1998 550 Maranello "sorting" thread--DIY

You say;

"I also bypassed the factory exhaust system, which I discovered can easily be done with NO additional materials and just a rearrangement of the existing factory vacuum hoses. The net result is that all 4 pipes are always open at all times during the engine running. After spending time with this:

I have decided that this is how my exhaust will stay for the forseeable future!
The prior video from a few posts back was with the factory exhausts in the factory bypass configuration. "

Can you (or anybody else ;-) please explain how this works?

Thnx in advance.

 

Sark,
There is no trick. Just be gentle but firm with it and pull while pushing the tab on top of the connector if I remember correctly.

 

Are you familiar with the exhaust bypass solenoid and it's configuration? If not I will take photos and document.

 

So I had driven the 550 for the last 10 days, enjoying it's performance. Ran like a champ. I decided to take down the belt and timing covers to look at things and make sure all looked good. I discovered this (Photos 1 and 2).

It appears that these brand new OEM bearings decided to begin flinging grease everywhere. It was splattered inside the timing covers also. In addition, the timing belts were far looser than I had left them, for an unknown reason. Tensioner bolts were still torqued correctly, all gears were tight.

When shown photos of the bearings, SKF said "fugheddaboutit". Other installers have said that this is what 348,355, and 360 bearings used to do prior to Hill making better versions (MR HILL ARE YOU LISTENING?) I am in the process of redoing the timing procedure, replacing the bearings "again" and the belts, along with retiming the motor.
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Pete, I know you are in the midle of bigger project, but you push the tab in or out before pulling on it. Thanks Sark

 

Pete,
Just helping you out with the member that asked about the exhaust bypass

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showpost.php?p=140303137&postcount=3


From our good friend Taz

 

Sark I believe it is a rocker tab that you push down on "towards the wires" to be able to remove it. I will get under there and look tomorrow.

 

Dominic thanks! That's how I did it.

 

Pete, for what it's worth, based on input from Fchat I put the Porterfield R4S pads on my 550 and it's magic. 4 years of squeaking and squealing suddenly disappeared, and it's music to my ears to not have to listen to that racket. Some of the racers here have advised that the Porterfields are not up to snuff on the track, but I never track my 550 so that didn't bother me. I can't tell any difference on stopping power compared to OEM and am a happy camper. Another Fchatter here in HK also installed Porterfields and he's also quite happy. I'm putting Porterfields on my family van next.

 

Porterfield is a great pad. I race with Andy Porterfield. Great guy too. He's like 80 years old and still winning racings.

 

Pete, wow sorry to hear this has happened to your car, but glad you caught it in time. Perhaps your supplier had some old stock of these bearings and the grease had dried out. Both sides were slinging grease? Any chance you could get some photos and generic specs on these and email them to me? I'll bet with a little research we could cross these over to a higher quality, Japanese made, idler bearing. As mentioned previously, I think SKF's QC is slipping - it would be interesting to know what the country of origin was stamped on these.

In regards to Hill Engineering bearings for the 550, I had just had some correspondence with Paul last week on this and a couple other topics, and here is his reply:

"Hello John,

I am glad to hear your modification worked for your application.

We unfortunately do not do manufacture a tensioner bearing for the 550/575 at present but we do stock the OEM SKF items. – Our part number 130872 @ £65.00 each. Regarding the bearing for the driven pulley – I believe that the factory part is fine for the application but as you say the problem arises when the belt is over tensioned and it will be impossible to get a higher loading bearing in there unless the front cover was redesigned and this would be probably very uneconomical to produce.

Many thanks

Paul Hill"

 

Thank you both!! What a great forum....

 

SKF on sealed for life bearing grease

http://www.bearingtrends.com/bearing-knowledge/bearing-seal-a-lubrication/447-grease-life-in-lubricated-for-life-deep-groove-ball-bearings

 

Brand new OEM Ferrari pads squealed badly on my 355. I put the Porterfields on and that squeal was gone. It occasionally comes now...but very rarely and not as loud. I've put about 7k on the pads, never tracked my 355, and I didn't notice any change in stopping power.

