hydraulic parts expert. Now I'm very very sad.... Here is some of the photos: Hope somebody can share some of their knowledge. Best Regards, ABFerrari Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Your mechanic is quoting an entirely new F1 system, which seems quite possibly to be overkill. Most likely it is simply the F1 pump itself that has failed. There are a few variations depending on what your vehicle assembly number is... but as a 2006, I would guess the proper pump is 214267: http://www.ricambiamerica.com/product_info.php?products_id=337466 In the unlikely case that your actuator or accumulator has failed, that's a different story, 1) How did the mechanic assess that you F1 system has failed --- or determine which component has failed? 2) Much much wear is shown on the clutch via SD3 or similar tool? 3) Any signs of fluid loss around the F1 actuator ? 4) Has the clutch position sensor ever been changed? What about the little plastic mount that it rides on? Don't panic. VERY few of these cars need the whole enchilada replaced. The F430 F1 system (and clutch system in general) is quite strong and far less likely to experience the kind of problems seen in earlier iterations like the 360 and/or F355.
Congrats on the 430, but I am sorry to hear of your problems. I would try to have it repaired mate, but am not sure if you will have any luck. New ones cost a BOMB alright, I forget some of the prices I have seen quoted here before in the past. Here is a complete setup. Actuator and pump, used on Ebay in Germany. http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/FERRARI-F430-AKTUATOR-430-F1-ACTUATOR-/150620265488?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item2311aadc10 **If anyone has an old/****ed one they want to send me, let me know. I am interested to see how they work and it they really are repairable. **
Hi Daniel, Thanks for your kind reply: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "In the unlikely case that your actuator or accumulator has failed, that's a different story, 1) How did the mechanic assess that you F1 system has failed --- or determine which component has failed? *** Previously only gear 4 will flash then jump to N, but now he told me after he took out the system apart, in any gear will jump to N. I saw him took out and open out the SELESPEED part, clean it up, check and sanding some bearrings, assemble it back and put it back to the car. He told me that he just tested the car, at the beginning the pressure was strong and good but later on loose the pressure, thus very easy to jump to N. Is this true statement? **** 2) Much much wear is shown on the clutch via SD3 or similar tool? *** Last we check, it's around 50% so I assume it's still good. Mileage is around 15,000 **** 3) Any signs of fluid loss around the F1 actuator ? *** No sign of fluid loss was mentioned by my mechanic *** 4) Has the clutch position sensor ever been changed? What about the little plastic mount that it rides on? *** If we are talking about the same black rectangle little plastic mount (approx H:3cm L:4cm) looks abit like LEGO, then: My mechanic told me that the plastic thingy starts to worn (Because he saw a little dried whitish fluid trace). He said it still can be used *** ---------------------------------------------------------- Actually, I am still confuse on why only in gear 4 that it will jump to N and not in all other gears? Theoretically, if my mechanic put the system back then the system will still only jump to N at gear 4. Is this a correct statement? Any specific questions I should be asking my mechanic? any area to observe? Hopefully somehow there is some miracle for my car tommorow. BTW, initially I was thinking of getting 360. But heard many leaks related to 360, so streechh out my budget to get F430, thinking that it will be problem free. Finally I get my dream car, but now this comes and bites me...
Pap, Thanks for the word of encouragement! FYI, I was quoted around USD 12,000 for the parts. BTW, my mechanic told me that he with a Hydrolic Mechanic part expert, successfully repaired the same system use in Lambo Gallardo.
Hi ABF, sorry to hear of your problem. It sounds like you've been very unfortunate but I suspect that your resolution is going to be a lot cheaper than perhaps you fear at the moment. There's a couple of good guys already giving advice here so listen up, try and answer their questions, and they should be able to guide you to a solution. It does sound a little bit like your mechanic may have jumped in and condemned the entire system without actually finding out what the problem is. Hopefully that will prove to be the case and this will all work out a lot cheaper than the worst case scenario. Best of luck!
Ok, sounds like your mechanic should try and have it fixed then if they were successful with the Gallardo system. Sounds promising anyways.
I don't know where you are located, but at that cost it would certainly be wise to get a second opinion from a respected independent or Ferrari dealer. You aren't shopping around for an oil change-this is a pretty major issue. With that said, your mechanic should not be offended either.
