Countach, the ultimate supercar

OK I've suited up and I'm gonna jump in the pit.

JDBQV I see what your saying about this car, its injection, and meeting regulations. What is foggy to me is before this, all cars, (not Lambo's) ran carbs and were U.S. legal. Why would cars that are being targeted as preinjection be considered noncompliant with EPA(Lambo's). Are you saying this CT was the first to pass the emmisions test without setting it up for emmisions and then going back and resetting it up to drive it?


Lets control the bickering and talk cars not tear'em apart.

 

First of all let me say that I have no financial interest in the car in question, in fact I had an opportunity to buy it before anyone else and I passed on it. But the facts are the facts. To answer your question, yes many cars that ran carbs passed EPA emission standards but not 400+ horsepower Lamborghinis that were produced in Italy and never sold in the USA. Yes you could buy a 1982 Chevrolet "pick the model " with 165 HP from your local Chevy dealer and it was EPA legal of course. The emissions produced by a Countach "because of the carbs" was far to high to pass US EPA regulations. Yes there were "GRAY MARKET" cars brought into the US "Rain Man Style" that passed phony DOT and EPA hurdles. I know how it was done, first hand. Believe it or not, once you imported a car from another country that was not "built for the US" all you needed to do was send in a picture of the US required alterations, IE pictures of steel reinforcement bars in the doors, seats belts, cat convertors, bumpers ect,,,,and a report of the emissions to the Government and if everything added up "witch it always did" you received the papers you needed to title the car and make it legal. You also needed to apply a permanent decal on the door jamb stating the Importer, the date of Import, the GVW, tire pressure ect. Once you did one car you could do another 50 cars off the same pictures. My point is, all most all those cars were IMPORTED illegally because they never had all the work done. It was a huge business for some people and I personally know of several people that made MILLIONS DURING THAT TIME PERIOD. The car in question was the first car that was transported to Michigan for real EPA testing as a pilot for future cars and after 2 attempts it passed and was the first EPA approved Countach in the US. Trefor Thomas and Jasjit Rarewala worked hard to make this the first "LEGITIMATE" Countach in the country so they could become the sole Importers for all US legal Lamborghinis. Unfortunately for them the factory did not bite on there project and soon after went bankrupt. Chrysler came in and purchased Lamborghini and basically told those guys to get lost, we have are own fuel injection system and have no use for you. Unfortunately, both have since passed away and cannot tell the full story. The car we are speaking about had no connection with the factory but was in fact the first real legitimate US legal Countach ever registered in this country, My original point was that I think that has a value of witch I am not certain, but i think the current owner is making a mistake by converting the car back to it's original carbureted state. I'm sure Joe Sackey AKA "THE COUNTACH GOD" will post some Gray Market ILLEGAL cars soon to try and salvage his lame argument. It must be a lot of work to be perfect Joe.

 

When I saw that interior I realized who owns this hamster:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOgvWAj9ugw[/ame]

 

As I stated earlier, GRAY MARKET cars that were never actually tested but were given "Release of EPA obligations" based upon mailed in documents. I have about 27 of those myself from gray market Testarossa, 930 turbos and 328I Ferraris. Please take note of the word LEGAL in my prior post.

 

This is a GRAY MARKET temporary tag so the vehicle can be temporarily driven and is only good for 60 DAYS !!!

 

Thanks for the reply,
Without knowing this cars recent history, my view on this car being put back to carbs may simply be for attracting a buyer. Going for the more fimiliar look, sound, and performance that people are more comfortable with when seeing a CT. Could be the owner sees it as a fun project to get the car to its original state, and set the fuel injection system aside for safe keeping in the case its historic value will come to light some day? I find the cars history very interesting, but personaly wouldn't add value to it for the inj. system now sitting a box. I'm not a historian or collector that's why I feel this way. I hope the owner does preserve all of the hardware and has documented everything for the cars history. This CT has a unique history and is rare because of it, but I'm not sure its a diamond in the rough. I also don't invest in cars to profit because I'm usually wrong.

 

You should know as well as anyone that the government has seized and has forced owners to export some of these cars out of the country many times. Why would they do that Joe ? Because although these cars had the paperwork like you posted, they in fact never really had the work performed on them to make them US legal. Having a letter that says the car is legal and having a car that can actually pass the test are 2 different things. The car in question was the first Countach to ever go to Ann Arbor for confirmatory testing and pass. Post all the bogus letters you want and keep trying to beat a dead horse, but you are wrong. And that's ok.

 

Peter,
I agree with your statement of having some added value and keeping the car as is.
I personally care less if that care is the 1st EPA car or not. No value in that. The value I put in this car is that it is my understanding it went back to the factory for review to have an injected system made there and it has been used as the basis for the factory injected car post 82.
So my question is : is that a proven fact? if it is, that car had an influence of the injection developement of the CT and cant be totally ignored.

 

I think that throughout 2012 the members and owners on both forums have stated how they feel about this car. The lack of sale at various prices have proven what potential buyers thinks. Hence, the guy still has the car.
It's just not that important.

 

Boy oh boy, jdbqv sure does sound like bradjohnstone lololol.

 

Do you think the Candy Apple comment is just the seller being retarded do you think it is a repaint?

The interior is shocking how in the hell could it be that beat up but no sense in saving it just replace the entire interior and while I'm at it make the dash black not that brown ugh.

The color isn't too bad I kind of like it but it’s hard to say if it’s a repaint, I do not even know if that color was available for 87 my. The manufacture plates don't have any overspray on them but I have no idea if those rivets are original so they could have actually removed them for a repaint, most people are not that through doing a repaint they will just mask it off.

 

Right from the horses mouth:
The US front bumper was removed for a cleaner look along with a candy red paintjob.

Sounds like a repaint to me.

I only want to hear the word "candy red" if it is on a customized 1960's or 70's van or vette.

 

That car sounded like a good value at first.

 

I agree Peter. This cars' value was talked about extensively last year with many members giving their opinions... We didn't take a poll, but my memory is telling me that by far Most people thought the car would be worth a lot more when put back to the way it left the factory and putting its F.I. history on the back shelf.... a unique story but that's it. I think the owner after not finding any value with this "history" now has decided to do what the Lambo community has suggested and seemed to mostly agree about. The question left is.... will it be done properly....? If it is then i think it would be a great car to get, but if it isn't then it will be weeks of replies about how it should have just been left alone. Personally i hope he stayed in touch with the person that had all the original carbs... he chimed in at one point.

 

Joe and jdbqv, i appreciate you guys are hashing out a different topic,
"first legal EPA, DOT" etc. but from a government stance, i thought it might be good to mention, or clarify/ask, that LEGALLY it doesn't matter anymore. With the age of these cars they are all exempt now from meeting any of these requirements right? I just don't want to see a lp400 or 1975 Ferrari owner start to worry about the government asking to ship his car out.