Warm up before 2nd gear?????

On test driving a few daytonas, I heard conflicting views on whether to wait a handful of miles before using 2nd gear (avoiding by going 1st to 3rd). I'd be interested to hear other's thoughts on the practice.

 

Absolutely correct, wait at least 20 mins of driving until 2nd is available! 1st to 3rd until then.

David

 

Its the second gear synchro that is most often slow so the other strategy is to start in second then shift up Lots of threads here and on Tom Yang about gear oil alternatives that might help some M

 

This is a long-standing idiosyncrasy with Ferrari from the vintage cars through even some fairly recent models. It's best to let it warm up. This Brad Paisley video touches on the subject:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9mpDAJOPac[/ame]

Towards the end of the video, Brad drives William Shatner's 355 and complains about 2nd gear being a bit rough. Shatner replies "You got it into second gear? How did you do that".

 

Out of ignorance more than anything else, I let it warm up and don't drive until I see some water temp; stick to modest revs and don't use second until I see some oil temp; and always drive it enough to bring it up to operating temp, even if doing so forces me to take the long way to Starbucks.

Interesting first post, and welcome. May all your test driving lead to purchasing.

 

If I'm just cruising I tend to shift straight from 1st to 3rd anyway even when the oil is warmed up enough. The Daytona has more than enough torque to cope.

 

My gearbox has just been rebuilt, and has no issues at all changing to second when cold, I Just have to be gentle with it, double declutching helps, and sounds good to.

 

I do not engauge second until the oil temp starts to move. About 5 - 10 minutes.

 

Grant out of interest what gearbox oil are you using?

 

My gauge doesn't move much at all.

 

With all due respect, but like so many things automotive, if something doesn't work as intended, it's probably past due for service or replacement.
There seem to be plenty of vintage cars, including Daytonas and other Ferraris, out there that have never received proper service or maintenance in many or most of their mechanical components (including trans-axles) during their multi-decade (multi-ownership?) life span.
This, more than often, appears common with many "low miles" and "exotic" examples, especially when (each subsequent ?) owner chooses to omit funding for any major service with simple reasoning of "Well, I don't drive it that much anyway".
The bottom line, I'm sorry to point out, is that avoiding by going from 1st to 3rd is just ignoring the problem.
Timo

 

Timo; I do not think the question was if the gearbox will shift into 2nd when cold, but rather why abuse it and create unecessary wear. In my experience, all transaxle Ferraris up to at least 328's benefit from skipping 2nd for at least 5 miles when being driven from dead cold. The same goes for Lamborghinis and Ford GT's. Why put additional strain on the synchros? Have you tried to buy new 2nd gear syncro rings lately? I am not sure they are currently available.

As to gearbox oils, in my experience, using a brand name synthetic will reduce shift effort about 50 % in all Ferrari gearboxes, hot and cold. We use it in all the street and vintage racing Ferrari gearboxes and transaxles. Makes a dramatic difference in Lamborghinis also, as they tend to be stiff shifting by nature.

 

Fully agree with you, fully sorted out cars are the real reference.
Having said that, and having had several trans axle and gearbox serviced/ rebuilt, and i think close to a dozen engine fully done, many to new crankshaft,,,it is nice to be soft with those unless, like race engines in period, we intend to rebuilt them after evey race/ outing!

 

I am sure every component is available ...been through it..at a price..

 

Dyke,
Thank you very much for taking time to correct me with your undoubtedly greater experience in these regards and I agree with the benefit of less strain during cold shifting.
I guess I didn't pay enough attention to OP's question, but instead made a common mistake by jumping to conclusion and went on to rant my views regarding this often heard complaint about "worn-out 2nd gear synchros" in Daytonas and other similar issues. I'll just step away from the keyboard, go back to the shop and continue working on the two examples I'm trying to get ready for the Nationals in Palm Springs.
Timo

 

Timo: It was not a matter of 'correcting" you, as I am in agreement with your statement. If the synchros are worn out, and a change to synthetic oil doesn't help, than the only solution is a gearbox rebuild. Skipping 2nd when cold will help to minimize the continued damage, but it won't fix the worn out synchros.

Good luck with the car show prep jobs.

 

What is the preferred oil for a daytona transaxle? Are limited slip additives recommended?
Ed

 

I warm up the car till the radiator is quite warm to touch before driving it. Seems my routine, though benefiting the engine, it may not do the gearbox much good. Just so I walk away from this having learned something, are we saying that even after a warm up routine like mine one should avoid the second gear for 10 minutes? Thanks.

john

 

^ yes
Ed

 

Cheers for all your responses and gives me clear direction on what to do going forwards i.e. wait until I've driven for 5 or so miles before using 2nd.

 

John: On front engined Ferraris, I have generally found no real need to skip 2nd when cold. However, your warm up procedure, while good for the engine will not help the gearbox very much. While there will be some heat transfer through the bellhousing to the gearbox, only actual driving will put heat into the gearbox. We have to deal with this issue on the race cars all the time. While we warm the engine enough to actually achieve some oil temp before we send the car out on to the track, we must always remind the driver that the gearbox and rear axle are still cold.

Daytona transaxle oil: Name brand 75/90 wt synthetic plus a tube of limited-slip additive for a full oil change. You can use a straight 90 wt synthetic if you wish.

 

Anyone else recall Richard Hammond mentioning the second gear issue in the Portofino to St Tropez Top Gear episode?

 

Watch at about 3.30. Beautiful Ferrari Daytona!!!

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBBy-4tnWoM[/ame]

If you watched the first part you may want to see the second part.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bu7On1rNo3w&feature=context-shows&list=SL[/ame]

 

Sorry Matt. Can't help.
I have just checked the invoice and it just says 5L of gear oil. It was rebuilt and set up in the car by Peter Higgins. From memory they had great difficulty getting some of the parts and the parts that where not available from Ferrari had to be made or a suitable equivalent item found.
This is the box of used parts that where left over after the rebuild!
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Just a lttle note, the gearbox is a transaxel type on the Daytona, so it is not that close to the bellhousing.