#1350 restoration - paint detail advice

After 4 months in the restoration shop my dino gt is about ready for paint - possibly on Monday.

Questions:
1) Are the rocker panels supposed to be the color of car (yellow) or black - I have seen both and think it looks better in color, but I want to be correct. The shop has my compendium and for the example of the M it looks like the rockers are black. Is it paint or undercoating.

2)Same for under the front valence - I have seen both color and black. I think color looks better and the shop prepped it for color.

3)If I go color I was planning to have 3M clear protection on valence and rockers to help with rock chips. Good idea??

4) A new front valence was fabricated by the shop. Does it need drain holes. Would you put drain holes anywhere else?

5) What areas are recommended to undercoat? Inside of rear panels and valence?

6) Are the fan motors supposed to be black or silver? I have seen both.

7) I told the shop to delete the drivers side mirror. What is recommended?

8) For under the front and rear decks should the color go to the point the skin ends or all the way to the steel frame? In the compendium for the motor cover it looks like it goes to the frame, but the restorer thinks it my look better just going to the end of where the skin overlaps on the underside

Thank you for any advice.

Sam
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Sam,

You should post photos all around the car including the new valance. You'll get some good feedback. Best to do all of this before you paint it!

Freeman

 

Sam,
You have really set yourself up for this one. You are going to get more opinions than you wanted. Here's mine.
Rockers & valance: Color first. You can black them later (Matte finish not undercoat).
Clear bra: NO. It wasn't original. You would have to wait until the paint is cured anyway. Worried about rock chips? It's going to happen. Get over it. You can always touch-up or spot paint later. If you ever have to remove the clear film, you will be kicking yourself.
Drain holes: That fabricated part should mimic the original. Don't add holes that were not original.
Undercoat: Protect what might have corrosion exposure while trying to stay original.
Fans: Lucas fans are kind of a hammertone silver on my early GT4. Maybe black was original too?
Driver mirror: You need one. You are going to drive the car, right?
Jamb color: My thinking is the color stops at the very edge after it wraps around to the underside.
Bottom line is that it is your car and you can do whatever you like. I say do not personalize the car and make it as close to original as you can.
Joe

 

Great points Joe. I agree with all of it except the mirror. Not that I wouldn't add the mirror at a later date. Most shops would just "drill" the holes without knowing a correct aesthetic position. I've seen this all too often on even high end concours restorations. Another area that wasn't mentioned was if an antenna hole exists. You have to question, do you want it and is it in the aesthetic correct place? Easier to add holes later than having to live with them in the wrong place. On the valance, I would scrutinize the shape and holes for correctness. All the body lines and radiuses also need to be scrutinized. I would have a really good look at Tom Kearn's Dino and the process he did with Steve all the way to applying the lower black. I think Dino's look unfinished without the black. The black reduces the visual body weight and visually lines up the front and back. The bumper tuning is also VERY important. Also scrutinize all the body shut lines with the rubber seals. Are the panels flush? Are the gaps consistant and the correct gap? Do this BEFORE you paint it! I've seen many Dino's that are finished where the bumper alignment is incorrect, the shut lines aren't good, part of an opening panel isn't flush to the body. Scrutinize the the lines and shapes of the headlamp coves. Compare them to a benchmark Dino. Are the side markers in the correct position? On the clear film, It looks aweful on a Dino. Looks like it got the front painted with an off shade. Lastly on the yellow paint. Get multiple sprayouts on a small aero shape dishes then live with them for a week or two. Look at them in the sun, under clouds and under fluorescent. Goal Should be to keep the Dino as delivered. I would do all of this even if I never showed the car. It increases the value of your investment and assures to you that its right. Sam, you opened up a can of worms!!! Maybe get Steve to have a good look in person to advise you?

Freeman

 

Best you can do is to buy THE book, Dino Compendium, will give you most of the answers

Ciao
Bjorn

 

Bjorn,

He has the book and has given it to the painter. Matthias's book is an amazing fantastic guide but won't show someone how to correct all the lines, alignments, templates for where the mirror goes, surfacing for highlight reflections, exact area for sill blackout etc. That takes experience (a few Dino's under his belt) and talent. Even Matthias is still learning believe it or not. An example is anyone could trim an interior with a step by step manual. Doesn't mean it's going to be a great trim job or even a good one. Bodywork is an art and requires specific knowledge and experience with that particular model car.

Freeman

 

Agree 100%.

that's why choosing a painter is so important. The guy I used owned a Dino, had painted at least a half dozen, and understood completely how to do the car right.

That being said, there are tons of pictures here of Dinos, and each one has some variations from the other, particularly when it comes to the black paint on the rockers, etc. Even my mechanic at Ferrari pointed out to me that no two cars were exactly the same on this. He speculated that as the week went on, and the painter's back got more weary, the line for this black paint mover farther up the rocker towards the door seam.

