THE F70 (LaFerrari) Thread

1967 was a magic year. There were no smog requirements and the only safety requirements were front seatbelts. Full Chat Le Mans cars up until 68 were basically road legal and still are. My MK-IV, P 3/4, 412P and Lola are all street registered and street drivable. Corvettes, XKE's, MGB's, Austin Healey's were all street/track cars. Cobra's, Shelby Mustang's were street/track. I'd have to say the last Ferrari was probably the 275GTB. They were fine on the road (I drove mine 65K miles even took it skiing) and also drove it on the track a lot. After 67 came the Daytona which when it went racing was modified into a Comp version. I used to race my 275 GTB on street tires and drive it to and from the track.

 

For more than just cars.
Everything went to stink after 67.

 

Who knows but in theory yes.

 

Well I wish you all the best... Would be so amazing to be apart of something like this
Simon

 

If we are able to keep racing you guys are always welcome in our lounge!

 

Thank you... Where there's a will there's a way

 

Probably the only way I'll ever get a hat.

 

Knowing you, you would probably finish 1st overall!

 

+1

 

I wonder how much of those 600kg downforce is due to the rear wing( my grandma uses ironing boards better looking) and due to the side skirts, front lip....and so..those are not sci fi aero...there is no magic.

If i look back at all ferrari's supercars i see magic. The magic consist in creating a beautiful shape that works also as +200mph tool....

Cars were never just a tool, not even low cost ones. Aesthetics are a deal breaker even on a 10$k car..

A F40 is purposefully looking, if you put the P1 next to a F40, F50, Enzo, its like hearing a comerial song among 3 love songs....



you dont have to sacrifice the beauty for performance. Ferrari is the proof. If you put sliks, side skirts, front lips, huge rear wing on a enzo you will have the same results

 

Aesthetics= hugely subjective. yet you've somehow been able to objectively quantify it and apply as deemed correct..cut and dry...ultimately, allowing you great insight into what has 'magic', what has soul, and those things that do not. so, you sir, are the most amazing high priest of auto design and engineering. the most amazing in all of auto design histories in fact.

 

But he does have a point, right? Adding a huge rearwing, hydraulic or not, is pretty old school. The McLaren F1 was immensly innovative. Not sure this one is as well. Allthough it does have some very nice features.

 

Aesthetics are not subjective. Like or dislike is subjective. But beauty is not subjective

Proporitons are as obejective as math can be, together with the design at a sculptural level and details are part of cars design.

Shapes should be in relation each to other, at a level that can be quantified by formulas and math. Phi and the golden number shold sound familiar.


Aesthetics is a scientifically discipline. Arhitecture, product design, and other disciplines are based not on eye of the customer, but on the education and on the training of professionals

 

While this holds merit to some (very small) degree, aesthetics remain subjective. Ever heard of the saying "beauty is in the eye of the beholder"

You can perhaps say more people will find a certain design more beutifull then the other, but I can assure you that even car's you find the most god awful ugly some one will absolutely love...

Beauty is about the soul, and if the design moves your soul. And since there are as meny souls as there are people, there are just as many definitions of beautiful..

ART is not a science, it's ART. If it was science we'd have computer AIs designing everything..

 

Fractals.............................................

 

Nope. LMP1 cars look the way they do for a reason. The P12's wing/airbrake/DRS is much more advanced that any engineering on any Ferrari road car ever built.

The Enzo's movable rear spoiler was very poorly engineered and many of the actuators have failed. The price Ferrari charges for the actuator is absurd ($14K) and I've helped several Enzo owners find a much stronger actuator for a LOT less. The rear upper chassis braces on the Enzo are very poorly engineered and Ferrari's fix is as well. The proper engineering brings those bars to the bulkhead not a thin carbon fiber lip that cracks. The Enzo shocks have an inherent engineering flaw that causes them to over heat when used vigorously on the track. Hopefully Ferrari's engineering will be a lot better on the F70 but as someone who has corrected a lot of Ferrari's engineering on their road and Competizione cars for over 40 years (Which in some cases Ferrari has adopted, 308 GTBi cooling for example) I have my doubts.

 

You seem to forget the many failures of McLaren road cars. Also comparing the aero of a 10 year old car to that of a future model is hardly fair. Let's wait and see the aero solutions of the new Enzo; that will be a fair comparisson. Finally, engineering is much more than just aero.

 

You are right about some elements of their engineering. Just look at their F1 cars before Ron's fanatic attention to details took hold along the pit lane. Now they are a match. Hopefully this attitude will be evidenced in the F70. Now that there is serious competition, they know they can do nothing less as no longer can they just trade on the badge. Good for all of us and thank you Mclaren.

 

But when i look at a mclaren I see magic. When i look at a pagani i see magic. Where you see beauty in a "beautiful shape that works as a +200mph tool" i see it in something completely different, i see it in the engineering and craftsmanship. The way a zonda has all its components built specifically for each car, bolts and badges of the highest quality made from the finest materials... My point is that sure you can sit there and say the p1 is ugly, but that doesn't mean that everyone else does. You are free to like whatever you want, and you don't have to bash everyone else who disagrees with you.

ps- i've never seen a better ironing board than on the wing of the p1.

 

Overall the shape appears more curvy compared to the angles of the Enzo. Reminds me of the difference between the F2001 and the F2004 F1 cars.

-F

 

Beauty is always subjective and if one word describes the hyper car its "subjective". They all represent different things to different people. For some its the looks, for some its the sound of the engine, for other track speed, for other its the experiences and the connection one feels when driving the car.

Comparing these cars to me is pretty much like comparing ramp models in Milan and New York and yes you guessed, that too is subjective!

 

I hope you don't mind me asking but with these negatives things about Ferrari why have you been buying so many of them and why race with a car that is based (although only partially) on a Ferrari? ;-)

 

Because when Ferrari released the Enzo , he would have to wait almost 10 years to buy a new Mclaren....

 

Why do you hate Ferrari so much..

 

+1