Countach, the ultimate supercar

My $.02 on the Canepa car and its apparent lack of interest is many of us know it was for sale for ~$130K about a year ago. I’m thinking bubble here… and I think this re-enforces Joe’s prior comments regarding the instability of the Countach market.

 

....this is what i mean!Chris.

 

Thanks, Chris, may be i did not understand well what you wrote, my english is not so good.

Prices of those cars are going up, this is a fact also here in italy.
I had a friend who wanted to buy a Contach so i did some research last year (i did not offer him my car...) here in Italy, september 2011, and i found the best was a very good 5000S with an asking price of 162 k euro. For less there were just some 25th. I went to Bestauto to see their 400S2 (listed at 180K) and i discovered it was an USA version, not in oem color and with several oil leaks... i tried to offer them 160 k euro (!!!) but they answered "No, thanks". They know prices are going up, the more they keep the car, the more they can gain.

I do not know why do you talk about my car value: i do not care what it can be, i just know what i spent for it (175 k euro up to now, but may be i will change the fuel tanks too, other 5 k euro, and it's not for sale nor is perfect. I paid it 85 k euro, delivered here by ship, with customs, taxes, search expenses, and less than three years ago. Today is impossible to have an average carbed 5000S from USA here in italy for just those bucks. If you want a car with very low flawns, you have to spend a lot of money... That "FI protoype" (...) was sold for 135 k USD and is was an USA bumpers 5000S fuel Injected! do you think a good euro carbed one can cost less than 160-170 K USD? I think NO. But it's just my opinion. Ok?

Maybe that at Canepa is a bust: i did not see it, in pictures is very good.

My be you do not know: just the four camshafts roller bearings are 3k euro...

a full set of suspension joints are 8-10 k euro, more or less...

When i was young there was an orange Miura S, preowned, for sale at a Fiat dealer close to my village: they asked 25 k USD... that was 1984. No more 25 k today, for an orange Miura S...



ciao

 

+1 !

 

Exactly!

And this is what brings the confusion & uncertainty in the Countach market.

 

Albert, let me get this correct?

You spent additional $100k on Brian's old car?

You paid $110k (85k Euro) for the car & then had to dump another 100k?

OUCH.


When it was offered to me Roy told me it was perfect.

I doubted it was so I passed and bought the red one that was also produced May of 84'.

 

A couple comments if I may:

- Looking for a "cheap" Countach is a false economy. There is no such thing as a cheap Countach. How would you like to pay? Now, or later? Would you like to have a good car, or a car with many issues? Would you like to have a car that can really be used how it should be (like yours) or a car that is waiting for the next tow-truck ride? These are some of the questions a Countach buyer today should ask. Alberto I am 100% sure you understand this fully.

- I do not think the Canepa car is to the condition of yours, at least based on the seller's own description & pictures. here is why: the Canepa car has received some servicing to make sure all the items that need attention have been attended to. But, this leaves all the other 28-year-old items that are yet to be refurbished waiting to soon need to be attended to. In the case of your car, 100% mechanical refurbishment has taken place. To my trained mind, this is a huge difference. Even the low-miles Nero/Bianco car will need most things refurbishing in order to drive it properly. The Canepa car still has the USA DOT side-markers and to be honest that makes it less desirable than a car without. The wrong-colored cam-covers are not a big deal, BUT, I always worry when the cam-covers are the wrong color because it tells me that someone has worked on the car who doesn't know what is correct-for-period in terms of original finish. Did they know what was correct-for-spec in terms of tuning the engine? Minor detail to most, but, call me crazy, it sets off small alarm bells in my head. So whilst the Canepa car is very nice, it is NOT what your car is: a completely restored to 'as-new' (or better) & a properly-tuned example. Rare as hen's teeth in my opinion.

Alberto, you have a very very nice car.

 

+1. right on the point. not so long ago, any 5000S in good conditions could be had for $100K or so. Now its like anything claimed decent has to be $150K at least.

There are 2 ways of looking at this:

1: this sharp price jump is less that 1-2 years is making people skirm. Comparing make current asking price out of control.

2: If you expand outside of the Countach world, I see cars, and many are muscle americans made in the thousands or more, reaching obscene prices too. And they have for far longer so people may be are used to them being overpriced? If you compare a Countach to those, the CT looks cheap at $150K

So the problem with the Countach does not seem they cost too much money for what you get, It seems that they tend to fluctuate too much giving the perception of a rigged market out to get you.