I think he was kidding.

End of the day I'd want someone who had hands on experience with Dinos doing my car. short of that, I'd want a ton of photos, or a second car to look at that was what I wanted.

Finally. I'd lay down color all around the car (I think you'd have to) and then follow with the black over top.

D

 

Painting/refinishing a Dino is a 100% subjective experience.
Even if a totally original car were found, it would not mean it is the end all, as every car is different from birth as Ferrari was not very consequent on the quality control aspect. Lambrusco was a huge factor.

According to Matthias, and I certainly believe him, the black paint was applied by brush.
Will I? Probably not.
Mirrors? No template ever existed as all cars were delivered sans, and if it was applied pre-delivery, just about anywhere in the usual area, was OK.
Did you ever live in Italy in the early 70's? I did, and anarchy was the game. The Red Brigades, were the issue, not mirror locations or all the fanatic aspects of the 2000's with manuals, tools and jacks.
We are living in the past, and at times borderline lunacy...but that's OK too.

Sam, do your homework, and figure out what YOU want, yet stay within the Dinoland accepted constraints, and please, no clear film...
Don't forget, it is your car, yet if you do strange things with it and post photos, you will get eaten up alive.

Regards, Alberto

 

Alberto,

I'm a good friend of Sam's. I think we're all trying to guide him in the right direction and give him our opinions as he asked. And to your question, yes, I lived in Europe in the 60's, 70's, 80's and 90's and also worked in Italy in the 90's so know what you're talking about! Even through their seemingly chaotic work process they actually have consistency. Not German but Italian. I witnessed this. Also at Scaglietti I think they became experienced with building the Dino with a level of consistency that you could say is within the margin of error. After all they built about 4000 of them in a crude assembly line. We all want Sam to have a great Dino that he's proud of once he's done and has the advantages of our collective opinions(that he asked for). It's a Dino that's worth it because it has really good history and was really original outside of needing some body stuff when he got it. Here in SoCal he has access to amazing resources and opinions that are available to him.

Freeman

 

Sam, you are in great hands...

Regards, Alberto

 

maybe some period photos from magazines courtesy of Ed. I may have some more at work, too.
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and from the DM vault
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The PO of my car had restored it and painted it body color to the very bottom.
I took pictures of the car then used black marker on the pics to see how different shapes of black and different cutoff levels looked before masking it off with thin tape and painting it myself.

I used a curved line on the front valance to bring the black up to go above the large cutouts near the center, hence hiding them.

 

How did that Prancing Horse get there so long ago?

 

Alberto,

I have photo's of Dino's in the FACTORY area used for quality control with mirrors installed

Both, the commonly accepted "round" mirror and ALSO Chromodora Astra mirrors, which I have NEVER seen on a modern Dino.

Mirrors were installed at the factory. I don't believe there was a "template" other than what looked about the right area. Most Dino's didn't have mirrors installed. BUT, that doesn't mean they didn't come with them........

 

Shawn, I wholly agree, cars in Italy in that era did not require an outside mirror by law, or any other reason. I mean, if you are faster than everybody else, why a mirror?
It was placed by the owner if wished to, and if not, not.

I remember installing a Vitaloni California on an Alfa GTV in '72, and with the help of a friend while I was sitting inside, we found the best location, not on looks, but on practicality.
Very simple and easy.

I don't know the Astra mirror, nor what it looks like, and the round AR original,very similar to the Dino, was not that cool at the moment, just old school...

The Vitaloni, was way too cool, as was a MOMO Jackie Stewart steering wheel, and the original wood Hellebore ended in the circular file.
F1 was a big influence at the time
Too bad, I wished I had kept it. The car, I still have, along with the MOMO and the Vitaloni and the original spare tire, a Firestone Cavallino.
I am glad I kept all four.

Regards, Alberto

 

Sam,

Come take a look at my Dino anytime if you wish, I'm in South OC. Also I'm more than willing to help your painter tape lines for the lower black. It is not easy!!! ... even for a professional automotive designer. Now I know why I see so many Dino's with wondering lower black outs.

All the best,

Tom

 

I have 1582, every time I read one of these items I feel I left my wallet open on the bar counter some where. Once you start??? good luck on your voyage
\clay

 

Thank you everyone for all your help and advice.

Sam

 

Any pictures of your car and what paint did you use Im considering this process also.

 

Sorry for taking the panel paint discussion further but I'm planning a paint job on my early 246 in the nearby future and would appreciate some actual pictures of what is believed to be the most correct panel paint configuration. See pictures below for the current panel paint appearance:

Thanks for any of your comments or pictures....Regards Peter
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