Testarossa - Compression Issue

I was interested in this 88 Testarossa, which is near where I live:

http://classicmotorsdc.com/newandusedcars/980/1845582/b8d9c4b9-93a8-4318-872e-02812ff1bf42/none/1988-Ferrari-Testarossa-Washington-DC-20015.aspx

So, I took it to Competizione and Sports Cars for a PPI. Not surprisingly, they found a number of mostly minor issues, but they also found that the compression was low (105-115). Curiously, the leak down test was really rood (4-6%). They suspected the rings were holding pressure while static, but not while the pistons were moving. They also said there was no way to be sure what was really going on without getting in to the engine, so of course I decided to walk away.

However, the dealer called me back and said they thought the rings were sticking due to lack of use, and so put a product called BG 109 in the oil. They claim the power has been restored, and that they would do another compression check (I haven’t heard what the results are).

I must say I’m highly skeptical of a fix in a bottle, and even if the compression is ok now, I’d be worried about it falling off again. So, I am inclined to stay away from this car, but thought I’d check with brain trust here just to be sure.
All thoughts and suggestions are welcome.

And here’s the VIN for future reference: ZFFSG17A5J0075739

Thanks!
JL

 

I'd have to say it very unlikely that all 12 ring sets were "stuck" in a near-identical manner, and how does the previous description of "Car runs and drives fantastic" now match up with "They claim the power has been restored"? -- is it now super-fantastic?

I'd put a greater likelihood on bad test methodology (throttle plates and/or airflow metering plates not held fully wide open during test) or cam timing not set correctly -- but the numbers are the numbers so no reason to not let the results as measured (correctly) now speak for themselves.

 

I have an 88 with about 50K miles on it and I use BG in everything engine trans, my bikes and boat, good stuff. It will free things up. I would look at how many owners there has been and their profiles also the service history closely. If things look good on that end I might go ahead, drive it with care don't push it let things loosen up naturally. No burn outs! Putting on miles cures a bunch of things. Consider doing the circuit board, fuel and coolant hoses, plus a gold connector kit. Good luck

 

Very nice looking car indeed.

According this info, the next Major should already be in two years ... so do include the reservation of $ 10K (estd. ?) in your plans ...

 

I would trust the leakdown more than the compression test, indeed. Maybe the measuring method was off, maybe they tested with a weak battery, or maybe the starter is weak.
It is always said that a test should be even across cylinders, and that's what it is. In some cases that can mean evenly worn in very high mileage cars, but that does not look to be the case here.
With Testas I would worry more about the diff and main shaft, and you don't get low compression by doing many burnouts I think.
Very nice looking example, imho. In the end that is what matters to most people.

 

Have you asked them how they carried out the test?

Compression tests are usually done on a warm engine with WOT (and a ggood battery + starter!). If they didn't do that then the results probably won't mean much. It would seem very unlikely that all 12 cyclinders were this low & yet realitively consistent/close together in what they were producing.

Or their compression tester is bad.

Either way, (and especially in light of the leakdown numbers) I'd say "bad test"

 

Thanks for the feedback.

I was indeed planning on a major in a year or two, and expecting it to be around $10k, plus the usual upgrades: SRI fuse box, gold connector kit, and hose kit, plus an updated diff (I mostly lurk here, but I’ve been doing my research!), which would add a few thousand.

I also think it’s odd that the cylinders would all be equally low (they said they did the test three times with different testers), and wondered if maybe the cam timing was off. However, Competizione did the last service as well as the PPI, and those guys have a pretty good reputation, so I would tend to trust them. Of course, they’re human beings and may have made a mistake either with the service or the test.

I’ll call the dealer tomorrow and see if they have new compression numbers.

 

Richard and Fernando are hard to beat. I cannot believe they would make a mistake on such a test. If they did the previous service/major(?) and know the car what do they think?

 

I must echo Curtis' comments about Richard and Fernando at Competizione. I have known Richard for about 10 years or so, and he has masterfully serviced my '87 TR for years, as well as two of my other cars. "Meticulous" is an understatement when describing their shop. In fact, as we speak, he is completing the engine-out major on my TR. He regularly sends me lots of photos of the process, and every little thing he finds is documented photographically and in e-mails. Here is a pic of his almost-completed service, which he just sent me. I would trust them implicitly...and run away from that '88 for sale.
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Just as a matter of interest, did he ever run a compression on your car?

 

No -- I believe he only did leakdowns. He sent me that info shortly after getting the car from me. But I don't recall compression tests.

 

I had mine done by Norwoods here in Dallas as part of the PPI - they were right around 150 each with leakdown below 6.

I concur - only 100 psi is too low if the test was done correctly.

 

I agree with James ... and we all know what the cost will be if the rings have to be changed ...

What I don't understand: are all worn / showing the same (low) compression ?

That looks normal maybe but in most engines they are not all the same worn normally... this could aslo indicate bad testing (I hope for you it is .... ) !

So .... John, when do we hear more about it ?

Don't buy it if you are not absolutely convinced !

 

The big mystery to me is how they could ALL be that low and yet the leakdown test seems to be very good on all 12...

And, I believe it was stated that it ran well and did not pump out blue smoke...

 

Beautiful motor! I would seriously address the paint on your springs and subframe before reinstalling the motor. It is an easy scuff and spray job that would take all of an hour of time and make the car look better in addition to preventing rust. You could use a "rattle can" on it and make it look like a 9.5/10 instead of it's current condition.

 

And do that with the whole framework too .....

 

The dealer did their own compression test after using BG 109, and say the results are between 140-150 (they gave the individual cylinder numbers, but I don't have them handy). That sounds more reasonable, but now I'm not sure if one of the tests was wrong, or if somehow the rings in every cylinder were stuck in just the right way that they had consistently low compression. I must say the latter seems pretty unlikely to me, and it also makes me concerned that the problem might resurface, and I certainly don't want to pay for an engine overhaul any time soon.
Anyway, given how many Testarossas there are out there, I don't think this car is worth the risk. Besides, the more I think about, the more inclined I am to hold out a little longer and get a 512TR instead!
If anyone else is interested in this car, I can say that it's pretty solid, with no evidence of any accidents, with excellent paint (very shiny, with just a few minor chips), and a clean interior (apart from some shrinkage of the dash leather). Here are the other things the PPI turned up:
Driver's window not functioning properly
LF front caliper sticking (Competizione recommended rebuilding all 4)
Steering rack loose (might just be a bad mounting, but it may need a rebuild)
Tires are dry and need to be replaced
Clutch take-up is pretty high, so that will need to be replaced soon
It also has an X-ost exhaust system, which sounded great, but also meant all the emissions equipment was missing.

 

Generally a comp test will be low on one bank of cam timing has changed, belt jumped a tooth or something like that. Car will run a bit off and also very hot on that side.

To have 12 down, means either both cam belts have jumped and timing is really bad on both banks, or look elsewhere for a reason.

 

" Besides, the more I think about, the more inclined I am to hold out a little longer and get a 512TR instead! "

Certainly the better choice !! ...
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