Case in point today: gas price.

if you find some at $3.50/gals you'll call it a deal because you wont pay $4
A few years back there was panic in the street when it reached above $3 (nobody will drive, everyone will go banckrupt etc,, etc..).

It's the same gas. difference is that now it is stable at close to $4 and we experience the fog in slowly boiling water syndrome.

 

that is an interesting way to look at it. Never thought about it in thoses terms. So what you say it that a period correct car is a safer bet and potentially worth more money not only because of originality, but also because the probability of knowledgeable people working on it and not screwing up is higher.
I guess that would also relate to the type of mods: Mechanical improvement or cosmetic hack. In this case the change falls into "cosmetic hack". But in other case it may actually be a mechanical improvement. The bottom issue is who has done the job and what purpose it serves.

 

Talk about the pot calling the kettle black

 

Send me a PM...

ciao

 

Its a factor to consider, NOT a conclusion or generalization. A question that needs to be answered. A clue that the car has received work to the engine.

My next series of questions after seeing those cam-covers would be, when was the engine out, why, and WHO did the work?

 

that was an outstanding buy.. I know because I was looking into 5000S a couple of years ago.
IMO I think that may be you should explain more that you seem to be overly detailled about fixing issues and that drives the price sometimes unecessarily. I am sure you could have had a very nice car for less money but from your post, you always took the extra step to get the top job for your own satisfaction.

i am restoring a daily car for my daughter for next year and I also tend to be like that. I find myself trying to replace parts with improved one, when all the part only need fixing (i.e: panel door replacement vs repair, seat replacement instead of fixing just the damaged leather...)...

 

No, I think he simply restored it fully, that's all. With some adventures along the way...

 

Well..I guess not Joe...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Lay
Joe, that was not necessary. Ever thought that if you stop being an ass, Roy might do the same, vice versa.

Yea. Tried that. Didn't work. Shall we give it a try again? Sure. Lets see how it goes, ok?
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www.joesackey.com

 

I want that my Countach looks and works like it was when new, that is why it costed so much.

I fixed almost everything on that car. Here in Europe i saw some excellent restore better than mine, 150+ k euro each, but just on LP400 cars. Mine is 91 K euro: car is very good, now. I do not want anything that is less than very good, i prefer not to own it rather than have something bad looking or bad working. My old 911 Carrera MY 1987 is even in better condition than the CT.
The day i will not have anymore the money to keep the CT flawnless, i will seel it immediately!

ciao

 

Typically, it would look like this, and at production even the "Lamborghini" logo would not be filed, so the cam-covers would be all black
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I was turned down in the 90's.

Glad I didn't make a 100k+ mistake. =)

 

On the Canepa car, some mods have been made. Not a big deal & chances are that all is good, but its worth following up and seeing when & why.
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My old Countach that is now Alberto's was not perfect but a good driver. I thoroughly enjoyed it and regret selling it....and I know that Alberto probably regretted buying it at one point! It needed several cosmetics fixed...which is what I stated when I posted it for sale here on Fchat and why I sold it for $92K. I was also not a huge fan of black/red. The car always ran great for me and even had Evans work on the car...new oil lines, AC lines and several other things ($20K+) but when it finally reached Alberto it did not run correctly. I am not exactly sure what happened between the USA and Italy but no doubt something did. I should have taken a picture of the mileage when it shipped out and then had Alberto check it when it arrived. I do remember it taking way too long to finally arrive.
Alberto has now made the car absolutely fantastic and I am happy that it found the perfect home. I have looked at the Canepa Countach before and it is not even close to the condition that Alberto's car is now in.

Brian

 

nice to hear it from the Horses's mouth...thanks Brian..and FYI Triple-X, you may ask Brian..my EXACT pay on the consignment sale was a HUGH $2,500.00 which is my standard fee for a consignement car and at 25% of the consignment/broker fee's of other's in this field....as they have posted.

 

At the last Countach meeting a Fuji Speedway, a good time was had by all
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Agreed.

 

Nice. Probably a dumb question but is that smurf blue an original/factory color?

 

I was just going throw some photos...

man this was a great car..glad it is in a good home now..
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