BBC: Formula 1's Greatest Drivers of All Time (Top 20)

the top 5 will be in some order:

Fangio
Senna
Schumacher
Prost
Stewart

the fact that Schumacher is still driving is incredible and we all should recgonize that fact that we are seeing one of the ALL time GREATS Still out there.

 

how many drivers won the WDC in a car they built ?

 

One.

 

Yeah watching Andretti around the new Austin track was pretty darn awesome.

Oh wait, that's not what you meant?

Sorry, yes of course Prost testing a modern F1 was truly spectacular.

 

I am very late to this thread, will weigh in nonetheless. Glad someone remembers Tazio, a driver who won in anything available to be driven. Mind you, all of this, from the start of the thread, is pure opinion. For me, anyone not placing Juan Manuel Fangio at the top simply doesn't know. I'll post later a view on Fangio I've written elsewhere. But I've got a burr under my saddle for the greatest driver never to win the WDC, Sir Stirling Moss. While I put Jim Clark right there with him, maybe above maybe below, with great respect IMO Sir Jackie Stewart, with all of his championships, wasn't Stirling's equal. Nor were Prost or Senna. The 1955 Mille Miglia was the greatest road race in history, 1000 miles over ordinary Italian roads, from Brescia to Brescia via Rome and the Raticosa and Radicofani mountain passes. Stirling and his navigator, motoring correspondent Denis Jenkinson, drove the course several times before the race, Jenks taking copious notes of speeds to reach on straights, anything that wasn't as it seemed and reduced them to an 18 ft rollof paper in an aluminium box with a perspex window, the information from which he passed to Stirling by hand signals. The previous all-time record average speed for winning car in the Mille Miglia was 89mph. Moss destroyed the record by an average of almost 10 mph, averaging 98 mph for the 1000 miles. And if there had been no Fangio and Stirling had been willing to accept a Ferrari seat, he would likely have won four or five WDC's. I'm perfectly aware that they are big 'ifs' but there you are, opinions again!

 

I think a reasonable case could be made that Prost’s start in Japan in ’90 was also/equally premeditated.

Consider this, Senna said before the race that based on his perceived injustice of the pole on the wrong side of the track, that the first turn would be his. Prost was not surprised by anything in that first corner, save perhaps that Senna was true to his word.

Prost had Balestre on his side for years, and as good as he was (and I fully agree he is one of the greats) Prost had great cars under him and an influential force behind him in a arguably corrupt, and certainly megalomanical, Balestre.

Perhaps Senna, the naïve man that he was, was literally “driven” into a corner where he felt no way out of the injustice and felt compelled to make a very dangerous and premeditated decision. The fact that we are talking about both sides of this more than 20 years later is a testimony to how high the stakes were back then.

In a way, knowing what we know now, it is hard for me not to admire Senna. Certainly hard to argue the man wasn’t committed. Unfortunately, it is also not that much of a surprise that he didn’t survive his incredibly talented career.

Good thing the best driver qualification didn't include surviving a career. Also, full respect to Clark. But I don't agree that a mistake necessarily results in a crash. Exceeding the car's limits and losing temporary control only means a crash depending on where it happens, and sometimes some good or bad luck.

Comparing eras, my opinion is that the early days of F1 and before allowed drivers more influence as difference makers. Modern F1 is more of a team effort where equipment is the limiting factor. I agree it is just mental gymnastics to compare drivers across eras, but fun!

 

You know you have a HUGE point.

Stirling Moss, Jim Clark, Tazio Nouvalari are some of the greats, however when looking at the the best ever, or top 5 I stand by my estimation....

and really Jackie Stewart in my opinion takes #1 - not for his driving - which was spectacular in a time when guys died with regularity, but that he has promoted and done more for Racing, driving, cars and the sport in general than anyone else.

Stewart was a house hold name in the USA back in the 70's,
He brought "busienss" to driving - made it a legitimate business
He raised the bar with professionalism in driving
Safety - circuits and cars - completely brought that into focus - and not just for racers, but seat belt, crash structures for all cars
Tire & car development - Goodyear & Ford he showed that as a driver you can have an impact after racing.
set up the insurance and pension fund for mechanics etc...

to me that is more than anyone else has done especially Stirling Moss et all...

 

Totally agree.

And that cretin Mosley called former triple world champion Jackie Stewart a 'certified halfwit', it makes my blood boil.

 

Thread is greatest driver, not greatest ambassador. Not taking anything away from Steward, mind, but you're comparing 2 different things.

