accepting offers...

I think some need to take a look at the invoice pdf that Roy posted. That is a pile of work. Fog lamps, new flywheel, clutch (ceramic kevlar setup- yikes), rebuilt transmission, starter, and on and on. If you ask for this much work - you bet it's going to hurt. What a wonderful car it has to be now.

 

It's had not to take sides in issues such as this. People are going to view value of things in diffrent light. I guess I consider myself in the middle. Despite how little I am sure my opinion matters here, the pricing of some items I can see as being close to spot on, while others seem ridiculous. The main one that bothers me is the R&R of the engine. I have worked on far more complicated cars than a Countash and including a lot of cutom work, they work out to about 40 hours. This is removal of the engine, going over the engine to customer specs, swapping over parts to new engine, modifying wiring harness, modifying motor mounts, modifying the engine bay and anything to do with the shifter and transmission tunnel, reinstalling, tuning and making sure everything is working 100%.

But again, we all have our opinions and at the end of the day it's Roy's car and he can do whatever he pleases. He owes nobody anything except the individual who hands him a check for the car in question. He has no aligence in validating anyone who inquires for curiosity.

 

I love this section of the forum.

 

How long was the period between Joe's deal and your deal? Was it just one owner?
Is there a possibility that something went terribly wrong with this owner and the car?

I've seen owners totally abuse their car within 2 weeks of getting it. Or someone that they "lend" it to.

 

Yes, I feel that some of this is "lamborghini tax" as these are big engines but by todays standards are not that complex and yet the bills can be astronomical. I certainly want people who know what they are working on, working on my car, but cannot help but feel some of the stuff is not always completely needed.
As another example - how is it that a belt can last 90,000km on and NSX that revs until eternity but only 3-5 years on a Ferrari 355? You see what I am saying?

 

As far as a Countach, they are just a car and primitive one at that. Nothing difficult or complicated......just f-ing time consuming work on.
I do not think guys like George, Wil, Gary, Tim, Tony, or Chad and other known guys really pad to much. If they are padding, they are avoid things before they happen...which would make them look bad. EZ for a custoemr to say 3months after getting a car back, after 20k, 30k, 40k of work...."why didn't you tell me it was "getting" worn and I should replace?"

I believe all those guys are honest dudes, period.

 

I agree. Perhaps the "lambo tax" portion comes from scarce parts and specialty workmen rates. I am an owner so I have obviously bought into it.

 

Not that I really want to add to the b!tch fest that seems to be going on here, but it seems a little odd that you do not seem to apply the same trust in Roy that you put in these gentlemen you list. I completely agree, that this list is invaluable to the Lamborghini community. I also put a guy like Roy on this invaluable list. He's one of us, and I guess I don't really see, with his well earned reputation, why you seem to have been on a witch hunt to get this information that you just had to have. While I agree, it was a ton of money, it seemed as though you questioned Roy and his motivation significantly, while after the extremely lengthy invoice was posted, it was more or less met with an, "oh", and not much else.

FWIW, it's well known that Roy once listed a Jarama for half retail just last year, which I spoke with him about purchasing. If doing something like that, essentially giving up the possibility of $25-30k to do something nice for a less well heeled enthusiast, doesn't make him a "good guy" in your book, I'm not sure what will.

And, no disrespect to someone who brokers a car and passes along information, but why is their "word" rarely questioned, but when a dealer/enthusiast tells you that this car needed a quadruple laundry list of work because it was misrepresented, he is automatically questioned and taken to the woodshed?

There seem to be a lot of double standards going on here.

 

I have to agree, I have done a lot of work for Roy over the years with no problems whatsoever. he is out there looking for cars and doing needed repairs, he deserves to make a profit. He has always been a man of his word, pays ahead or when the job is done. george

 

Peter, you hit it right on the head, when we get into these cars, we see potential problems before it happens. we repair problems with the cars that should never have happened then as we replace a poorly designed part with another original poorly designed part, we are expected to guarantee it forever. We always advise owners of needs and future needs but sometimes the money is just not there.
I am constantly reengineering components to make them last longer or work better, especially when we have much better technology available now days. The hours spent are unbelievable. I am here late now engineering a fix for the no longer available jalpa door straps that rust in 2 pieces. It is never ending……….. george