 

John,
Ricambi is working with Paul Hill to source a SKF bearing from England to replace these two. The country of origin stamped on the bearing is "France"
I'm hoping there will be enough of a demand for Mr. Hill to begin designing a bearing for the 550.

Regards,
Pete

 

Hm, I believe I put SKF bearings in my 456 early this year that exactly resemble these, mine came in Ferrari packageing. I should pull the covers and check them now. If they're shot I am certainly in the market for a set!

I did notice how your bearings were a little rusty around the rings, maybe they were on a shelf for too long is the only reason I can think of also. Where did you source them?

 

These are Ferrari OEM bearings sourced from Ricambi. The rust was present when I got them...they come wrapped in "anticorrosive paper". I have received a new set from Ricambi also to replace these and they also have a little bit of rust here and there.

I wouldn't panic yet about your own bearings...there is still a possiblility that I did something wrong here (although I don't know what it could be).

 

It could simply be what I refer to as 'newness'. Perhaps it is a matter of grease finding its way out just this one time because of the air pressure building inside and maybe a little too much grease on the inside to start with. After it has settled now, it may stop anyway. Considered wiping them clean and re-using the the car (after checking for unwanted bearing noises)?

I don't know what would cause the belts to be looser; perhaps they stretch one-time in the beginning but I would not expect them to, so perhaps someone can chirp in as to what the options are (tensiometer?) As I understand it you cannot retighten belts once used, not even if they were new before.

 

There is alot of truth to what you say. Sealed bearing are only supposed to have about 25% of the area filled with grease for lifetime seal. The grease is supposed to outlive the bearing. I have popped the seals off such bearing before and regreased them and put them back into service. I'm not recommending that as a usual course but I have done it very successfully. Too much grease is certainly a possibility and especially so depending on the manufacturing method to put the grease in. I would think this impossible on a mechanized assembly line but absoulutely a possibility on a low volume by hand production line. Also, not the right grease can also cause this. You can get too much grease bleedout if the grease melts. Another possiblity is corrosion inside the bearing just like on the outside with hard dry grease. Then the new activity would generate more heat than designed and melt the grease.

The bigger puzzle is why the loose belts?

 

Some musings about belts, it could be that the tension is lower after the initial use from a little wear on them or perhaps even some stretch (but would not expect that).
Some say that on a cold engine the belts should be sloppier compared to when the engine is warm, as the motor 'grows' a little (expands) when warming up; however I think that since the belt goes round, I would suppose that the belt expands roughly twice that. Of course the expansion coëfficient of the materials (and the diameter of the cogs as they expand too) play their role , etc. My point is, warm tension may be lower than when cold, and if you think they're too sloppy now, it could be a risk. However, what is too sloppy is the question now of course. It could well be that what you observe is totally normal.

To be sure, you'd require a tensiometer. I have a recollection about reading somewhere that there are two values for the Staeger tensiometer, one for new belts and one for checks on an installed belt after some use (but not intended to re-tension used belts, as they are not supposed to be re-used or re-tensioned); that value was lower but I cannot remember by how much unfortunately, perhaps it's in the WSM; hopefully someone has it and can check. I would not do anything, no re-tensioning or replacing of the belts without some research.

 

I believe moorfan does have the tensiometer, but I do recall that there was some debat on the values, and that those mentioned in the WSM were too high.

As far as I understand, these belts do not strech..

 

Ok. I am going to try to go over the troubleshooting process here that I have thus far undertaken. First, the data.

I checked everything when I removed the old(new) belts. Tensioners were tight. Tensioner bolts were still torqued at 56Nm like before. On removal of the belts, the gilmer drive gears are tight with no play in the bearings at all. That's it...those are the only things that can go bad here to impact belt tension. My belts had loosened, but I still had to release the tensioner bolt to actually get them off. No teeth had been jumped. I could no longer read a value with my meter (it just said "lo" on the longest run which to me implies it was lower than 50).

