Manual for late 308 QV K-Jetronic? | FerrariChat

Manual for late 308 QV K-Jetronic?

Discussion in '308/328' started by DWPC, Sep 17, 2011.

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  1. DWPC

    DWPC Formula Junior

    Mar 10, 2011
    733
    Sedona AZ
    Full Name:
    Dennis
    I'm still learning about my car. My '85 QV (May '85) has the late K-Jetronic with ECU, metering valve and damper, and throttle micro-switch, c-clip injector bungs. I assume this is typical for 84/85 MY; its as described in the Owner's Manual. It doesn't quite match the typical K-Jetronic diagram in the Bosch K-Jetronic "Technical Instruction" book but it may be just a nomenclature difference. The Ferrari workshop manual info on the earlier CIS is mostly inapplicable. Is there a Ferrari-specific manual or on-line source for service and check-out info for this system? Is this the K/KE-Jetronic I see mentioned in a few places? If so what's a frequency valve?
     
  2. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    26,781
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
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    Steve Magnusson
    #2 Steve Magnusson, Sep 17, 2011
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2011
    Your '84-'85 US F V8 system is most commonly referred to as "K-Jetronic with Lambda" or "K-Lambda" (and, hydraulically, is the most complicated of all the Bosch CIS systems IMO :(). Unfortunately, I haven't come across any F literature on that subject (if someone has -- please post title/info), but this Volvo link has some K-Lambda information in Part 3:

    http://www.volvoclub.org.uk/tech/fuel_injection/k_jetronic.shtml

    The best references that I've come across for your system are the Forbes Aird book - Bosch Fuel Injection Systems (which is sort of basic and easier to understand than the Probst book, so it makes a good starting point), and the Charles O. Probst book - Bosch Fuel Injection & Engine Management (which is more techy).

    In almost all cases, the explanation strategy is to first explain K-Jetronic without Lambda to get the basics, then go into the differences for K-Jetronic with Lambda (or KE-Jetronic with Lambda or KE-Jetronic without Lambda).

    To answer your specific question, the frequency valve (aka metering valve) is a "controlled leak" path from the lower chambers in the fuel distributor back to the fuel tank (controlled by the injection ECU based on the O2 sensor signal) -- i.e.:

    If the O2 sensor reports a low voltage (lean) = the injection ECU increases the duty cycle to the FV = FV more (often) open = lowers the lower chamber pressure = lowers the upper chamber pressure = increases the pressure drop across the slits = more fuel delivered for same size slit opening = add richness

    If the O2 sensor reports a high voltage (rich) = the injection ECU decreases the duty cycle to the FV = FV more (often) closed = raises the lower chamber pressure = raises the upper chamber pressure = decreases the pressure drop across the slits = less fuel delivered for same size slit opening = more lean
     
  3. DWPC

    DWPC Formula Junior

    Mar 10, 2011
    733
    Sedona AZ
    Full Name:
    Dennis
    Thanks Steve. If I understand, the frequency valve is labeled by Ferrari as the metering valve in my Owner's Manual, and the O2 sensor is actually the lambda sensor. I'm ordering the Forbes Aird book from Amazon.
     
  4. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    26,781
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    Steve Magnusson
    Yes on both items.
     
  5. mike996

    mike996 F1 Veteran

    Jun 14, 2008
    6,871
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    Mike 996
    I haven't seen the other but the Probst book is excellent. I had never owned a car with Bosch FI and went from no knowledge at all to comfortably working on my 328's KJet using that book.
     
  6. mustardfj40

    mustardfj40 Formula 3

    Jun 17, 2004
    1,142
    Northen California
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    Ken
  7. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    26,781
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    I didn't mean to imply that the Probst book is incomprehensible. If you are a complete novice, I'd recommend getting the Aird book, and then moving on to the Probst book, If you already have a some background in fuel delivery systems, going straight to the Probst book as Mike suggested, is fine.
     
  8. DWPC

    DWPC Formula Junior

    Mar 10, 2011
    733
    Sedona AZ
    Full Name:
    Dennis
    Can you do me a favor and check the date that manual was published? Do you know whether it actually covers the system in the US 84/85 308QV as it's configured? My concern is that I'd get manual that "sort of" covers it but is actually for a different configuration for a later version with different components.
     
  9. fletch62

    fletch62 Formula Junior

    Mar 8, 2004
    333
    Fairhope, AL
    Full Name:
    Larry Fletcher
    I know the problem you are having with the manuals only showing the early system. Use Mercedes 380 manual and it will cover most of the functions of your system. If you go to my website and email a request for the info you want I can send you a bunch of files in pdf.

    Larry Fletcher

    www.cisflowtech.com
     
  10. DWPC

    DWPC Formula Junior

    Mar 10, 2011
    733
    Sedona AZ
    Full Name:
    Dennis
    Sounds great. E-mail on the way.
     
  11. GrayTA

    GrayTA F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 25, 2006
    15,130
    Deep South
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    PDG
    FWIW, Larry is awesome!!! He sent me a bunch of files recently as well when I got a rebuilt WUR from him.

    Thanks again Larry and its great to see you here.



    PDG


    PS: @DWPC - What is the chassis of your car? Mine is 58027 and is also a May 85 build date.
     
  12. DWPC

    DWPC Formula Junior

    Mar 10, 2011
    733
    Sedona AZ
    Full Name:
    Dennis
    My car is 58085. We're only 26 cars apart. Probably made on the same day!
     
  13. mustardfj40

    mustardfj40 Formula 3

    Jun 17, 2004
    1,142
    Northen California
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    Ken
    I went through the manual it has pics of 328 engine. The back this printed "Cat. 539 / 89"
     
  14. Crowndog

    Crowndog F1 Veteran

    Jul 16, 2011
    7,042
    Fairfield,Pa
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    Robert
    #14 Crowndog, Sep 21, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  15. DWPC

    DWPC Formula Junior

    Mar 10, 2011
    733
    Sedona AZ
    Full Name:
    Dennis
    I have that file but thanks for posting it. The posted reports by owners are a valuable resource but I'd like to have an authoritative reference to go with them.
     

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