 

yes, 3 or 5 angles are great for a passenger car but when you are looking for the absolute best you need to go a little further.
The 17 angle valve job is our name for a very carefully done full radius and blended valve job that we do on most all the high performance engines we do. We have over the years developed a proprietary process that is performed with a Serdi 100 seat and guide machine, we then hand blend into the ports. We test each head for flow on a JKM600 superflow flow bench monitoring flow with a flowcom computer interface. Drive one of the lambos that we have built the engine in, you will not find another like it. george

 

5K for car rebuilt is when you get shafted by a Ferrari guy guy who is mesgin around tuning the Countach and gets you to pay for his time messing around. I actually paid well over that. That is what I paid. As a bonus I ended with s slight flat spot at $3500.
I can live with it but i'll tell yoou, when I got my car tuned from G.Evans there was no flat spot. That is where the car will go next time. Price is just right for his work on carb rebuilt.

 

Damn.. Its a good thing I felt the price was high when I contacted Joe Sackey in regards to this same Blue DD.. Appart from the $40,000 addition to the sales price, I was told this car was PERFECT and needed nothing.. Here is the original PM..

Re: Hello Joe,

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradjohnston
Can I get more info on the blue Countach including price? Thank You!

$195,000 asking.

Ex-Edgar Kaiser 1988 Countach QV with One-Off Spec

This 1988 1/2 Countach QV # 12292 was built to one-off special order for the ex-Denver Broncos team owner and US Steel magnate heir Edgar Kaiser. Finished in "Blu Tahiti (#215854) with "Blu con giletti Bianchi" the car was fitted with a close-ratio gearbox # 1316 and a factory tuned engine number 1503. Completed early on December the 17th 1987, 12292 was collected at the Sant Agata factory by Edgar Kaiser himself, using Italian Touring (Escursionisti Esteri) plates EE.556.AK to drive the car out of the factory gates! After touring Europe at high speed, the car was flown back to Canada on a private aircraft and kept in Kaiser's car collection for the next decade. Kaiser's business colleague bought the car and in 2008 contacted Joe Sackey Classics about finding it a new home. The car comes with books, tools and remains in 100% original one-off livery as it left the factory. 21,429 km (13,315 miles) from new. Recently serviced, this car has no needs.

 

that is a good point. The thing is at the end its up to the owner to go over the know list in detail and then go over each item that comes up.

In this case Roy wanted to get back a top car, that was his priority so the replacement for reliability prevailed, thus the bill and we should read the repairs' list in that context. The last think yoou want in this case is to get the car, somethings goes worng and you have to ship it again. Talk about dead costs when this happens!

 

that is funny you put that number out. In 10 years the DD has doubled. In another 10 years it will probably double. So the DD will be at $400K and the lp400 at $800K by 2022...
that is if we dont run out of oil first.. which is my worry before I die because no more countach driving for me..

 

Trust me the Lambo Tax gets really expensive when the Nonspecialist works on it.
There is no worse feeling than being taxed for garbage work.

Vic

 

Roy is not on this list because he is not a facility like theirs. He is a broker/seller/buyer. Those guys are wrenches with shops.
By the way, what 1/2 price Jarama? Retail??

 

Roy,

Thanks for posting the invoice and break down of the work done by GE. It not only confirmed what was spent, it cleared up a lot of the questions of the doubtful. It educated some of us on what it takes to get the right, no cutting corners, type work done on these incredible cars. IMO you're in a league of your own when it comes to the kind of dedication and investment you are willing to put forth in preparing a car that will be for sale. I don't know of another dealer that would spend that high of sum on what most dealers would just resort to "reconditioning" a car in order to make it "just" sellable. Hats off to you sir!

Geno

 

Yes, a '71 for $27,500 that wound up with a member here...Mike I think, for a bit more than that, as we were both going for it. That was a good car that needed about $2,000 in carb work (with shipping, since we're auditing numbers these days).

And if you reread the last paragraph, I tie the point in with the way you also elevate JS in the same regard as the gents that do the repairs. It just seems that some are good in your book no matter what they do, OTOH, someone else is never good enough no matter how much evidence there is to the contrary. My entire gist was about word and reputation, not the line of work, per se.

Hope this helps.