+1 what Daniel and other members said, it can not be an entire F1 system failure. Some facts are confusing here. If the hydraulics is seriously loosing pressure, any gear would jump to N and not only the 4th gear. Ask your mechanic for pressure figures. What value is for him full pressure and what value is low pressure? Did your mechanic connected a SD3/SDX/DEISS diagnostic system to start diagnosing the problem and before removing any parts? Did he find any error codes in the F1 ECU? The only thing I can see here for now is that the 3th/4th gears are the only gears using all solenoid valves (EV1 for gear 3, EV2 for gear 4). That means that a good level of hydraulic pressure is required to power these 4 valves. The F1 alarm is blinking indeed only for hydraulic pressure loss. Maybe that's a direction to follow toward the root cause I would recommend a pressure mesurement on each individual solenoid valve and a combined pressure mesurement for each engaged gear. Such analysis should lead to something interesting I suppose. Solenoid Valve: EV1 EV2 EV3 EV4 EV5 GEAR 1 ON ON ON 2 ON ON ON 3 ON ON ON ON 4 ON ON ON ON 5 ON ON ON 6 ON ON ON RM ON ON Let us know how it goes and don't hesitate to post some more feedback on the asked questions. Stef
Sorry, tabs didn't work out very well. Here's a picture of the solenoid valves combinations Image Unavailable, Please Login
Hi SfefVan, Thanks for the pointers! A few days ago my mechanic did mentioned that he switched the solenoid positions, e.g: originally for gear 2 is switched with gear 4. He said to determine if it's the solenoid fault, so instead of gear 4 jump to N, it will be gear 2 jump to N. But the same problem still persist: gear 4 jump to N. BTW, the diagnostic system shows: transmission fault. (I forgot the code number). To be clear, the only blinking light is the gear 4 lights. There's no other blinking lights shown at the instrument cluster. So, I also do not think that it is a whole system failure. Will go to my mechanic again today. Last night, he mentioned to me that he was doing some alignment at the actuator and seen a **mere** possibility of positive result. He will continue to do more alignment today. He said the gear selector sensor may also be bad. I am in no way an expert, but it will help a lot if I can understand why this problem occurs. At least I know what I am paying for with my hard earned money... These few days I've been spending my lunch break at my mechanic's garage. Will keep everyone updated...
Just came back from the workshop. No new update as my mechanic was busy with other cars. He told me that last night when he tested the car, the gear was acting funny, when he tried to go reverse (R) the gear goes to 1, even from Neutral (N). He said it's due to misalignment inside the Actuator. I am worry if this alignment can be off? Cannot imagine when driving in the highway, upshift the gear then it goes to the wrong gear. Is this even possible? He literally opened up the Actuator, wash it, check the bearings inside, then later on assemble it back. Did anybody had theirs done like this before? My mechanic said that the problem might be with the gear selector sensor. He will put the system back tonight and will test again. Then he can give me a conclusion. (Hopefully). I will post the photo later on from my laptop...
Attached are a few photos of the Actuator and where the alignment need to be done: Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
We have a special tool (from Hill Engineering) designed specifically for actuator alignment: http://www.ricambiamerica.com/product_info.php?products_id=258540 If you're mechanic doesn't already have one, it might be a good addition to his tool bin.
We posted some of the workshop pages here: http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?p=138983006
Hi All, After a few looooong weeks, finally the problem is resolved. But not so "perfect" resolution! Ended up replacing the actuator which cost around USD 8,000. Only in 1 month of ownership, I have spend close to USD 10,000 for repairs... Sorry for the rant.... So I hope now I have resolved all problems carried over from the old owner. So there goes my budget allocation for Kreissegg.... Just kidding, the stock exhaust sounds good enough for me. I also replaced this plastic thingy. But apparently the new replacement part has been updated and to include new hose. Btw, mine is year 2006. It needs to be replaced because it starts to show some leaks. Maybe anybody that has around year 2005 or 2006 should have theirs check to avoid future costly problem. Here is the OLD Plastic part picture: Image Unavailable, Please Login
That fluid junction box has been updated by Ferrari (and also Hill Engineering makes one) because of the cracks you probably found in yours: http://www.ricambiamerica.com/product_info.php?products_id=337835
My goodness, that is A LOT of money!!! Glad to hear it's sorted, hopefully there are no issues in the near future for you my friend. Take care and enjoy!!
Thanks a lot for your update. Sorry to hear that you had to replace the entire actuator! That's a hell of a budget. Grace to your feedback, it makes me aware of something I did not know. I wasn't aware that this hydraulic distribution box is prone to hairline crack issues. This 235706 box is used on all 360's and F430's, F1 AND manual gear !!! Was this box the root cause of your problems? Can such failure damage the entire F1 actuator?
LOL in a sad way, this needs to go into the other tread on the ongoing saga of owning a 430. Would be curious to know how many miles this 430 had, I don't see it?
I don't think this box is the root cause. I replace it as a precaution. There was another 430 in the workshop which had this small black box replaced. So my mechanic ended up checked mine and saw it was started leaking. My mechanic explained to me that my actuator was not working properly at the beginning when I brought the car to him. So after he blipped (or bleeded?) the actuator, things start to go south and no point of return. He opened and cleaned the actuator, checked some bearings, made a new one, but no luck. The actuator can never maintain the pressure. My IMHO advise to everyone is NEVER OPEN THE ACTUATOR! Unless your workshop gave a warranty. My car only has 7200 miles! Will post some photos later on after I detailed the car. The interior is a bit dirty (it's a cream color). My mechanic did cleaned up the engine by spraying some solution (smelled bad). Now it looked clean, the engine block's red color looks like new...
