Flying in close formation .... rules? | FerrariChat

Flying in close formation .... rules?

Discussion in 'Aviation Chat' started by Jedi, Apr 5, 2012.

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  1. Jedi

    Jedi Moderator
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    Mar 18, 2008
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    Dave
    Mrs. Jedi and I regularly rent a nice beach house on the Puget Sound ("Serenity Shores"
    at Diamond Point on Miller Peninsula, near Sequim, WA for any locals reading). There's a small GA
    airstrip right there, with a lot of small planes coming and going.

    Every time we've been there, there's a pair/trio of sport planes that take off together,
    and fly in tight formation over the Puget Sound. They'll zip around overhead for a
    while, land, and take off and do it all again. It's always fun to watch them buzz
    the beach in front of the house as they go by.

    Do GA pilots need a special rating or something to fly in such tight formation? Sometimes
    these 2-3 planes are CLOSE. Like REALLY close. Other times, they are farther apart
    but still in a tight formation. Very fun to watch.

    Just curious....

    Jedi
     
  2. Bob Parks

    Bob Parks F1 Veteran
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    Nov 29, 2003
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    The only group that I can think of that would practice like that would maybe be members of the Black Jack Squadron, a group of 15 or 20 pilots flying RV-4's out of Paine Field. Yes, you should be trained in close formation flight because there are very precise rules about it regarding position, movement , and vigilance. I knew the solo pilot of the Snowbirds ne' the "Golden Centennairs" with whom I spoke about the tight formation work that they did and I asked him if he was concerned about and watched the guy on his right. he answered, " What guy on my right! I only know about the guy on my left and I have a contract with HIM and I fly to keep from hitting him!" So, everybody on his right had the same contract with the guy on their left. Any pilots who are going to fly close formation work out the plan and and fly by the rules of formation flying before take off i.e.: only one guy moves at any time, or flying slightly lower and behind the guy in the right or left position. There are hard and fast rules of how to get and to maintain that position. It takes concentration and total attachment to the movements of the guy next to your right or left or or the whole thing could become unattached.
     
  3. Chupacabra

    Chupacabra F1 Rookie
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    My hat is off to anyone who does formation work. I have _a little_ formation training, and it made me sweat a bit. :)
     
  4. davebdave

    davebdave Formula 3
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    Bob is right (of course) but as long as you aren't doing acrobatics the rules are simple..

    “Operating near other aircraft. (a) No person may operate an aircraft so close to another aircraft as to create a collision hazard. (b) No person may operate an aircraft in formation flight except by arrangement with the pilot in command of each aircraft in the formation. (c) No person may operate an aircraft, carrying passengers for hire, in formation flight.”


    If planned carefully, within each pilots experience level, no special training required.

    Dave
     
  5. Gatorrari

    Gatorrari F1 World Champ
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    Jim Pernikoff
    Bob mentioning RV-4s reminds me of a tragedy I witnessed at Oshkosh '83. During the morning, four guys in RV-4s who had apparently never flown formation together took off to do just that. Paul Poberezny was trying to talk them down when one of the wingmen was late responding to the lead's command for a tight formation turn. To avoid a collision, he pulled up sharply, stalled the airplane, and spun into the ground, fortunately away from the airport and in an uninhabited area. (We couldn't see the impact, only the pillar of smoke that followed.)
     
  6. Bob Parks

    Bob Parks F1 Veteran
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    I am not a journeyman in flying formation but I have done it both with an untrained pilot who decided en route to " come over" and fly formation with me. After several attempts to slide in at my level, wing tip to wing tip, I finally got enough gestures and signals to him to back off. Formation is not an impromptu aerial dance. It is something that is done with another pilot who's has had some training and knowledge of formation technique and something that has been carefully planned on the ground before take off. Adherence to the plan is mandatory. I flew in a PT-26 with a PT-19 on one wing and a PT-22 on the other. Both formating airplanes were flown by high time ex-fighter pilots, one the chief test pilot for Boeing, Lew Wallick. They formed up in proper position and their eyes never left the lead airplane and they were close enough to see the whites of their eyes. A piece of cake when everybody knew who was doing what and that there would be no sudden unplanned maneuvers. Everybody stuck to the pre flight plan.
    One of the most unforgettable experiences in formation flying came in 1990 when the Russians were here for the first time. We joined four of the Russian pilots at friends home 100 miles north of Seattle in the San Juans. After memorable weekend we departed for Paine Field on a bright sunny afternoon in three 182s . We lined up on the strip thinking that our Russian friends, who had ben put in the left seats in the airplanes, would follow us but as we started to roll they formed up on either side of us in a three plane vic and off we went in a three plane flight. They stayed there the entire trip with their eyes glued on us the entire time. Calling in to Paine for clearance and runway, we noticed the Russians were still glued to us and they stayed there until we were down and pulling into the stalls. Great fun! Big show offs.
     
  7. Jedi

    Jedi Moderator
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    Great answers... I LOVE this sub-forum :) Bob - you truly are an aviation gem. I'm
    SO GLAD I got to meet you over lunch... your knowledge is just fascinating.

    And thanks to the other posters as well.

    :)

    Jedi
     
  8. Bob Parks

    Bob Parks F1 Veteran
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    Thanks, Jedi. I appreciate your comment but when I think of all the high time pilots and those who have laid it on the line during the war and all the airline pilots who are responsible for a 100 foot long tube full of trusting souls I see that I'm at the absolute bottom of the pool. I have done nothing but to tag along at fly ins and air shows where I was exposed to opportunities of which I took part. I have done nothing worthy of note and like my son says, " I tell a lot of good stories." I can only lay claim to have been messing around with it for a long time and Iv'e learned how to make up a lot of good stuff..
     
  9. RBM

    RBM Formula Junior

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    Back in the day, aircraft had to maintain 500' separation, unless they were a formation. In the military, you are required to have a formation qualification to fly in a formation. Yes, there are some important procedures and techniques. And the crews always thoroughly pre-brief a formation sortie. There are big advantages, as well. You can file a single flight plan (military, FAA, or ICAO) for a formation of aircraft. An aircraft with crippled avionics or IFF can fly in a formation with a full-up aircraft, and therefore comply with IFR. You can recover a lot of aircraft in a short time at an airfield, when they operate in formations.
     

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