#3061 @ LMC 2012

Apparently Franco Meiners damaged #3061 at the Le Mans Classic last weekend. I was busy racing two cars myself so I did not have any chance to watch anything.

Did anybody see the accident and the extent of the damage? Pictures maybe?

Thanks and Regards

Wolfi

 

http://barchetta.mediacenter.studioline.net/-/Events-by-Year/2010-2019/2012/Racing/Le-Mans-Classic/236-MASERATI-300-S-s-n-3061-1955-MEINERS-ITA/?Dir=2024574&rd=1964532

 

This very original 300S got a fantastic restoration over the last 3 years.

This happens when a not so talented driver over-estimates himself:

©: http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=374338

I assume that C. v. D., the owner of the car, is not amused.....

Its the 2nd crash of #3061. The first was in August 1956......
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Seatbelts and HANS do help in a classic race car!

Best

Matthias

 

...but dos not avoid a crash!
A very experianced driver who also raced in the same group told me this morning that Signor Meiners drove quite badly.
I am pretty sure that he will never be permitted to sit again in that car.

 

Hello Walter,

was this 3061 in working Condition?
View attachment MVI_0193.MOV

 

Sorry, but I could not open your attachment.
It was tested in July 2011 on the Nuerburgring over 2 days by the owner and 2 very good drivers and was also entered in the 1 hr race in August that year. A very pampered 300S. So I strongly assume it was in working order.

 

Hello Walter,

here is an Image....
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What I said - a fantastic car! Its based on a Factory-chassis, has still its original coachwork (despide the corrected nose section), matching-no.-engine with all other genuine components, received a comprehensive restoration, was sorted by great race drivers Max Werner (s. photo / © Walter Bäumer, 2011) and Claudia Huertgen to be shunted in LM by a less talented person behind the wheel. A shame!
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And another photo with owner C.v.D. behind the wheel.
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This is unfortunate,.....but it is always a possibility with any car, anywhere.

All it takes is money, time and skilled craftsmen to fix what is damaged. And there appears to be plenty or those.

I hope all involved are o.k. and the car will be repaired.

Ciao and best!

 

It's always easy to juge a situation from a couch. But only if you know all the circumstances you should actually do so.

Even the most experienced driver sometimes runs out of road. Pleanty of examples every weekend on the tracks of this world and also this year in LM.

I am not saying that Franco Meiners is a good or bad driver because I never actually saw him racing and neither wouldn't I dare to judge on that. But I hate those premature comments.

Best

Matthias

 

...then read again post 5! This "premature comment" as you call it originally came not from me. It came from a very talented driver from the same group!

Also the kind of damage on the car tells the story....

Another issue is if someone shunts his own car, OK, bad luck! But to shunt a very valuable car that is not owned in such way is beyond any respect!

 

Who is the "very talented" driver? Repeating hearsay doesn't make the comments better.

What story does the damage tell?

If you give your car to a driver who's capabilities you don't know you are a fool. If you give it to a professional or ex pro you can't be sure of the outcome either. Vern Schuppan, Le Mans winner 1983 on a Porsche 956, crashed the Gulf Porsche 917 of Ronald Goethe in practice. The reason? I don't know.

What would we prefer? Serious racing with the risk of crashes or lame parading of cars. I am afraid that riskless racing is an oxymoron.

Good night.

 

I would like to weight in on this horrific misuse of an historic icon.
I am reminded of my conversation with a very well known US collector/vintage racer whom when I asked if he was going to take his car to Europe for the Monaco Historics a couple months ago, his reply went something like "Hell No" those guys are much to aggressive for my taste.
It was apparent that the Europeans in general go way to fast with these old cars and show a certain disrespect for the car and fellow racers.
I know not what others have heard or seen but having been to several Italian vintage races I can concur. Looking good is very important, at least to the Italians.
They seen to be much more focused on their machismo and winning at all cost.
Just my 2 lira.
This car will never be the same and that is very sad.
Ciao,
FGM

 

An accident does not directly imply that the driver was driving poorly. Willie Green has had a few and he usually is fast and safe.