The original 550 WSM states to use a Staeger device to measure the belts properties. My understanding is that this is not a frequency device but instead a force deflection device. The original 550 belts are not even made anymore from what I understand so that information is irrelevant.

Most of our 550's now have 575 components in the timing system...belts, tensioners, etc. The 575 WSM states to use a harmonic tensiometer to measure the frequency of the longest run of each timing belt. The manual states this frequency should be 126Hz.

On the 612 (which allegedly uses all the exact same timing components as the 575), the manual changed how to check the belts...the manual states to use a harmonic tensiometer to check the TWO longest runs of each timing belt, sum the values, and the sum should be 335-360Hz.

Now, if you think about it, if the longest belt run is set to 126Hz (a la 575), that makes the other run of the belt more like 175-180 (as this second run is much shorter). This gives a total value of 306Hz. This is somewhat lower of a tension than the 612 manual's statement but in the ballpark. I remember verifying this fact (that the shorter run has a significantly higher frequency) when I did my own belts.

Now, because of the million assertions present in this and other forums about 575 belts routinely being overtensioned, stories of rubber dust and snapping belts, I decided to go with a lower value for belt tension than the WSM states. So, instead of tensioning the belts so that the longest belt run was 126Hz, the longest belt run in my case ended up being around 100-105. I am presuming that this was too low. These belts do stretch...I put the belts on in the evening and tensioned them, rotated the engine several times and rechecked to verify. I then left the car overnight and rechecked them in the AM and they were lower by about 10-15Hz. And this was without significant torquing of them (like with driving). I then brought them back up to the original set value of 100-105Hz and closed them up.

I am still waiting on new SKF tensioner bearings, but this time when I reapply belts I will follow the 575 WSM specifications for belt tension. 126Hz on the longest run. I think the forum is very helpful but realize that I may have fallen victim to using statements from others and innuendo to decide what I do. I think it is reasonable for me to have tried this because I am not a pro but this time I'm going to stick to the WSM's values.

 

Pete, Considering all the parameters recorded in 550 WSM, I agree with you the belts streches. The WSM recommend to check the tension after 1500 mils driving and it should not be less than 10% of initial settings, if it is, then needs to be replaced. What happend I asume there was a resistance in the circulation. 1- bearings had free rotation before instalation?. 2- the belts where overthighten ( if the engine rotation automatically set the tension I don't know how that can happen). 3- What was the initial measerment reading on old belts before you took the belts off comparing to the tension you set as the final tension. Sark

 

Is there resistance in the circulation? Hell yes there is. This is a high resistance circuit period. Have you ever tried to move one of these cams by hand? Its almost impossible. The bearings do not rotate "freely"...they have some resistance to rotation but it is the same across the board in all the bearings I've ever felt (6 sets now). I am guessing that the only thing that would damage the belts would be a seized bearing, which these are very clearly not.

 

I wonder what my belts are set at? I have done this by hand since 1978 on my first 308. I was taught by pros to do this. I raced my 348 racecar at redline most of the time and changed belts by hand yearly for over 5 years. I still set belts wrong by hand. I do not recommended it but I don't have any fancy tools and I have no data. Because I lack updated TSB's or on the front lines data from real pros I would just use the latest WSM data if I had the right tools. The right tools are now available to diy'ers for pretty cheap. But still "by hand" has served me well for all these years I don't think I would change. However, I would recommend to anyone else use the right tool. That's do as I say not as I do.

I also do not understnad the rational for adding two belt tensions for a final belt spec.. It seems that a longside belt tension should be what is used. But I don't know anything about belt engineering. If properly installed and hand run in the driven direction one reading on the longside should be fine. I'd love for someone to school me on the rational for two readings.

Pete...if you are not in a hurry and you want yet another data point you could send your tool to me and I can take a reading on my belts and send your tool back to you. I have checked my belts several times out of paranoia for dusting but mine seem fine and they are tight. Some might say too tight?