 

As with all these discussions it's the imprecision of the parameters that makes the debate.

 

Shame Stewart still hangs around as a snooze-inducing mouthpiece now. He's kinda like the senile grandfather at the dinner table telling war stories...who cares...

 

You are kidding, right?

 

No, not at all. Guys like Stewart and Lauda were great drivers in their day and have done a lot for the sport. Unfortunately, they have tried whatever means necessary to stay in the spotlight and will shoot their mouths off anytime a microphone is put in their faces, which leads to some comical opinions/statements. As they age, I believe that we have WAY too much "back in my day" drivel from them and they rarely bring anything noteworthy to the table. Instead, they are overcritical about many things and hold a "holier than thou" appreach when it comes to their own careers. Other greats have simply gone on with their lives but these two insist on soaking up the spotlight as much as possible. Why? Arrogance? Ignorance? Who knows?

Here's some recent examples of Stewart's senility:

-Is quoted as saying that Michael Schumacher is "not a real racer" and "never was." (Stewart is beyond jealous of MS's achievements and that is very obvious).

-Took it upon himself to offer his "services" to mentor Grosjean. I found this absurd, and apparently so did Grosjean, who smartly turned him down.

Watching the Senna documentary was satisfying when Jackie was being super critical to Senna over his driving and Senna simply owned him. You could see on Senna's face how tiring/annoying Stewart must be to talk to (and hear him blather on, criticizing this and that) and he let him have it. "If you don't go for a gap that exists, then you are no longer a racing driver."

Sure shut old Jackie up

 

I adore Lauda and his no-prisoners attitude while I'm not so hot about Stewart: As the head of the BRDC he was the biggest obstacle to get Silverstone upgraded.

I'm no fan of Hill the racer but have to say as BRDC head he is now doing a great job

 

Hill seems like such a conservative guy. It's hard for me to imagine it's the same guy that won a WDC.

 

I think that there's a bit more to the Silverstone issue.
The "upgrades"allowed the meet to continue but weren't aimed at helping the average fan. Was that what A.N.Other on about?

 

Thanks for posting. But like all lists, each one have our own take as to the final order. For me, don't care for Hamilton but he should be ranked better than Gilles. Gilles was fast, but reckless. Fittipaldi should also have a better ranking.

But Alonso is only #10? Don't like him, but I can not think of but a handful of drivers that can podium with a crap car. Who could be #1-#9?

Of course Schumacher, Senna, Stewart, Prost, Lauda, Moss, Clark, Fangio. Even Hunt delivered. But there only two names here that are better than Alonso.

And what, no Damon Hill? ;}

 

I hope the Hill bit is a joke.

Regarding gilles Lewis... Lewis is rickless as well. Gilles was something special. Still, the bit when he was 11 seconds quicker than anyone else in I think Watkins Glen, that speaks by far for itself, regardless of what era. Only Schumachers 5 seconds a lap quicker at barcelona in 1996 (in an inferior car) can compare.

 

LH is not as wreckless as he used to be. He has not caused serious physical harm to anyone, including himself. Unfortunetely, Gilles did.

And yes, the Damon thing was a joke. I had to Google him as I could not remember his first name.

 

That's how we won his WDC.

 

Different era's et all.

 

I think its a shame that you dont have any appreciation for one of the greatest ever in Racing.

ask any driver about Jackie Stewart and they will have an appreciation for him. I would suggest at his age today he is a better driver than some current professionals... and most definately yourself.

The interview with Senna was prompted by Senna taking Prost off the track on purpose, and then denying it... later he did acknowledge he do it on purpose. Stewart was 100% right with that question and simply pointed out a key factor in how Senna drove... he simply had too many mistakes for being the "Best In the World" ... if you look at Senna's record, he's had lots of coming together and later in his career he had this "I'm Senna just get out of the way" attitude... I've been fortunate to have met both in person and seen them drive in anger, both were excellent in their day, but Stewart was able to analyze what was happening and why... and be able to talk about it. Reas some of his books and learn about being a better driver.... PS show some respect as well!

 

I'll stake it on driving as well. Look at his record % of races won vs. starts... still pretty amazing. then factor in the kind of cars - F-1, Sports cars, Can Am, indy, saloons, etc... a lost of the other dirvers out there just did one category and that was it. when you look at the driving record and then add all the other stuff... pretty hard to argue against it.

 

I hear you.

He was pretty damn good.

Then there was Jimmy. Quite simply head & shoulders above all of 'em IMO.......

Cheers,
Ian

 

Another one taken way too soon.