IMO it is all about the drivers attitude to historic racing. If they are young and/or in there to be a hero they should be immediate sent home. The cars are the hero and have already done their real racing. Now it is just for serious fun.
Pete

 

A sad sight! It was driven in anger from the looks of the picture on this page.
http://www.finecars.cc/en/editorial/races-rallyes-article/news/le-mans-classic-at-the-start-pure-amateur-gentlemen-drivers-to-le-mans-legends-as-5-times-champi/index.html?no_cache=1&tx_ttnews%5BbackPid%5D=301&cHash=5b489eb4c6

 

Frank,
a race car was made to be raced. Yes, the difference in racing in the US (where even Sirling Moss was black-flagged!) and EU is obvious.

But on such valuable cars only very good and experianced drivers should sit behind the wheel.
And yes, also those very talented races made mistakes and crashed. But this does not happen so often.

Yes, I agree with you - #3061 will never be the same it was prior to that shunt.

And btw.- the unlucky driver contacted me this morning by email. Just spoke with him by phone. He is more than unhappy with himself!

 

This forum is not about arguing

 

You have got to be kidding.
Argument and debate is the essence of the Maserati animal. I say let the debate or argument as you have called it continue.
You see, even here we have two positions.
Very funny, "This forum is not about arguing"
Arakis36 who ever you are, your post reminds me of the line in the movie From Russia with love. "Gentlemen, you cannot fight in the war room"
Ciao,
FGM

 

A small comment on my behalf to all those armchair racers who for the most part have never driven a racing car in anger in their whole life:

Has it not come to your attention that motor racing is dangerous? While one can argue about the general sense or nonsense of racing old (and valuable and historically significant) cars what remains a constant in racing is that accidents happen. Experienced and fast historic racers like Willie Green and Martin Stretton have had horrible accidents in which the former was seriously injured while being overrun by his own open-wheeler while the latter broke his legs when he crashed his Bizzarrini. Not only racers from South America in yellow Ferraris crash, accidents happen also to considerate and well-versed and successful drivers:

In night qualifying - again in my Plateau 5 - Vern Schuppan, an ex-Le Mans winner, stuffed his 917 into the armco. Vincent Gaye, an experienced and tremendously fast racer, e. g. former Belgian Touring Car champion, had an accident with his 250SWB in Plateau 3 and lost his 917 a few hours later in Plateau 5 in the first lap.

Franco Meiners IS a good driver with lots of experience. He was, e. g., eighth in my grid Plateau 5 with an Alfa 33/3. It was raining every other hour during the whole weekend and the track was sometimes enormously slippery.

Regards

Wolfi

 

Wolf, I completely agree with what you say, and another factor is the mechanical integrity of racecars that have long exceeded their projected life-span. It's a risk you take when participating.

That begs a question though: Is the absolute competitiveness that is aparently present in historic racing a key component? If it's that important to win, and some go through great lengths to accomplish that, defendable? I'm not saying it isn't, but wouldn't some drivers be more at home in modern competition, where damage to material isn't such an issue?

 

Constructive arguing yes... Arguing for the sake to be right is endless, annoying and nonsense...

For your movie quote: “The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting.”
Sun Tzu, The Art of War

Enough said, lets focus on the Maserati beauties...

Saluti

 

Another photo (©Hugo Garritsen) before the mess...
My opinion is: if I had such a car I would never race it in such events. The racing career of the old warriors is over since a long time. If I want to drive very hard, I can do it with many new cars in modern races. When I crash an old (and original) car like this, I destroy history. If I crash a new car, I destroy only a new car. An event like Le Mans Classics is NOT a REAL race. The real race is the long "24 heures du Mans". So why should I drive my old car so hard?
It's just what I think... IF I had such a car.
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Agreed, 100% !!!!!